1911 vs Revolver

[45_auto]

I have a Smith 586 that I regularly shoot IDPA with, and I have no trouble keeping up with everyone else (I'm the only wheelgunner)

Either you're real good, or the rest of the people you're shooting with are real bad. What's your IDPA classification?

Even Jerry Miculek's revolver scores (hopefully you know who he is - ten time IDPA Enhanced Service Revolver champion, many revolver world records, etc) are 30% to 40% worse than the corresponding semi-auto scores.



http://www.idpa.com/compete/competitiondetails/6646

High Custom Defensive Pistol (semi) = 244.59
High Enhanced Service Pistol (semi) = 225.69
High Stock Service Pistol (semi) = 212.42

High Stock Service Revolver = 327.75
High Enhanced Service Revolver = 294.66

In case you don't know who Jerry Miculek is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Miculek

Seven time USPSA 3-Gun National Championship
Four time USPSA Multi-gun National Championship
Four time 2nd Chance Bowling Pin Champion
1997 and 2007 American Handgunner World Shoot-Off Champion (The only person ever to win this title with a revolver.)
Twenty time International Revolver Champion
Member of seven time winning pro team at the Sportsmans Team Challenge
Eight time USPSA National Revolver Champion
Three time Masters International Long Gun Champion
Two time International Practical Shooting Confederation World Revolver Champion
Ten time IDPA Enhanced Service Revolver Champion
One time Bianchi Cup NRA World Action Pistol Metallic Champion

 

[MrBorland]

Originally Posted by freyasman
I have a Smith 586 that I regularly shoot IDPA with, and I have no trouble keeping up with everyone else (I'm the only wheelgunner)

Either you're real good, or the rest of the people you're shooting with are real bad. What's your IDPA classification?

freyasman keeps up with everyone else he regularly shoots with. That means local 6-stage matches, not major sanctioned matches, such as the National Championships.

A decent wheelgunner can certainly hang with everyone else at local matches because they're not really long enough to handicap a wheelgunner that much. I've won High Overall locally shooting SSR against Master-level Semi-auto shooters. Much different story at longer sanctioned matches, where nearly every stage involves an extra reload for revolvers.

 

[45_auto]

As I said, either he's real good or the rest of the shooters are real bad. I have no reference as to his skill level or the people he's shooting with.

A decent wheelgunner can certainly hang with everyone else at local matches because they're not really long enough to handicap a wheelgunner that much. I've won High Overall locally shooting SSR against Master-level Semi-auto shooters.

Based on your showings in the competitions you've posted about on here in the past several years, I would classify you into my "real good" category. Therefore you would have no problem keeping up with most semi-auto shooters.

 

[threoh8]

When you're in a shooting situation, averages don't mean much. You're already an outlier.

There's nothing wrong with a good DA .357 that you can use well. Practice, practice, practice, whatever you use.

I prefer a 1911 in .45, mainly because I shoot it better quickly, under pressure. A little better capacity doesn't hurt anything, either. 8 + 1 Works well in my Colt.

 

[buck460XVR]

But that was in 67, when revolvers were king.

Turns out the actual percentage is a higher now, 7 rounds per incident. And this is after the NYPD went to semi-automatics (and higher round count per shooting.)

I assume that the reason for this has less to do with necessity than it does with training and mindset. Example, the innocent college football player 24-year-old Jonathan A. Ferrell, shot 10 times by the same officer, after being tazered. I believe Officer Kerrick fired 12 times at him. Seems to be the norm in any police shootout, shoot till you run outta ammo, regardless of what or who you hit. Using those same averages, one would think that 4 outta 5 from a j-frame would have stopped and killed Ferrell just as quick.

Seems we have gone from what works best for the average citizen that shoots once a year to pro's that shoot on a daily basis to try and prove a point that has nuttin' to do with the average citizen or the average security guard. For them, 8 shots from a revolver will always be just as effective as 8 shots fired from a auto. Speed is not as reliant on the platform, but as to the operators skill in getting on target between shots. Just pullin' the trigger blindly ain't gonna get it done. One should use what they are most comfortable with, most confident with and most proficient with.....period.

 

[Deaf Smith]

Seems we have gone from what works best for the average citizen that shoots once a year to pro's that shoot on a daily basis to try and prove a point that has nuttin' to do with the average citizen or the average security guard. For them, 8 shots from a revolver will always be just as effective as 8 shots fired from a auto. Speed is not as reliant on the platform, but as to the operators skill in getting on target between shots. Just pullin' the trigger blindly ain't gonna get it done. One should use what they are most comfortable with, most confident with and most proficient with.....period.

It is not really anything to do with any 'average' shooter.

