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.40acp. or .45acp.

Discussion in 'Handguns: Autoloaders' started by bill111444, Dec 3, 2008.

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  1. bill111444

    bill111444 Member

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    Which, in your opinions, is the better round for carry and HD? Recoil is not a problem. I want the bad guy down and out NOW.
     
  2. Knives

    Knives Member

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    Which one do you shoot better with?
     
  3. geronimo509

    geronimo509 Member

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    airborne airborne all the way
    .45 .45 EVERYDAY
     
  4. esq_stu

    esq_stu Member

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    Good point. In addition, other factors I personally consider important:

    Which one is more widely available in greater variety?

    Which one is more widely reloaded and has more choices and availability of components?

    Which one does your local police department carry?
     
  5. punkndisorderly

    punkndisorderly Member

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    Assuming use of good defense ammo, the .45 will give you slightly better stopping power. However, the .40 is no slouch. I'd feel comfortable with a gun chambered in either.

    More important is what the gun you shoot best and trust most. That is the gun you should be using. Also keep in mind that as far as a carry gun, it should be something you're willing and able to carry. Too big, bulky, heavy and it's likely to be sitting at home on the nightstand when you need it most.
     
  6. Marcus L.

    Marcus L. Member

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    Unless you shoot them in the head, that will not happen unless they fall down voluntarily because they realize that they have been shot and are hoping that if they fall down you will not shoot them anymore and call an ambulance. The vast majority of shootings end because someone realizes that they have been shot and surrender by falling down.

    Other than good shot placement, the most reliable means of stopping someone as quickly as possible in a home defense situation(ranges less than 25yrds) is to use a 12-gauge shotgun with full power 00-Buck shot(preferable copper plated). It is the equivalent of being shot 9 times with a .32 caliber pistol in terms of how much stuff it damages with every shot.

    Whether you pick .40S&W or .45acp should be more based on the characteristics of the platform. Most .40S&W pistols fit the hand better, have more manageable size, and better magazine capacity. The .45acp makes a larger hole overall in the body, but the .40S&W shoots through barriers such as windshields and car doors better. Using heavier bullets the recoil feels very similar.......40S&W 180gr, and .45acp 230gr. Middle weight bullets such as the 9mm 124gr, .40S&W 155gr or 165gr, and .45acp 200gr tend to generate the most felt recoil. Given equal pistol weight and grip dimensions, a 9mm 124gr+P will feel more snappy than a .45acp 230gr, and a .40S&W 155gr will feel more snappy than a .45acp 230gr. However, if you use 9mm 147gr, .40S&W 180gr, and .45acp 230gr they are all pretty manageable with the 9mm being more controllable than the .40S&W, and the .40S&W being more controllable than the .45acp(once again, given equal pistol weights and grip dimensions). I generally prefer the .40S&W for duty carry and the 9mm for off duty carry with heavier bullet weights.

    FBI Test Protocol:
    Bare Gelatin = covered with T-shirt, Shot at 10ft
    Denim = 4 layers shot at 10ft
    Heavy Clothing = shot at 10ft
    Steel = 2 pieces of 20 gauge, shot at 10ft
    Wallboard = 2 pieces of 1/2" gypsum board, shot at 10ft
    Plywood = 1 piece of 3/4" AA fir plywood, shot at 10ft
    Automobile Glass = 1 piece of 1/4" laminated safety glass set at a 45 degree angle with an offset of 15 degrees, shot at 10ft

    9mm 147gr(990fps): (Penetration/Expansion)
    Bare Gel: 13.9”/.65”
    Through Denim: 14.5”/.66”
    Through Heavy Cloth: 14”/.66”
    Through Wallboard: 15”/.67”
    Through Plywood: 14.8”/.62”
    Through Steel: 17”/.45”
    Through Auto Glass: 10.8”/.52”

    .40S&W 180gr(990fps): (Penetration/Expansion)
    Bare Gel: 13.8”/.67”
    Through Denim: 14.3”/.70”
    Through Heavy Cloth: 13.4”/.64”
    Through Wallboard: 13.1”/.66”
    Through Plywood: 15.1”/.64”
    Through Steel: 17”/.52”
    Through Auto Glass: 12”/.61”

    .45acp 230gr(905fps): (Penetration/Expansion)
    Bare Gel: 11.6”/.75”
    Through Denim: 12.7”/.72”
    Through Heavy Cloth: 12.3”/.75”
    Through Wallboard: 15.2”/.69”
    Through Plywood: 18”/.453”
    Through Steel: 16.5”/.53”
    Through Auto Glass: 12”/.58”
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2008
  7. MMCSRET

    MMCSRET Member

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    I am not familiar with a "40acp." Please enlighten me, before I can offer an educated opinion. Thanks.
     
