2 replica peacemakers both shoot 2.5 inches left at 25v yards - Why?

[Driftwood Johnson]

please, please, please,

shoot those guns at paper at 7 yards before doing ANYTHING to them. At CAS distances I bet a donut you will get a tight group pretty close to your aiming point.

I agree. Shoot them close up before you try altering anything.



I have had this set of needle files for many, many years. I bought them long ago for working on HO model trains. They are each about 5 1/2" long. Notice the different shapes. The one at the bottom of the photo is square edged and can cut a pretty sharp square.






Like anything else, you get what you pay for.

If I was looking for a set of needle files today I would go to these guys:

https://www.micromark.com/mini-hand-tools/files

 

[Jim Watson]

But there were target shooters back then.

Colt made the Bisley model with grip and hammer shaped to suit the game and sights to meet the Bisley rule of not being screw adjustable or readily interchangeable and not even to be drifted on the firing line.

 

[JimGnitecki]

please, please, please,

shoot those guns at paper at 7 yards before doing ANYTHING to them. At CAS distances I bet a donut you will get a tight group pretty close to your aiming point.

I'll try that as a matter of curiosity, but it wouldn't satisfy me.

Paraphrasing Colonel Townsend Whelen: "Only accurate firearms are interesting.”

Jim G

 

[JTHunter]

Jim G - something else you might check out is the gap between front of the cylinder and the forcing cone. I have a Ruger GP-100 in .357 that has a gap of 0.009" which is right at the maximum Ruger allows. If the bullets are leaving the chamber in an uneven manner or entering the forcing cone unevenly, this could affect the bullet's profile and aerodynamics.

 

[Driftwood Johnson]

Paraphrasing Colonel Townsend Whelen: "Only accurate firearms are interesting.”

Accuracy consists of how small a group a firearm can produce, not where it places the group.

 

[JimGnitecki]

Accuracy consists of how small a group a firearm can produce, not where it places the group.

No, that's PRECISION. Accuracy is putting them where they were intended to go.

Jim G

 

[JimGnitecki]

Jim G - something else you might check out is the gap between front of the cylinder and the forcing cone. I have a Ruger GP-100 in .357 that has a gap of 0.009" which is right at the maximum Ruger allows. If the bullets are leaving the chamber in an uneven manner or entering the forcing cone unevenly, this could affect the bullet's profile and aerodynamics.

Yes, I can easily check that with feeler gages. But the bullet velocities I am getting suggets the gap is not big.

Jim G

 

[hawg]

People will argue until they're blue in the face, but I maintain that one simply cannot shoot a revolver with a high degree of accuracy with only two fingers on the grip.

Believe it or not you can control one very well, even better than having them all scrunched up on the grip.

 

[35 Whelen]

Believe it or not you can control one very well, even better than having them all scrunched up on the grip.

.

My experience tells me otherwise.

35W

 

[hawg]

.

My experience tells me otherwise.

35W

My 50+ years experience says it does.

 

[mavracer]

People will argue until they're blue in the face, but I maintain that one simply cannot shoot a revolver with a high degree of accuracy with only two fingers on the grip.

 

[35 Whelen]

My 50+ years experience says it does.

I'm glad it works for you.

35W

 

[JimGnitecki]

Jim G - something else you might check out is the gap between front of the cylinder and the forcing cone. I have a Ruger GP-100 in .357 that has a gap of 0.009" which is right at the maximum Ruger allows. If the bullets are leaving the chamber in an uneven manner or entering the forcing cone unevenly, this could affect the bullet's profile and aerodynamics.

I just used feeler gages to check the gap between cylinder and forcing cone on each revolver. They are each at .006". This seems fine.

Jim G

 

[Tallball]

I'm not an expert like Driftwood, but I really feel that the OP is just having problems shooting a revolver that's shaped differently than what they're used to. Shooting consistently left is typical for a right-handed person learning to shoot a style of handgun new to them.

I always tuck my pinky under the grip of a SA revolver and hold it just a tiny bit loose. Different things work for different people. I shoot my Blackhawk 9mm more accurately than any of my other 9mm handguns (recent thread), so whatever I'm doing is working for me.

One possible suggestion is pay $100 plus for a Heritage Rough Rider in 22lr. It's like a smaller SAA. WIth no recoil to speak of, it would be a cheap and easy way to get the hang of shooting that style of firearm.

Also, try just loading three or four instead of six and give the cylinder a random spin before you start shooting. Easy guess that you catch yourself pulling left when you click on an empty cylinder. Loading three and spinning has improved my snubby shooting a LOT in the past year or so.

Heritage Rough Rider 22lr New

• Tallball
• Jul 27, 2021

 

[flightsimmer]

I guess I'm just very lucky, this is my Colt 1873 second generation 45 caliber replica at 25 yds.

 

[mavracer]

I'm not an expert like Driftwood, but I really feel that the OP is just having problems shooting a revolver that's shaped differently than what they're used to. Shooting consistently left is typical for a right-handed person learning to shoot a style of handgun new to them.

