12.5'' vs 18.5'' on 870

[dak0ta]

Hi,

Up here in Canada, we can buy Norinco 12.5'' factory barrels. I was wondering whether I should chop my 30'' barrel to 18.5'' or shell out $150 for a new 12.5'' barrel. If you guys recommend the 12.5'' I can sell the 30''. I have a Mossberg 500 for clays and hunting already so the long barrel on the 870 isn't necessary.

Is there any noticeable difference in 6''? Perceived recoil, muzzle blast, accuracy?

This is what a WM with a 12.5'' barrel looks like.

 

[Youngster]

Muzzle blast and volume will increase by a startling degree with the short tube. Also you need to divote some mental bandwidth into ensuring that your pump hand doesn't end up close to, or in front of, the muzzle if running it hard.

They make for an extremely handy package though, I like mine but I prefer a regular riot length barrel for being more user friendly and overall better handling IMO.

 

[lemaymiami]

One of the members on my outfit's SWAT team was usually armed with a very short "entry gun" to get through doorways... it was pretty much useless once entry was made.

For close quarters work it's pretty hard to beat an ordinary 18" barrel with a simple bead sight (smoothbore, not rifled). You might want to consider keeping that 30" barrel since an 870 with two barrels (an 18 and a 30) will be an easy sale if you ever need to put it on the market.

 

[oneounceload]

You will also lose some velocity with that short a barrel

 

[Owen Sparks]

I had a chance to shoot a 12.5" 870 at the police range a few years back.
I HATED IT! Not only was there tremendous noise and blast but the lack of mass from having so much of the barrel missing made it kick like a mule. You will also give up a good bit of velocity and any practical way to use an extended magazine.
Law or not, I still would not choose a barrel shorter than 18" as factory 12 GA shells are not designed to preform in barrels shorter than that.

 

[snooperman]

A farmer friend has one like yours that is legal , with proper paper work as an AOW. I wanted to get one too but after shooting his I decided against it. After much research , I found I would be losing more in its effectiveness than I would be gaining. I felt I made the right choice for myself. To each his own. Snoop

 

[Shawn Dodson]

US Navy submarine force uses 14" bbls and it seems to work quite well.

 

[dak0ta]

We have a manufacturer here that makes medium contour 'Police' style 870 barrels at 14''. Much more expensive though.

I think Norinco also makes a 14'' barrel too. I like the fact that they extra 1.5'' over the 12.5'' improves safety over blowing your hand off.

I found this video of a 12.5'' 870, recoil, muzzle blast, and blowing off your hand doesn't seem too bad. This guy in the US sawed off his 870 to 12.5'' and patterns it compared to a 11'' sawed off Stoeger and control Benelli M4 18.5''. Wow I am impressed at the patterns at 20 yards from both SBS. And he hits 2 of 4 slugs at 100 yards!

 

[Youngster]

You actually don't lose all that much velocity out of a 12.5" bbl, a standard velocity buckshot round seems to give up only 50-75 fps compared to an 18.5" bbl. Slugs seem to lose considerably more, but either way its not likely to be all that relevant for SD purposes.

 

[PJR]

I like the fact that they extra 1.5'' over the 12.5'' improves safety over blowing your hand off.

I agree. The extra length does help a bit. I have a 14" barrel for my 870 and what helps prevent my hand slipping infront of the muzzle is a sling and light mount.

My shorter barrel only gets used when absolutely necessary for space and storage reasons. Otherwise I like the 20" barrel. I did some low light range tests comparing the 14" and 20" and the longer barrel is definitely preferable in the dark.

 

[Zoogster]

Shotguns lose surprisngly little in shorter barrels.

Most factory loads actually burn most of the powder and achieve most of their velocity within 8" of barrel if I recall.


These are guns using what amounts to pistol powders, and with large bores that give even greater surface area to quickly burn the powder in.
They also max out at relatively low pressures.
This combination means they can burn a fast powder to the low pressures required rapidly.

Velocity loss will be minimal.
Accuracy changes should be minimal too, comparing cylinder bores. You do lose all that space for gradual forcing cones and perfect chokes, so comparing highly choked guns you could see a bigger difference.