  8. geronimo509

    geronimo509 Member

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    he probably just made a mistake, i would put money on the fact that he doesnt know too much about firearms ( not that i do either) but you get the point. 40 s&w would be a good assumption.
     
  9. FoMoGo

    FoMoGo Member

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    I would not feel undergunned with either.
    That being said I will choose .45 acp every time.
    I have a fondness for large freight train bullets.
    You wont stop what you dont hit.
    Try a few different pistols, see what feels good and seems to point naturally.
    Then shoot the ones you narrow it down to.
    Buy the one you shoot best.


    Jim
     
  10. JackOfAllTradesMasterAtNone

    JackOfAllTradesMasterAtNone Member

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    45acp. from a 1911 is my chioce and most often available to me.

    But what sits in my wife's nightstand? A .38spl snub revolver.

    What is available elsewhere in the house? A .357mag snub revolver.

    A .40S&W wouldn't be a bad choice, but I've never liked the round for other reasons. I've never shot one as accurate as a good .45acp/1911.. Not that that is a factor for close quarter/in home defense.

    -Steve
     
  11. BlindJustice

    BlindJustice Member

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    Here's my standard reply....

    Here yah go buddy,

    Double Tap Ammo offeringss
    These are ALL Speer Gold Dot JHP
    .45 ACP ----- .40 S&W -- 9MM LUger +P
    185 gr 155 gr. 115 gr.
    1225 fps 1,275 fps 1,450 fps
    616 ft lbs 603 ft. lbs 511 ft lbs
    200 gr. 165 gr. 124 gr.
    1125 fps 1,200 fps 1,310 fps
    562 Ft lbs 528 fl lbs 473 ft lbs
    230 gr. 180 gr. 147 gr.
    1,010 fps 1,100 fps 1,135 fps
    521 ft lbs 484 ft lbs 421 ft lbs


    Light to Medium to heavy in each
    bullet caliber....

    Now find a platform you can hit something
    with

    I'll go back and read the thread now.

    Randall
     
  12. BlindJustice

    BlindJustice Member

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    oh my choice(s)

    S&W 1911 5" Bbl. .45 ACP
    Carry: DT 200 gr. GD JHPs

    CZ 75B 9mm Luger
    Carry: DT 147 gr. GD JHP

    I have yet to fire a handgun in .40 S&W
    so until I do I'll reserve comment on that
    round but on paper it seems adequate. In the
    meantime for .40 bullets I have a Bar Sto in
    .400 CorBon for my 1911
    155 gr.. Speer Gold Dot @ 1400 FPS

    Several people at the range have asked
    *** am I shooting for ammo with that barrel
    installed in the 1911. I qualified with a 1911
    in the USN so it's manual of arms is pretty much
    ingrained into the ol'lizard brain for a SHTF moment
    However the CZ 75B is a nice platform and it'll
    probably be the platform for me if I ever go the
    .40 S&W route.

    Randall
     
  13. hankdatank1362

    hankdatank1362 Member

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    I don't know what a .40ACP is. It could be THE awesome.

    But I carry a .40S&W every day in a P226. Suits my needs just fine.
     
  14. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    .45 over .40, but both are good rounds.
     
  15. trekgod3

    trekgod3 Member

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    How do you make a post as a "guest"? I've never noticed that option.
     
  16. putteral

    putteral Member

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    The bigger the hole the better for me.
    Never heard of a guest!
     
  17. janobles14

    janobles14 Member

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    i used to HATE the .40s&w and swore only by the .45. that was until i ran up on a ruger p94 for a song and decided to try out the caliber. it didnt take long for me to switch to 165 gr. gold dots in .40 s&w for daily carry.
     