Could be but if OP is shooting 2" groups at 25 yards I'm inclined to believe it's probably easier to adjust the sight filing the rear notch than adjust a trigger pull that's obviously well ingrained.
It's also not inconceivable that 2 guns 100 serial numbers apart could have had their barrels screwed on by the same guy on the same day and were over/under rotated to the same degree.
Could have somebody else shoot them, or shoot from bags/rest maybe shoot weak hand to confirm that it shoots left.

 

[thirty-eight]

My normal handgun grip is always a TWO-handed grip. My right hand grips the handgun first, and then my left hand wraps aorund it.

Try one-handed for comparison. For me, two-handed is twice as difficult.

It is somewhat disappointing to have to create a new unique trigger and grip technique for one specific model of handgun. That should not be a requirement for using that handgun.

It sure seems to be for single-actions.
Here's a thought. Aim so you're hitting where you want and practice using the tips offered by Driftwood Johnson. Bet you'll soon find your point of aim will need to move closer to desired point of impact. The man knows what he's talking about.

 

[JimGnitecki]

I have been paying attention to what everyone has posted on this thread, and will be trying several things to see how best to get that POI closer to POA!

Jim G

 

[Bronco72]

Do you reload ?? I know that when I change between cat sneeze loads and hot loads, when at the range, I have to change my sight in windage and elevation to center it., Maybe by changing the load you can get some correction.

 

[JimGnitecki]

Do you reload ?? I know that when I change between cat sneeze loads and hot loads, when at the range, I have to change my sight in windage and elevation to center it., Maybe by changing the load you can get some correction.

Yes, I DO reload, and in fact trying different load sis one of the things I wll be doing! In my 2 range sessions so far with these 2 revolvers, I used 142 to 148g cast bullets and Trail Boss powder in loads ranging from 3.2 to 4.1 grains.

Yesterday, I loaded up 120 rounds with 20 rounds each of 3.2 to 4.2 grains of TiteGroup, using a 158g Hornady swaged bullet.

The weather right now, and for at least the next 10 days of forecasted weather, shows very cold temperatures and a few days of snow as well (I live in Canada). And our range is strictly outdoor and does not get plowed, so we have to wait for the snow to melt, which usuauly takes 2 or 3 datys. So, I may not be able to get out to the range as soon as I'd like. But, I am strongly motivated, so will be watching the weather for "windows of opportunity"!

I am glad to hear you say that changing your loads DID affect POI windage, not just elevation.

Jim G

 

[crstrode]

Jim G

These guns were manufactured to shoot point of aim at the factory. The factory location is at a significantly more southerly latitude than that of your Canadia shooting range. Obviously, it is due to the much lower centripetal force generated by the decreased axial distance the Earth surface moves during each rotation of the planet at your northerly location. You can either move south, closer to the equator, or try rotating the bullet about 23 degrees clockwise in the cartridge case when reloading. This method only works if your loading bench is situated directly in line with the magnetic declination gradient at your shooting range.

 

[JimGnitecki]

These guns were manufactured to shoot point of aim at the factory. The factory location is at a significantly more southerly latitude than that of your Canadia shooting range. Obviously, it is due to the much lower centripetal force generated by the decreased axial distance the Earth surface moves during each rotation of the planet at your northerly location. You can either move south, closer to the equator, or try rotating the bullet about 23 degrees clockwise in the cartridge case when reloading. This method only works if your loading bench is situated directly in line with the magnetic declination gradient at your shooting range.

Aw, shucks! I forgot all that stuff. Plus, the Dillon XL750 bullet rotator for geographically northern locations is, due to post-COVID supply line issues, still on backorder until at least a month after Hell freezes over, and our recalcitrant (and unvaccinated) CAS range designer obstinately oriented our CAS range so we shoot due East versus North, which confuses the bullets even after you calibrate them by rotating 23 degrees while reloading.

Jim G

 

[halfmoonclip]

Listen to Crstrode, though he did forget to mention the infield fly rule.
Actually, listen to Tallball, with his 'ball and dummy' idea. Nothing helps you see your own sins like 'click' when you expected 'bang'.
Honest, you'll find out if you are the problem PDQ.
Moon

 

[JimGnitecki]

Listen to Crstrode, though he did forget to mention the infield fly rule.
Actually, listen to Tallball, with his 'ball and dummy' idea. Nothing helps you see your own sins like 'click' when you expected 'bang'.
Honest, you'll find out if you are the problem PDQ.
Moon

No chance of getting to the range anytime soon to do the "some chambers empty" firing, but the problem is not showing up in my dry firing across the basement. I think part of the reason is that I do NOT "anticipate" recoil, because even with self-defence level 9mm 115g / 1375 fps / 480 ft lb loads, or 45ACP 230g loads I am not bothered by recoil at all. With the relatively puny 158g / 770 fps / 207 ft lb CAS loads I'm firing, it's like shooting an air pistol.

And the triggers on both of these revolvers, as they came from the factory, are SO good that I am "surprised" every time.

Jim G

 

[doubleh]

My 50+ years experience says it does.

My 60+ years tells me otherwise also. I do better with all my pinkies on the grip.