38 Special revolvers

chaim said:
I'm a big fan of both S&W and Colt revolvers, but I'm not sure I agree. It seems that the current crop of Taurus are much better than they have been in years. They are putting out a lot of good guns, both auto and revolver, with far fewer reported issues than in the past. Meanwhile, Colt and S&W seem to have more reported issues than they have in some time. Meanwhile, you can buy 2-3 Taurus Defender revolvers for the price of one S&W or Colt (new or used). S&W doesn't even make anything like the Taurus Defender and never have: small frame, 6 round, 3" .38spl with night sights. If you want a Smith you have to go to the larger K-frame or lose a round, and the front night sight is generally only available on some special run models (mostly from the Performance Center). The Colt is closer, but a lot more money. Even though I have a 2" Taurus 856UL (I just recently purchased a front night sight for it) and a 3" Colt King Cobra and don't really need it, a 3" Taurus Defender is high on my wish list right now. Since I don't really need it, I may go with the nicer Executive Grade (it will be nicer, and the bobbed hammer will give me something I don't have in the other two), then buy the front night sight separately like I did on my 856UL.
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So this statement is a contradiction .Unless I read it wrong which is entirely possible. But the poster you replied too was saying that the OP would be best of shopping for USED S&W and Colt Revolvers. You then disagree with him by using issues with new production S&W and Colts as an example.

I have handled and or owned LOTS of all of these revolvers. And there is nothing that has ever had the Taurus name on it that remotely compares to 99% of everything pre, say 2003, with the S&W and Colt names on it. Not even close.

That's not to say they are bad guns. I have a 2000 Taurus 85 that I love. But lets not kid ourselves. They are not better or even comparable to S&W or Colts.
 
I don't own a Taurus. Never have. In fact, i know nothing about them. But not because I turn my nose up at them. I'm sure they are well built now and I hear their cs is great. My reasoning is simply that I don't need another 38 spl revolver. 20221207_203507.jpg 20221207_204033.jpg 20221207_204413.jpg Oh wait. Yes I do. 20221207_204649.jpg Picked this 36 up last weekend.
 
1. Taurus. I have never handled one that screamed “bad quality” except for an ‘80s rimfire. In general, they feel “workmanlike” rather than “slick or elegant” such as we might describe a good S&W or Colt. They’re tougher than Rugers too. The fanboys on here suggested that this model (the .22 I mentioned) was as good or better than a Smith & Wesson model 17, which it was a clone of. However, this example had lots of cylinder play and also had heavy indentations around the edges of the chambers, suggesting a gun that had been dry-fired excessively. It just didn’t compare to a Smith. I passed. Taurus revolvers in general have a reputation for being hit or miss -mostly hit but with enough QC tales to give one pause, especially when they’re no longer exactly a huge bargain. That being said, they have a lot more options in the real world than S&W these days, so, they might be everyone’s go-to as time goes on?

2. .38 special. In the real world it will do everything you might want, with less blast and decibels than .357 mag. I probably wouldn’t use it for deer or hog hunting but for pretty much everything else it’s good go go.
 
Agsalaska said:
So this statement is a contradiction .Unless I read it wrong which is entirely possible. But the poster you replied too was saying that the OP would be best of shopping for USED S&W and Colt Revolvers. You then disagree with him by using issues with new production S&W and Colts as an example.

I have handled and or owned LOTS of all of these revolvers. And there is nothing that has ever had the Taurus name on it that remotely compares to 99% of everything pre, say 2003, with the S&W and Colt names on it. Not even close.

That's not to say they are bad guns. I have a 2000 Taurus 85 that I love. But lets not kid ourselves. They are not better or even comparable to S&W or Colts.
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Nothing contradictory. Since most people who object to Taurus do so on perceived quality issues, I point out that not only have they apparently addressed past issues, and may even be better than current Smith examples (a brand normally seen as reliable).