  18. spiroxlii

    spiroxlii Member

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    Ok... within 24 hours, a thousand people will post here to say I'm wrong, but here's my $0.02 on the matter.

    .40S&W and .45ACP are both effective defensive rounds. I would feel comfortable carrying either one in a handgun that I was familiar and proficient with. The key to becoming familiar and proficient with your defensive handgun is to practice with it often. Practicing often in .40S&W and .45ACP can be very very expensive. If you can afford it, then by all means DO IT!

    If you, however, are on a budget (as many of us are in these difficult times), then you should consider a 9mm pistol. The caliber snobs will surely cry out that 9mm is weak and puny and ineffective. They will copy and paste numbers and statistics. They will call me foolish for regularly trusting my 9mm, .380ACP, and .38spl handguns with my safety. They will shoot down my argument about ammo costs by saying that "you can't put a price on your life."

    All the good pistol manufacturers make something in 9mm. Whatever you want (steel frame, polymer frame, DA/SA, DAO, SA, striker-fired, etc) can be had in 9mm. You can even get a 1911 in 9mm. With the wide variety of different bullets and loads available in 9mm cartridges now, you can surely find something to fit your needs, whether your personal philosophy favors "light and fast" bullets or "heavy and slow" bullets.

    You can afford to practice a lot more with 9mm. "Practice ammo" in the same bullet weight as the ammo you carry is far, far cheaper than .40S&W or .45ACP. "Premium" defensive ammo is also much cheaper in 9mm than it is in .40S&W or .45ACP.

    You can carry more rounds of 9mm in a magazine and on your person (this is mainly an advantage over .45ACP, since .40S&W handguns can carry almost as many rounds as a 9mm of the same size).

    Good 9mm defensive ammo packs an effective wallop. 9mm lovers and 9mm haters alike can come up with MOUNDS of data to support their positions. All I have to say is that thousands of dead people can't be wrong. 9mm works.
     
  19. Marcus L.

    Marcus L. Member

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    I agree with you Spiroxlii. The 9mm is a superior cartridge when it comes to many aspects of firearms use. You do get a "slight" advantage in using .40S&W over 9mm, and you get a "slight" advantage in using .45acp over .40S&W. However, those advantages are off-set by reduced handling which CAN have a higher probability of getting you killed that using a smaller caliber.

    You should ONLY move from the 9mm to larger calibers if, and only if you can shoot them equally as well. That means timed shooting. Most who claim they can shoot .40 and .45 equally as well as they can shoot 9mm do not participate in timed qualifications. Shooting accurately AND rapidly is of utmost importance and from what those who have been in actual shootings have learned is that sometimes your best just isn't enough. If you can shoot that accurately and rapidly, then you do gain some terminal effects advantages in using the larger diameter calibers. I tend to stick with the 9mm and .40S&W. I have yet to find a .45acp pistol that meets my needs as well as the 9mm and .40S&W when it comes to law enforcement......or gives me the comfort, handling, and concealability of a concealed weapon.

    However, the author of this thread does not want a 9mm. He doesn't even care about recoil, he just wants something that puts the badgun down and out NOW. So, I guess that takes any hangun and caliber off the list.

    Train smart, train a lot, and train as though your life depended on it.
     
  20. trekgod3

    trekgod3 Member

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    I kinda had the feeling this thread was started to get a flame-war going debating which round is better. The posting as a "guest" thing was a good tip-off.
     
  21. bubbat190

    bubbat190 Member

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    I just picked up a Springfield armorey EMP in 40 S&W and love it not as much recoil as compared to the .45 ACP and really the differance between 40 S&W and 45 ACP as far as ballistics the .45 ACP is really not all that much "better". but when it comes down to it it all about what you feel comfortable and confident with.
     
  22. 7.62Reaper

    7.62Reaper member

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    I would just use an old piece of rope. Shooting makes it hard to clean up... Blood splatter and brain matter = no fun.
     
  23. Treo

    Treo member

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    guest= banned
     
  24. KBintheSLC

    KBintheSLC Member

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    I prefer the 9mm for casual carry and target practice. If I want a caliber that starts with a "4" I will use my 10mm auto.
     
  25. trekgod3

    trekgod3 Member

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    Ahhh....That answers my question. It seems my theory is correct.:rolleyes:
     
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