What you do gain a lot of is blast and noise. The blast and decibels go up signficantly.


I would want a 14" myself, but added inches do reduce portability. What is your intended use?
12.5" may be better for hiking and backpacking.
Where shorter would really shine is outdoors where increased perceived blast will be less, and portability and handiness shines more.
If I was going to go that short I would also consider a folding stock. Many are not as as nice as a full stock, but the even greater reduced size would maximize the primary attribute of a trail gun.

Do keep in mind though that long guns are generally not designed for much impact before discharge. So a gun short enough to more easily point at part of you in a fall is an added risk.


You can also always add weight to the end, so don't let increased muzzle climb be a determiner, a light, or you could even toss in some lead weight and it will have less muzzle climb than a full size shotgun. That is all fully adjustable.

 

[snooperman]

I agree that the velocity is not an issue in short barrel shotguns. But, the real problem is the tremendous noise level in the confined space of a home with the muzzle so close to the ears. Many people have serious hearing problems after using a 12" or shorter barrels that plague them for the rest of their lives.

 

[dak0ta]

I usually double up hearing protection, is that sufficient?

 

[Youngster]

It'll protect yor ears well enough, but you'll still probably find the blast to be unpleasant in a confined space.

 

[dak0ta]

It won't really be for HD as that's not really an option here. You can't defend yourself unless feeling your life is in danger. So hence, shotgun must be unloaded and locked up.

It's more of a hiking shotgun/plinker/excuse to have a SBS 870.

 

[oneounceload]

Here's a chart showing velocity differences between 22 to 30 inch barrels
These are approaching 800fps:

http://www.guncustomizing.com/tech.htm#barrelvelocity

Now imagine what it is like when you cut it down to 12.5

 

[foghornl]

I have an 18-1/2" barrel on my Maverick 88...short enough for my needs.

I bought that barrel after the SECOND time I poked a hole in the wall 'house cleaning' with the 28" barrel. Made Mrs Foggy much happier that i wasn't doing that anymore.

As the old saying goes: "if Momma ain't happy, ain't NOBODY happy."

 

[Youngster]

What about one of these?

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/66...2-gauge-3-18-1-2-rem-choke-ramped-front-sight

 

[mgkdrgn]

You will also lose some velocity with that short a barrel

I really don't think anything he is going to shoot with that thing is going to notice the difference. ;-)

 

[dak0ta]

I have some offers for a 20'' barrel. Is this the opposite end of the spectrum? Too muzzle heavy? I'm undecided on an extension or not. I like the compactness and reliability of just the stock magazine 4 rounds. What about +1, +2, +3?

I can get a 12.5'' for $100 shipped, and have offers for genuine 18.5 and 20'' Rem barrels. All bead sights.

 

[snooperman]

DaKota, only you can really answer that question. I like my defense shotguns to be well balanced and not too muzzle heavy nor Butt-end heavy. I find the 20" barrels on my 2 Ithaca defense guns to be ideal and the 18" for my Remington gun to also be well balanced for defensive work . The very short- barrel 12" guns for me feel unsafe in this respect. Snoop

 

[snooperman]

I might add that I do not keep a full magazine in the Ithaca 20" guns , which actually holds 7 rounds, I keep only 5 in them both- for balance, In my 870 police gun the mag tube only holds 4 rounds and I find that ideal for me. I think that proper fit and balance is just as important in a defense gun as it is in a hunting gun. My 2 cents-Snoop

 

[Youngster]

I find that a +1 extension typically won't really hurt the balance of the gun, but longer ones will, especially seeing as they also might require the additional weight of a muzzle clamp.

 

[dak0ta]

20'' seems pretty long compared to 18.5'', even though it's 1.5''. I wouldn't put a +2 or +3 extension on I don't think. Probably only a +1 to get a forward sling mount, maybe. Then again, 18.5'' seems very long compared to 12.5''.

I do like the compactness and weight reduction of 12.5'', and the fact that I don't really need an extension for an outdoor rec gun.

Addendum: Just noticed that on the 12.5'', poor Chinese QC has put the bead off axis to the bore and barrel ring. So I don't think that's an option. Will most likely get the 20'' unless an 18.5'' pops up.