338-06 vs. 35 Whelen...what's you take??

[saturno_v]

What is your opinion on the comparison between these two popular offsprings of the legendary 30-06??

I did read a little bit of load data on the Hodgdon database.

They pretty much have the same bullet weight range....in 200 gr,, 225 gr. and 250 gr. (I did not check all bullet weights) the 338-06 is actually capable to push the pill faster than the 35 Whelen.

The 250 gr. slugs are listed as top bullet weight for both.

.35 cal bullets have generally worse BC and SD than .338 slugs.

So I guess my question is...what are the reasons for choosing the 35 Whelen over the 338-06??

Caliber difference is too small to realistically change anything about performance on game and the larger caliber has less long range capabilities and poorer SD...on top of that, within the same bullet weight as we saw in the official load data from Hodgdon, the 338-06 can push the them faster.

To me looks like a no brainer...the 338-06 is the overall better and more versatile cartridge.....still it seems that the 35 Whelen is commercially more popular while the 338-06 is barely above wildcat status.


What is your take on this??

 

[sonier]

easy, we reloaders have better options then the factory guys ever will

 

[MMCSRET]

I have both, 338-06 built up on a Model 70 push feed, 24" barrel(Douglas), Ramline stock.
35 Whelen, M98 Mauser, 1942 J.P. Saur action, E.R. Shaw 24" barrel with custom muzzle break, mounted in a Fajen composite stock.
Both rifles are hunting accurate in my hands, both have fixed 4X scopes, neither rifle has ever seen a factory round and all cases were formed from W-W Super 30-06 cases.
Both rifles have taken elk, cows and bulls, successfully.
The 35 had significantly heavier recoil, thats why I had a break built to my specs.
Both great rifles chambered in great cartridges.
Differences?? I dunno!!!!!!!!
Oh, the 338-06 was built before the cartridge was standardized.
I also shoot an 8MM-06.
All are great and each is as good or better than the other depending only on the operator.

 

[ArmedBear]

.338-06 for the velocity and trajectory. It seems to be a very efficient cartridge with modern powders, generating .30-06 velocities but with much heavier bullets.

.35 Whelen if I didn't want to have to go custom or semi-custom to get it, though...

Probably just get a .338 WinMag, which is unfortunate, really, because I'd love to have a standard Model 70 Featherweight or EWSS that weighed about the same as a .30-06, but shot a bigger bullet. As it stands, you have to get a heavier rifle, and you get little performance benefit for the extra heft, over a hypothetical .338-06 Model 70.

.338-06 is IMO the cartridge that should be commonplace, but isn't. The belted magnums came along so much earlier that the .338 WinMag, which gets only marginally better performance from a bigger case and a good deal more powder, is the standard, like it or not.

 

[saturno_v]

easy, we reloaders have better options then the factory guys ever will

Last time I check, Hodgdon was a powder manufacter and its loading data are used by reloaders, not ammo companies....

 

[GooseGestapo]

From the time that I bought my Interarms MkX .30/06 in 1975 till 2003 when I finally committed to building the rifle; I'd dreamed of building it in .35Whelen.

However, when Weatherby and A-Square offered the .338/06 in factory form in the late '90's, I became equally intrigued.

What clinched the deal was MidwayUSA offering the .338" bbls for 54.95 for a short chambered barrel. For 160.00, I got a Gunsmith to install the bbl, blue it and the reciever with a bead-blast finish, including a weld-repair to the bolt from a stuck case episode.

I've been pleased with the end result. It isn't MOA accurate, typically, but isn't a target rifle. I've taken several deer and knocked down an elk that I didn't recover, which I blame on the bullet I was using. (Not enough expansion).

Realisitically, for under 200yd shooting, there's little to choose between the two. Over 200yds, the .338 holds a distinct advantage due to higher B.C's and SD's. If using cast bullets, there are many more good moulds for the .35Whelen. However, the Lee .339" 2R-gas checked mould seems made just for my rifle. The bullet weight range on the two is very similar but due to a number of reasons, the .338 is capapble of higher velocities by about 100fps mostly due to the suitablilty of the powders to the larger bore to case capacity ratio. (smaller bore-same case capacity) My favorite bullet for my .338 is the discontinued Nosler 180gr Ballistic Tip. Luckily, I found 5 boxes of them at Georgia Arms, and bought up all they had. My favorite load w/54.5gr of RL15 runs them just under 3,000fps for near .300WinMag performance. Most accurate load I've found for this rifle, too.

I've mostly concentrated on the lighter bullet weights as elk are the largest thing I've taken this gun after. However if I ever get the chance to take it to Alaska, I'll be taking the Hornady 250gr Interlok-Pt. Spts. Over just 56.5gr of IMR4350, I get 2,550fps @ 30', and have gotten some bragging size 3-shot groups, though mostly they go at or just over 1". 58.0gr gets over 2,600fps but accuracy falls off significanly.