Then, the rest of my post addresses the price differences (whether the Smith or Colt is new or used) and the fact that S&W doesn't even make anything comparable to the Taurus 856 offerings as a reason to consider Taurus (and especially the models the OP discussed).
 
Meeks36 said:
Waffle house is fancy to some folks. It’s southern hibachi.
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I race sports cars at a private track outside Savannah, GA.The concession stand has a bacon, egg, and cheese breakfast sandwich to die for. And I hate fried eggs.

Recently, I learned that Waffle House had a similar bacon, egg, and cheese on Texas toast sandwich. So along with scattered and smothered hash browns, I’m good to go for a while at breakfast.

Besides good food, the entertainment value of the cooks and wait staff at Waffle House is priceless.

Generally speaking, I like revolvers with adjustable sights. I’ll accept “fixed” sights on semi-autos but not revolvers.

I like to develop a good load for a particular cartridge and then use it across other guns shooting the same cartridge.

I do not have any direct experience with Taurus revolvers.Historically, Taurus guns have a good reputation.

Bottom line, if Taurus makes a revolver that fits my needs, I’d probably invest.

As I said, there is something special about shooting 38 Special in a gun chambered for 38 Special.
 
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Five or six years ago I had cataract surgery on my eyes. Great, I can see distance without corrective lenses but not so great for shooting where I need to see the sights at shorter ranges.

I'm learning to adapt.

Anyway, a couple years ago, I managed to dispatched a ground hog with a S&W M317 and in the future, planning to use an Sp101 with 32 H&R mag SWC handloads in 327 Fed mag cases (I hate the carbon ring build up). I find 22RF not capable for ground hogs. I hope the SP101 with hot 32 H&R loads will do better.

Short of setting an ambush of the 38 Special round, topic I hope 32 H&R mag round will dispatch a groundhog well.

Today, three does, two babies and a moma baby sitter were around a horse water trough at feeding time. They have become "comfortable" with the Kubota side by side we use to feed the horses.

We have five former racing greyhounds from Florida and an AKC whippet. The whippet wears the greyts out, four times the energy with half the weight!
 
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Meeks36 said:
Waffle house is fancy to some folks. It’s southern hibachi.
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Love me some Waffle House. There are two different WH's, day time and 2 am. Living next to Ft. Campbell, 2 am drunk GI's do not dissapoint, nor do the Nashville Nutjobs when we are in town late at night! LOL.

Back on tops, we have 2. my nightstand duty 637 and the wifes 3-screw Blackhawk she inherited when her mom died. Since she only shoots 38's in it I think it qualifies.

On Taurus, think they are OK. I end up selling or trading away any one I ever owned though.
 
.308 Norma said:
View attachment 1117310
This is the Smith 38 Special that has mostly resided in a desk drawer in the living room ever since I bought it from a co-worker for $100.00 almost 25 years ago. If "I could think of any good reason" to replace it with a $100.00 bill, I’d go to the credit union come Monday morning and get myself a brand new, crisp $100 bill. Then I’d sell the revolver and take my wife out for dinner at a fancy restaurant with what was left over. ;)
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I got you a $100 for that .38
 
J-Bar said:
Gun show today; found a little used 1972 Model 10-5 that wanted a new home. The first 6 shots justified the indulgence. Merry Christmas to me!
Further proof that I love the .38 Special.

View attachment 1120180
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Great revolver. I had one same vintage and barrel. Really accurate, but when rhe barrel warmed up so did the groups. Curious if you find the same. It really didn't matter. I sold my to downsize before a move.
Super nice revolver :thumbup:
 
Speedo66 said:
Would I be wrong if I thought the only difference between a K frame in .38Spl. and .357 was the .357 was chambered an eighth of an inch deeper?
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Yes.
The .357's power is far superior to its
predecessor, the .38 Special. It fires at a
muzzle velocity of 810 feet per second and
can produce an impact force per square foot
of just 189 pounds. At 1,440 feet per second,
this .357 Magnum cartridge can strike with
575 pounds of force. Hence, more than
doubling the force and raising the speed far
above supersonic levels with roughly the
same cartridge was a significant feat.
 
