357 Sig Can Penetrate Kevlar Vests?

[2ndAmFan]

I recently moved to the Tucson, AZ area and awhile back there was a series of robberies by thugs dressed as LE, wearing full body armor and raiding houses to steal or worse. We live out in the country and have only one neighbor closer than 150 yards or so. My go to guns are shotguns loaded with slugs. I don't care what kind of body armor a BG is wearing. A slug in the chest is gonna knock him down even if he's wearing a steel chest plate and will likely cause some bruising and possibly broken ribs. Of course, if he or they want more than one slug I'll be happy to provide all the entertainment they can handle.

 

[Loosedhorse]

Solid copper pointed bullets

Let's not start rumors!

Copper is SOFT! Alloyed copper (usually beryllium copper; or brass; or bronze) is hard, and illegal for use in handgun rounds by private citizens.

 

[Thompsoncustom]

whats the deal with the hard alloy not being legal for citizens? is this a federal thing? Just wondering if I have some illegal cast bullets as they have a brinnell hardness of around 100.

 

[1stmarine]

Steve C,
Good point the 125gr was actually done to mimic the 357 Magnum in those grain popular loads. Of course the 357 cannot do anything better that a pumped 357 magnum cannot do but the goal was not to better the 357 magnum, simply offer something with great power and able to feed from magazines.
This one yields 1489fps avg. over 600ft/lb from my Glock 22 and lonewolf barrel... Recoil is more than a 9mm +P but less choppiness than my 40cal with 180gr slugs.

http://www.doubletapammo.com/php/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=21_32&products_id=82

 

[rcmodel]

Just wondering if I have some illegal cast bullets as they have a brinnell hardness of around 100.

That would be next to impossible.

The hardest casting alloy commonly found that you can melt and fill a mold is Monotype metal and it has a BNH of 28.
Linotype is 22.

whats the deal with the hard alloy not being legal for citizens?

Under federal law, armor-piercing ammunition is defined as any projectile or projectile core that may be used in a handgun and that is constructed entirely from one or a combination of tungsten alloys, steel, iron, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium. 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(17); 27 C.F.R. § 478.11. In addition, armor-piercing ammunition is defined as a full jacketed projectile “larger than .22 caliber designed and intended for use in a handgun and whose jacket has a weight of more than 25 percent of the total weight of the projectile.”

rc

 

[Thompsoncustom]

I never said they were made of lead.... They are made of kirksite. So I'm guessing they are legal than.

 

[LibraPMC]

This kinda went off topic from 357 sig's performance to AP round's legality and overall performance;;;

 

[Thompsoncustom]

Indeed. I do believe the .357 sig would/could penetrate a vest but like I said earlier you probably won't be able to buy the ammo you'll have to make it. Speed which the .357 sig has is one of the keys.

 

[Loosedhorse]

Indeed. I do believe the .357 sig would/could penetrate a vest

Well, of course it could penetrate "a" vest. The question is whether it could penetrate a vest that is rated to stop it--specifically a IIIA vest.

"Belief" doesn't have to enter into it, as it is an experimental question: you can order one and find out.

 

[NG VI]

It's not that much faster than 9mm or .40, it doesn't offer any amazing super secret squirrel performance, it's a fast service pistol load.

 

[Thompsoncustom]

Alright this is why I believe it would be easy to do.

Level III-A

New armor protects against 8.1 g (125 gr) .357 SIG FMJ Flat Nose (FN) bullets at a velocity of 448 m/s ± 9.1 m/s (1470 ft/s ± 30 ft/s) and 15.6 g (240 gr) .44 Magnum Semi Jacketed Hollow Point (SJHP) bullets at a velocity of 436 m/s (1430 ft/s ± 30 ft/s). Conditioned armor protects against 8.1 g (125 gr) .357 SIG FMJ Flat Nose (FN) bullets at a velocity of 430 m/s ± 9.1 m/s (1410 ft/s ± 30 ft/s) and 15.6 g (240 gr) .44 Magnum Semi Jacketed Hollow Point (SJHP) bullets at a velocity of 408 m/s ± 9.1 m/s (1340 ft/s ± 30 ft/s). It also provides protection against most handgun threats, as well as the threats mentioned in [Types I, IIA, and II].

Now double tap sells some 125gr .357 ammo that does 1450fps/584ft.lb and as the vest is rated to stop this we are also talking lead with a copper jacket.

But if I was to load my own 80gr kirksite bullet in the .357 sig and push it to 1900fps/641ft.lb not only could I load it hotter and faster this bullet won't deform on impact so it could probably do it at lower speeds.

I do believe the .357 sig would/could penetrate a vest but like I said earlier you probably won't be able to buy the ammo you'll have to make it.