100 yard shooting what would you chose?

[Newtosavage]

Get yourself a good gun rest, this will remove you from the shot & let you know how good your gun is without adding your shooting mistakes to the mix. If you can't shoot one hole 5 round groups from 100 yds your barrel is junk.

Or, it's the wrong load for the barrel you do have.

 

[Buzznrose]

I don't really care about tiny groups from the bench. If it were me, I'd invest in components and practice until you can hit a 4" plate or clay pigeon offhand.

A gun that shoots 1" with a shooter that can hold reasonable offhand shots at 100 yards is more interesting than a 1/4" gun with a shooter that can't hit a 5 gallon bucket offhand.

But my opinion ain't the popular one I expect.

I’m with Bazoo. Shooting off a bench with a precision grade rifle at 100 yards seems boring to me. Get the ammo that works best and can shoot sub MOA and then learn to shoot it without a bench. Not necessarily saying unsupported…but maybe prone, seated on the ground, kneeling, etc.

 

[horsemen61]

I’m with Bazoo. Shooting off a bench with a precision grade rifle at 100 yards seems boring to me. Get the ammo that works best and can shoot sub MOA and then learn to shoot it without a bench. Not necessarily saying unsupported…but maybe prone, seated on the ground, kneeling, etc.

10 plus lb rifle is not something I want to try to freehand and if your not into small groups or precision shooting from a bench then start your own thread and leave mine alone thank you

 

[Varminterror]

first shot, cold and clean barrel is much more important for me

It’ll be the only shot like it. Gross.

 

[12Bravo20]

It’ll be the only shot like it. Gross.

That has always been my experience with clean barrels too. My Savage Model 12 308 POI is the same cold bore or hot bore, but only if the barrel is already fouled. The first shot is always off with a clean bore.

 

[Varminterror]

@horsemen61

If

1) You’ve exhausted conventional load development efforts and the precision shared above is as good as it gets,

AND

2) You don’t have any other physical objection to the current stock and trigger,

THEN

Buy a new barrel from Shilen, Proof, or Krieger - Northland Shooter’s Supply is a great resource if you don’t want to go maker-direct. It’s pretty dang difficult to shoot smaller than a custom barreled Savage action. Fast, smoother, and more reliable feeding, sure, but it’s not so easy to be more precise.

BUT, IF

You have any issues with stock fit, trigger management, etc, then you might be better served looking at a tip-to-tail custom option.

 

[Walkalong]

Shooting off a bench with a precision grade rifle at 100 yards seems boring to me.

Not if you are trying to do this consistently, it's more apt to drive you insane than bore you.


Because for every 3 or 4 groups (5 shots) like the one on the left..............Sigh......... really ruins an aggregate.

 

[Bazoo]

Those are amazing groups walkalong. The .398 is a flop I take it.

And here I am, happy if I can hit a coke can at 75 yards offhand with a 22 or a 30-30.

 

[Bazoo]

So I got a dumb question. How come the groups y'all show are to the left or right or up or down of the center. Why don't you adjust your scope so the poi and poa coincide better?

 

[horsemen61]

So I got a dumb question. How come the groups y'all show are to the left or right or up or down of the center. Why don't you adjust your scope so the poi and poa coincide better?

My guess is it will mess with the aiming point

 

[Bazoo]

@horsemen61

It wasn't my intent to derail your thread with my initial comment. I didn't realize you were asking about improving your already great tiny group shooting. I mistook the tone of your initial post. When you asked what should I do, I throwed my opinion out like a shot in the dark not considering it might drift your thread. My apologies.

 

[Nature Boy]

So I got a dumb question. How come the groups y'all show are to the left or right or up or down of the center. Why don't you adjust your scope so the poi and poa coincide better?

So you don’t shoot out your aiming point

 

[Turkeytider]

That has always been my experience with clean barrels too. My Savage Model 12 308 POI is the same cold bore or hot bore, but only if the barrel is already fouled. The first shot is always off with a clean bore.

That`s apparently common. Obviously with a hunting situation you may well only get one shot. I clean the barrel on my .223 after each range session ( too old to change from what I had drilled into me by my father, LOL! ), so I needed to see where my hunting rounds landed first shot out of a clean barrel. Both loads, a Nosler and a Hornady V-max, were zeroed to 1" high at 100 yards. I guess I`m fortunate that BOTH hit right at zero first shot out of a cold, clean barrel. Other rounds I`ve shot haven`t done that.

 

[Buzznrose]

10 plus lb rifle is not something I want to try to freehand and if your not into small groups or precision shooting from a bench then start your own thread and leave mine alone thank you

Got it.

 

[Frostbite]

I would shoot the original barrel until it's shot out, then buy a better one and repeat. As for shooting tiny groups, I like that. If someone starts from zero (but knows how to shoot, has other rifles), I suggest to buy a rifle built for the purpose.

 

[horsemen61]

@horsemen61

It wasn't my intent to derail your thread with my initial comment. I didn't realize you were asking about improving your already great tiny group shooting. I mistook the tone of your initial post. When you asked what should I do, I throwed my opinion out like a shot in the dark not considering it might drift your thread. My apologies.