ID-shooting said:
Love me some Waffle House. There are two different WH's, day time and 2 am. Living next to Ft. Campbell, 2 am drunk GI's do not dissapoint, nor do the Nashville Nutjobs when we are in town late at night! LOL.
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I'll agree. But it is nice to have a good place to stop for a meal in the middle of the night.:)
 
I have a Taurus 85UL, I got it cheap from a friend who carries it over 10 years but hardly shot it. It fired fine but has a lot of scratches and the grips were bad. He pocket carried no holster.
I replaced the grips and cleaned it up. Never had an issue.
I like it so much I want to buy a new one, but the 85 is discontinued. The 856 is reasonable, but I have heard about many timing issues. Also, I heard the speed loaders are not speedy because the extra round hits the we cylinder release. I'm very quick on the reloads.
It was at first a backup gun, then I changed to hogue grips for my daughter to have at home and got 2 speed loaders. Now I find it to be very good for EDC as a primary. It seems the best replacement for it is the 605, which fires 357 mag also, but no UL version. I'm going to get a 605 3" for a HD spare and backup woods carry.
The 158gr Underwood Keith Hardcasts does 1100fps in the 85 2" although the recoil on the UL is harsh, I found that leather gloves remedies the recoil just enough.
I also just found some promising grips by ATI that should remedy the recoil well on their own. They are made for the 85, but the 856 does not have these available. They should be here in a week.
These are my reload gear for it.
PXL_20221210_212034668.jpg
 
I've never owned a Taurus revolver though I did shoot a cylinder of 38spl out of a Taurus snub at my range that belonged to another member. I didn't notice the model but the trigger was good (IMO), shot right where I aimed it and the fit and finish wasn't bad. After all the online bashing I've read I was surprised when I noticed it was a Taurus. I enjoy owning several 38spl revolvers, two S&W Model 10 4", S&W Model 15-2 4"CM, S&W Model 64 4" & 3", Ruger Speed Six DAO 3" and Ruger Service Six DAO 4". These 38spls are used for fun at the range, ocassional CC and are easy to reload for. They often can be found at lower prices than other calibers.
 
Gunfu_Blaster.45 said:
I have a Taurus 85UL, I got it cheap from a friend who carries it over 10 years but hardly shot it. It fired fine but has a lot of scratches and the grips were bad. He pocket carried no holster.
I replaced the grips and cleaned it up. Never had an issue.
I like it so much I want to buy a new one, but the 85 is discontinued. The 856 is reasonable, but I have heard about many timing issues. Also, I heard the speed loaders are not speedy because the extra round hits the we cylinder release. I'm very quick on the reloads.
It was at first a backup gun, then I changed to hogue grips for my daughter to have at home and got 2 speed loaders. Now I find it to be very good for EDC as a primary. It seems the best replacement for it is the 605, which fires 357 mag also, but no UL version. I'm going to get a 605 3" for a HD spare and backup woods carry.
The 158gr Underwood Keith Hardcasts does 1100fps in the 85 2" although the recoil on the UL is harsh, I found that leather gloves remedies the recoil just enough.
I also just found some promising grips by ATI that should remedy the recoil well on their own. They are made for the 85, but the 856 does not have these available. They should be here in a week.
These are my reload gear for it.
View attachment 1120263
Click to expand...


If you are more interested in a 5 shot Taurus 85 than the 856, why not a used 85? Or, go with the steel 605 you are considering and keep the ugly 85UL you have for when you need the lighter gun. Also, S&W has several comparable options, and the J-frames, while definitely more expensive than a Taurus, are still priced reasonably.

As for the grips, Taurus 85 grips are supposed to fit the 856 just fine.

I love my Taurus 856UL. Yes, speed loaders do take a little more fiddling, though they work (I don't use them in my revolvers anymore though, I prefer flatter and easier to carry speed strips). Mine has been 100% reliable, enough that I am considering a 3" Taurus Defender even though I don't really need it (I rarely carry a revolver except occasionally as a BUG and when I want to carry one as a primary I have my 3" Colt King Cobra).
 