I've been a IDPA/IPSC shooter for decades and while I love the game, it is just a game. Cool guns and gear, lots of round count. Targets don't shoot back and rarely move plus nice aiming points.

One is better off going to a Polite Society match where you have to determine who is whom and if you stay exposed for more than 3 seconds you are considered dead.
These matches also have fully clothed targets with no bullseye and a distinct possibility they won't fall with a poor shot or weak powered gun.

There are rare circumstances where lots of shots may be needed, but 99 percent of the time, IF THE SHOOTER CAN SHOOT, then a wheel gun will do.

Catch is so many don't practice yet carry 5 shot revolvers (I do carry a 640-1 centennial but I do practice weekly.) Winter time Glock, summer time Centennial.

I am of the opinion that a good semi-auto that holds anywhere from 8 to 12 rounds is a good bet for most people. Now they still have to practice some, but they are easier to hit with.

But if you can shoot well and fast, a revolver will do fine.

Deaf

 

[InkEd]

I like both my .357s and 1911s but neither would be first choice for a duty weapon. I would most likely go with with either my XD or Glock pistols because of simplicity and higher capacity. Plus, if you (God forbid.) do have to use it, it wouldn't be too missed while held in evidence by the police until cleared as a clean shoot.

 

[BlindJustice]

I shoot .45 ACP in a S&W 625 and a full size 1911.
some days one shoots better for ME than the other then
the next time at the range it's the other way around.

I carry the 1911 - slime for the pistol as well as reloads for Concealed
carry. If it was a Duty rig with speedloader holders for the belt for Full
moon clips, the revolver would be serviceable

Ialso have a .357 Mag but consider the full house
loads a bit more in terms of recoil mgmt. and follow up shots.
.45 ACP / subsonic and momentum over velocity/ft lbs.

R-

 

[buck460XVR]

It is not really anything to do with any 'average' shooter.

This thread started off by the OP asking a question concerning the comparison of two platforms for use as a security guard. Most security guards are "average" shooters, not Jerry Miculek or his counterparts in the world of professional competition shooters. By average shooter, I do not mean novice, but someone familiar with firearms and has been shooting for several years. I just don't see where the posting of scores from "Distinguished Master" factory sponsored competitive shooters has anything to do with this thread, much less the question the O.P. asked.

Catch is so many don't practice yet carry 5 shot revolvers

...and everyone that carries a high capacity auto does? So what does a higher capacity firearm provide for that person that doesn't practice, other than more rounds to miss with and hit innocent bystanders?

AGAIN... one needs to consider their possible scenarios, and use the firearm that they are most confident with and most proficient with. Using any firearm, regardless of capacity or platform for defensive purposes without becoming proficient first, is asking for trouble.

 

[freyasman]

Either you're real good, or the rest of the people you're shooting with are real bad. What's your IDPA classification?

Even Jerry Miculek's revolver scores (hopefully you know who he is - ten time IDPA Enhanced Service Revolver champion, many revolver world records, etc) are 30% to 40% worse than the corresponding semi-auto scores.



http://www.idpa.com/compete/competitiondetails/6646

High Custom Defensive Pistol (semi) = 244.59
High Enhanced Service Pistol (semi) = 225.69
High Stock Service Pistol (semi) = 212.42

High Stock Service Revolver = 327.75
High Enhanced Service Revolver = 294.66

In case you don't know who Jerry Miculek is:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerry_Miculek

I keep missing the classifiers, so I'm "un-classified"; I am pretty good though, mostly because I don't get excited and I don't rush it. These are just local club matches, though, we shoot all morning and go grab lunch after. It's a good time, and it's good practice, but nothing serious.... I shoot in the top half of the shooters there, but I'm still far behind the top 10%; those guys take it very seriously and it shows. I use a revolver because I didn't have an appropriate holster for my 1911 the first time I went to a match, and I turned out to be the first guy to ever use a wheelgun at this club. They got a kick out of it, and I've used it at club matches ever since. I'm switching my daily carry from my 1911 to a Glock 32 soon, but I still think the revolver is a perfectly acceptable sidearm.

 

[AJumbo]

If those are your only choices, then pick the one you like to carry, and will practice with. Neither are bad choices. Given those criteria, I would give the revolver a slight edge, as .38 Special practice ammo should be way cheaper than .45 ACP ammo.

 

[kimbershot]

i've had both platforms. my personal choice is the 45acp=a dw valor 1911 for target and a xds for carry. i love the feel and it's easy to get on target with both pistols.

 

[Robert]

This has gone beyond silly and is getting downright dumb. Use what you are best with be it a 1911 or a wheel gun. Either will serve you just fine.