Like ArmedBear stated, this cartridge should be common-place. With a 5+1 magazine capacity, it offers a 2rd advantage over the .338Magnums, though it only gives up 90-125fps over the .338WinMag. One day I was at the range and an aquaintance was there sighting in his Browning Stainless Stalker .338WinMag w/26" bbl for a Moose/Bear hunt in Alaska. He asked if I would chrono his loads for him. They were a near max load of IMR4350 under a Nosler 250gr Partition. His load only chrono's 2,625fps. He was elated. I said guess what.......... and pulled out my .338/06. His rifle didn't kick any more than mine, but mine w/24" bbl was 2.5" shorter and held 50% more rounds......and difference in ballistics amounted to the difference between two different cartridges from the same box......

However, I still wonder sometimes if I should have gone with the .35Whelen. I have a Marlin M336C in .35Rem that with the 200gr Remington RNSPt Corlokts kills deer sooooo-gooood. Makes me wonder how good the .35Whelen w/200gr Pt. Corlokts might do. Also, with the .35Rem I've experienced inadequate expansion with the 180gr Speers and 200gr RN and PtSpt. Hornady's........

FWIW; John Barsness wrote in a "Gunsmoke" piece (last page of Handloader/Rifle magazine) that the difference in performance of different bore diameters between 7mm and 9mm (.284-.358) mattered little. I perhaps tend to generally agree with him, though the .35's do seem to cause the animals to flinch a bit more when hit than the 7mm's. Perhaps still enough reason to use the larger bore's though ......

Lately, I've been playing with a Marlin .338MX. I'm not so sure how much better (if any) than the .35Rem, it is..... Accurate rascal, though! More accurate generally, than the Bolt actioned .338/06, though velocities are running 250-300fps slower.

 

[loadedround]

You want chocolate or vanilla? That's what it really bils down to, the only advantage the 35 Whelen is no a factory load and the 338-06 is not. Why not just flip a coin?

 

[Float Pilot]

I had a 35 Whelen for a long time... It was a wildcat rifle and I occasionally had concerns about the shoulder being a tad bit too small. A common compliant for the older custom 35 Whelens.

After the 338-06 became standardized as the 338-A-Square, (with factory brass and ammo available to some degree), my brother built one on an old Savage that he bought at a police auction. It has turned out to be a very versatile rifle. the shoulder is a little bigger and gives great head spacing. It seems to lend itself to more accurate hand-loads as well, but that is only an observation from a couple different rifles.

I love 358 caliber Rifles,,, I have a 350 Rem Mag, a 358 Win and a 358 Norma Mag. Plus the 35 Whelen which I sold...
But,,, should I get another wild hair,,, I would probably go with the 338-06 (A-Square version) over another 35 Whelen.

 

[Maverick223]

I prefer the .35Whelen. IMO it is the best thumper until you reach the 9.3x64Brenneke/.375H&H class. The bigger bullet does make a difference, and if you need a cartridge greater than the .30-06, the Whelen (or Brown-Whelen) is a superb choice. That isn't to say that the .338-06A-Square is a deficient cartridge, I just don't believe it is a significant jump over the venerable .30-06. If I didn't have a .30-06, then the .338-06A-Square would be a more palatable solution.

A side benefit of the .35cal is the ability to use cheap .357Mag/.38Spl/9mm bullets for plinking and "light tasks". This makes reloading the .35Whelen a more economical solution.

What would the rifle be used for...or is this a hypothetical situation?

 

[jmr40]

I would think the Whelen is a better close range thumper. I believe the 338-06 is more versatile. With the heavier bullets I don't see how it could be far behind the Whelen on bigger animals at close range. With 200-225 grain bullets it shoots surprisingly flat for longer range work.

While factory 35 Whelen loads are available they are not exactly everywhere. I consider both to be handloaders rounds. Either are easily made with 30-06 brass.

 

[geologist]

Ballistically no game animal will be able to tell the difference between the two as long as the hunter does his job.

The .338-06 has a better selection of rifle bullets with superior SD due to the popularity of it's big brother the .338 Win mag.

The .35 Whelen has the advantage of being chambered in the Rem 7600 pump rifle and sometimes carbine, a great heavy bush rifle.

Either cartridge is great. I had thought about building a .338-06 on a Rem 7600 carbine but since I have a Marlin 1895 GS it seems kinda silly.

 

[Palehorseman]

I had a .35 Whelen Ackley improved that I used when living in Alaska, it was almost a sure thing moose stopper.