I have had a bunch of K & J frame S&W 38 specials; I think highly of them. The K frame trigger is exceptional for a stock revolver.

Having said that , I also own 1 Taurus, a ss 856. I consider it a very good value, but the da trigger is inferior to the S&W. 6 rounds in a frame just slightly larger a J frame is a big plus.
Much improved with some spring tweaking.

Addendum:
On the original topic, the reason I have owned many .38 specials is that I favor the round greatly. It’s my favorite revolver range ammo , and my carry is a J frame.
 
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I recently picked up this Smith Model 67-1 at a local pawn shop, and found that the sight elevator stud was stripped. But a call to Numrich, got me a new one in just 4 days!

The gun is a '77-'82 build, shipped to Louisville PD and shows very little wear but I wasn't too surprised to find that the DA and SA triggers are butter smooth. Police armorer or years of LEO carry and qualification shooting can do wonders for a revolver's trigger. For a police turn in, this one's in excellent shape, even the stocks are good to excellent. Too, I'd forgotten that the M-67 used the smaller dia. bbl. than Smith's .357 K frames...this 67 is 2.5 oz. lighter than my M-66 .357 as a result.

Initial trials went well with Lyman's 358091 button nose WC over 3.5 gr of Bullseye printing right at an inch at 10 yds, Weaver Stance, unsupported. And yesterday, 4.0 gr of Bullseye sent Lyman's justly famous 358156 GC LSWC into neat little 3/4" clusters at the same distance. Both loads are in the 800-900 fps range, but I have yet to chrono either. R-P brass, Win small primers and my own casting with wheel weight +1% tin alloy are the particulars for both loads. I size to 0.358" and use 50-50 lube for all my .38 spl & .357 guns. That's the LSWC in the pic below.

UPDATE 12/12/22: Chrono'd the above loads this afternoon. The Lyman 358091 wadcutter backed by 3.5 gr. of Bullseye went 774 fps average for 6-shots with an ext. spread of 40 fps. The LSWC, Lyman's 358156 without the gas check backed by 4.0 gr. of Bullseye showed 844 fps with an ext. spd of 60 fps. Both loads shot from my M-67 with 4" bbl.

We've got 357's a plenty here, but this .38 Spl's only stable mate is a Smith M-36 with adj. sights and a 3" bbl. I bought it new in '92 for my wife back then when she was on the road in eastern KY doing State Dept of Ed. work.

Nothing wrong with a good .38 Spl., and truth be told, the majority of my .357 Magnum shooting is with slightly heavy .38 Spl level loads. Best regards, Rod

IMG_E3178.jpg ​
 
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327F87CE-A88C-45D6-9486-0052462AF510.jpeg My most recent .38 find. Some guy bought this during the COVID madness, and then decided “he didn’t like having a gun around.” Never took it out of the box, never fired it. I couldn’t resist at $250 less than they can be found for at retail. I took it to the range and it shoots to POA at 10 yards, 2” groups offhand which is as well as I can shoot. I’ve been carrying a 3” King Cobra for a while, but this rides a little lighter and will get the job done if pressed into service.
 
Speedo66 said: ↑
Would I be wrong if I thought the only difference between a K frame in .38Spl. and .357 was the .357 was chambered an eighth of an inch deeper?

welldoya said:
Yes.
The .357's power is far superior to its
predecessor, the .38 Special. It fires at a
muzzle velocity of 810 feet per second and
can produce an impact force per square foot
of just 189 pounds. At 1,440 feet per second,
this .357 Magnum cartridge can strike with
575 pounds of force. Hence, more than
doubling the force and raising the speed far
above supersonic levels with roughly the
same cartridge was a significant feat.
Click to expand...

The inquiry was in reference to the K frame comparison , not the round/ballistics.
 
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