.380 good enough or 9mm not enough?

[snooperman]

If carrying the 9mm is too uncomfortable...

it is much better to carry a 380 than leave the 9mm in the car or at home. That said, there are quite a few 9mm that are not too much heavier than a 380 which will give more stopping power and much more penetration as well. Also , the Corbon 90 gr has good penetration and is worth a look for those who like the 380. That is what my wife has in her SIG P232. She also has a Ruger 38 special LCR loaded with +P and is quite good with it, This is her primary carry gun. There is no one gun to fit all. There are trade-offs either way one goes. I have several carry guns and am looking for the "perfect" one, which I probably will not find.

 

[snooperman]

Pilgram, I have to challenge your assumption...

that the 380 ACP has more stopping power than the 38 special, especially loaded with +P ammo.Every loading manual I have and every book that has charts on this refutes what you and your chart are saying. The 380ACP 90 gr hydra-shok is going 1000ft/sec at the muzzle with ME at 200ft/lbs energy and its stopping power is 68%. The 38 special FBI load that I carry is a 158 gr bullet at 1000 ft/sec and ME at 300ft/lbs and a stopping power of 79%. The 9mm is going 1200 ft/sec with a 115gr bullet with 390 ft/lbs energy. I got this same data from 4 different souces in my books at home and from Marshall and Sanows famous book on stopping power. Most law enforcement officers such as Massad Ayoob , Clint Smith, Wiley Clapp to name a few do not recommend the 380 for CCW because it does not have enough stopping power. It is a marginal caliber and puny in performance.

 

[KodiakBeer]

Snoop, if you look at those same rounds out of 3" barrels, you lose about 200fps in the 115 grain 9mm, and about 50fps in the 90 grain .380 (both are usually tested in 4" barrels) . So, in a pocket gun you get about 950 fps in .380 and 1000 fps in 9mm. The 9 still has 25 grains more weight so still has an edge, but the difference narrows considerably. I didn't look up .38 snubby's, but would expect a similar velocity loss.

Your little night test reassures me about the "fireball factor" (loss of night vision), so even a reduced advantage is still an advantage and puts the small 9's back on my shopping list. But... shorter barrels do reduce velocity, and the more powder the round uses, the greater the loss of velocity.

You'd think with the great growth in pocket CCW guns, that manufacturers would look into faster powders or low flash powders or what-have-you, but I'm not seeing that.

 

[snooperman]

Yes , good point Kodiak

The fact that most manufacturers are making the 380 in concealable, lightweight package, and a sort of rebirth of this caliber , is evidence that most people do not want the larger caliber guns . But one can get a 9mm in a lightweight gun , not much more than the 380 and have a much higher probability of stopping the bad guy. At any rate these are not range guns, they are strictly for carry. my 2 cents.

 

[rugerman]

I have both a keltec p3at (380) and a pf9 (9mm), I got the p3at first and like it a lot but due to problems finding ammo (and bullets for reloading) I got the pf9. I like both the pf9 fits my hand better and has better sights but due to its light weight it kicks pretty hard with the heaver bullets. I carry one or the other on a daily basis, mostly the pf9 but if it seems to be too large I feel good about carring the p3at. Both are plenty accurate for their intended purpose and their size.

 

[MCgunner]

But one can get a 9mm in a lightweight gun , not much more than the 380 and have a much higher probability of stopping the bad guy. At any rate these are not range guns, they are strictly for carry. my 2 cents.

I often see this and wonder how I'm going to be proficient with a gun if I don't take it to the range once in a while? I've fired my P11 more'n any other handgun I own except for my .22s. One way to make it comfy to shoot and be easy on the gun and make it easy to find brass is to download it. My practice load involves a 105SWC and 3.2 grains of Bullseye. Recoil is mild. I carry 115 grain +P stuff and shoot it occasionally.