No apology necessary the internet is a tough place to read something for context thank you for the compliment on my shooting I want to be a good shot always trying to get better always trying to learn

 

[Txhillbilly]

It’s the Boyd’s Laminate stock it came with, the trigger is the savage accutrigger I’ve adjusted it down pretty low as far as the scope it’s a Luepold V3XI 6.5-20x40 with the fine target Duplex I’ve shot some great groups with this rifle I guess I was just hoping that if I slapped on a custom barrel it would be like hitting the easy button is all but like most things in life it’s not that simple

Glass bedding or pillar bedding the action can improve your groups, as well as playing with the torque settings of the action screws. Torque the front screw to 45 in lbs, and start the rear screw at 20 in lbs, shoot a group, and then go up in 5 in lb increments and see where it shoots best.
You can also change out the accu-trigger spring to the target trigger spring for even lower trigger pull weight. Gun Shack sells the spring for $7.

You have a decent scope / reticle, so that shouldn't be an issue.

Do you seat your bullets out near the lands, or do you seat them at SAAMI specs?

 

[d2wing]

Update here are some groups I shot today it’s not as consistent as I want View attachment 1057829View attachment 1057830 View attachment 1057831

Is it your gun, ammo. scope or you? I don't know enough to determine that. Is your barrel clean? Tried other ammo? If you can eliminate any problems with all of those and are looking for more accuracy a barrel change might be the ticket.

 

[jmorris]

Tiny groups at 100 yards, it would be in 6mm PPC and have a 2 oz trigger with at least 36x.

If by “tiny” the intent is the smallest single hole that all the bullets will pass through.

 

[DMW1116]

Are you into shooting with iron sights? If the range was limited to 100 yards and a set were available for the rifle, I would consider setting it up with aperture front and rear sights. Then work toward matching my scoped groups without the aid of magnification. I’ve done it with my scoped AR and my A4gery with 20” barrel, once.

The group around the penny and the group on the right of the Shootnsee were the same load from my 16” barrel and 20” barrel respectively. The group in the left was a bad load for the 20” rifle. For entertainment purposes I love shooting iron sights, but they’re not for everyone. They probably won’t be for me either in a few more years so I’m going to try to wear out my front post by looking at it really hard while I can.

 

[horsemen61]

Glass bedding or pillar bedding the action can improve your groups, as well as playing with the torque settings of the action screws. Torque the front screw to 45 in lbs, and start the rear screw at 20 in lbs, shoot a group, and then go up in 5 in lb increments and see where it shoots best.
You can also change out the accu-trigger spring to the target trigger spring for even lower trigger pull weight. Gun Shack sells the spring for $7.

You have a decent scope / reticle, so that shouldn't be an issue.

Do you seat your bullets out near the lands, or do you seat them at SAAMI specs?

I seat these bullets to 2.250

 

[kmw1954]

horsemen61 I just started this winter shooting in our local Winter Rifle League and am using a Savage Model 10 in 223 with a 22" barrel. We rotate from 100yds to 300yds. I am the only one shooting a 223 of any kind. I am holding my own with this rifle and just since I have purchased it I already have about 1500 rounds down it. Granted on any given day I am only shooting 3/4MOA at 100 and 200yds.

We have guys shooting with us that are Competition shooters and travel the Mid-West. Most shoot some form of 6mm and they are shooting to around 1.5k rounds from their barrels... I tease them that I could most probably take one of their take-offs and still shoot another 1.5k from it and still not shoot to it's capabilities.

Right now I have a brand new Model 12 Heavy Varmint barrel in 223 that come spring and after league is over I will make the swap. Also have a Model 11 that is currently barreled in 243 but I hope that over the course of the summer to swap it for a 6mm BR Norma for next winter.

Tomorrow I will try to post a picture of the next target I need to shoot.

 

[Varminterror]

Glass bedding or pillar bedding the action can improve your groups

These aren’t “or” techniques. Pillar blocking and glass bedding and different techniques which serve different purposes.

 

[KY DAN]

Just going come out and say it.....

Don't waste time asking others if you should do something. JUST DO IT.

You want a barrel so get on, or just buy a dedicated rifle.

 

[redneck2]

would shoot the original barrel until it's shot out, then buy a better one and repeat

Problem is that you can spend a lot of time and money without meaningful results. I fail to understand why someone would expect exceptional results with inferior equipment.

This is a typical “those groups are great” thread. Uhhhh.....no, they’re not, at least in an attempt to reach the stated goal. When guys pipe in that they’d be ecstatic with 1” groups, it’s obvious their expectations are not very high.

Can you shoot 1/4” groups with a factory rifle and marginal scope? Maybe, yeah.. Once in a while. Someone will come along with one picture of one group shot one time. That’s not consistent, that’s a “wallet picture” group.

If your barrel is only capable of 1/2” groups, your ammo 1/2” groups, and your scope parallax 1/2”, then expect at some point to shoot 1 1/2” groups. If the objective is the smallest group possible, then your goal should be eliminating variables. Blowing ammo downrange with poor quality equipment is simply turning money into noise and achieves nothing