CountryUgly
Member
I've seen a lot of deer fall to the old .410 and I'd expect it would have the same effect on a man. 3 inch buck shot out of a .410 ain't no joke. I think it'll work just fine.
410 for defense?
- Thread starter TreeDoc
- Start date
- Status
The four pellet 2-1/2 inch load from Federal has a higher velocity than the 3-inch stuff.
Plus the 2-1/2 inch load allows a pump or autoloader to be loaded to it's total magazine capacity.
The 2-1/2 inch shell offers the best properties of the .410 defensive load even though it carries one less pellet than the 3-inch shell.
Plus the 2-1/2 inch load allows a pump or autoloader to be loaded to it's total magazine capacity.
The 2-1/2 inch shell offers the best properties of the .410 defensive load even though it carries one less pellet than the 3-inch shell.
Last edited:
Fred Fuller
Moderator Emeritus
Nothing at all wrong with a good .410 for defensive use, in steady hands. But the shooter is still far more important than the gun. She needs good training, to build skill and confidence.
The new PDN video on pump shotguns is a good starting point for beginners, if that's the action style she's getting - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=659169.
The new PDN video on pump shotguns is a good starting point for beginners, if that's the action style she's getting - http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=659169.
OP
OP
TreeDoc
Member
Thanks for all the replies. As to fit, yes she was using my shotguns, but both are fitted with limb savers to tame recoil, but they are probably an inch to long. Fundamentals, I feel that I have a fair amount of experience and have taught her well, she does very good on the ruger 10 22. I think recoil is a very subjective thing. On forums, I always read about someone's 12 year old dauther the shoots full house 44 magnums all day with no complaint. I grew up hunting and shooting and I don't prefer the 44 magnum. I think we'll be going shopping for a 410.
Nicky Santoro
Member
OP,
5 pellets of 000 in the airbags? Is 12 ga more effective? Yes. Is .410 shabby? Not hardly. I'm guessing that Mr. Intruder would have some issues catching his breath after a dose of that magic.
5 pellets of 000 in the airbags? Is 12 ga more effective? Yes. Is .410 shabby? Not hardly. I'm guessing that Mr. Intruder would have some issues catching his breath after a dose of that magic.
Deltaboy1984
Member
Any pump or auto loading 410 with buckshot and rifled slugs will do the job inside a home.
As I posted the other day I seen a guy in the cooler with 6 22 long rifles in his chest. The Dr said the police said he took 2 steps and dropped dead.
As I posted the other day I seen a guy in the cooler with 6 22 long rifles in his chest. The Dr said the police said he took 2 steps and dropped dead.
Texan Scott
Member
On a related note, can anyone point me at a good 410 bore pump for HD/ truck gun? I know mossberg makes a couple, but i'm not pleased with either, for a couple reasons. remi870 is a kid's trap gun, not really a social gun... i'd have thought that with the judge/sw govnr thing being so popular, somebody would make a good 18.5", extend-tube cylander bore without unneccessary googaws.
The Mossberg .410 while out of the box isn't really a great truck gun. It's a bit "long".
I needed a new "Jeep" gun after deciding that my .22 AR-7 was a bit light (mine is accurate and reliable). While casting about I came across my first shotgun a Model 500 .410. With the original barrel, even broken down into two pieces it was still "long".
What I did was shorten the barrel to 18.5". Picked up a synthetic youth stock. Made a new stock bolt that was longer and ended in a sort of butterfly arrangement. And lastly, I removed the buttplate screws and use heavy duty velcro to attach it.
What I ended up with is a shotgun that breaks down to about 20" in length. Takes about 30 seconds to assemble (if I need a quick reation weapon, that's what my handgun is for). And with an assortment of shot and slugs is capable of handling everything from birds to bunnies to bears (well, tiny bears anyway.
So, here it is, "THE PERFECT JEEP GUN".
Shown with my AR-7 for size comparison.
Mine's a Charter Arms. I got a good one. I think you have a better chance of getting one that functions reliably and is accurate if you get an old C A rather than the newer Henrys or Suvival Arms.
Echoing others, for home defense a .410 shotgun using 2-3/4" buck load (I'm a fan of Federal's) is an excellent platform: light; very low recoil; posts good ballistic numbers in standardized tests.
Suggest one of the Mossberg 500E variants; either the Cruiser with the bantam synthetic buttstock added, or the Field swapped out with an 18.5" barrel.
Suggest one of the Mossberg 500E variants; either the Cruiser with the bantam synthetic buttstock added, or the Field swapped out with an 18.5" barrel.
Old judge creek
Member
Tellya this... I'd LOVE to have a 410 SxS Coach Gun choked Full and Modified and wearing a slender 19th century style stock and forend.
The Stoeger's I looked at were the closest I've seen to even approach that configuration. I have a Stoeger Uplander 410 with (I think) 24" barrels fore sure with Full & Mod chokes. Its one of the most fun bird guns I ever owned.
I patterned a variety of loads with it at a measured 100 feet. The 3" #3 Buck loads surprised me. I'd feel very comfortable defending myself with them in close quarters if I had a shotgun built for CQ work.
Red Circled hits were fired from the right barrel (Modified Choke)
Black Circled Hits were fired from the left barrel (Full Choke)
Range was a measured 100 feet
Across the room or down a hallway, these would be about fist sized groups, if that.
The Stoeger's I looked at were the closest I've seen to even approach that configuration. I have a Stoeger Uplander 410 with (I think) 24" barrels fore sure with Full & Mod chokes. Its one of the most fun bird guns I ever owned.
I patterned a variety of loads with it at a measured 100 feet. The 3" #3 Buck loads surprised me. I'd feel very comfortable defending myself with them in close quarters if I had a shotgun built for CQ work.
Red Circled hits were fired from the right barrel (Modified Choke)
Black Circled Hits were fired from the left barrel (Full Choke)
Range was a measured 100 feet
Across the room or down a hallway, these would be about fist sized groups, if that.
After reading all of these posts I have come away with a wee bit more respect for the old 410.
I will be going to the local gun show this weekend and if there is an old non rust bucket 410 in single shot available for a reasonable price( sub $100 or close enough) I think I might just bite.
What the hell.
I will be going to the local gun show this weekend and if there is an old non rust bucket 410 in single shot available for a reasonable price( sub $100 or close enough) I think I might just bite.
What the hell.
.410 from a shotgun barrel has about the same muzzle energy as .41 Mag.
There's nothing anemic about that.
I bought my wife the Mossberg HS410. She won't shoot my 590 or my 870, but she likes the HS410.
She's a lot better protected with a .410 that she's not afraid to shoot, than she is with a 12 or 20 that she is afraid to shoot.
There's nothing anemic about that.
I bought my wife the Mossberg HS410. She won't shoot my 590 or my 870, but she likes the HS410.
She's a lot better protected with a .410 that she's not afraid to shoot, than she is with a 12 or 20 that she is afraid to shoot.
I still have a soft spot for an ex (the soft spot most likely being my head but at any rate) I've been thinking of having an inexpensive single shot done up to work well with larger sized shot (slugs and '000' buck for the most part) she lives in Southern California and I have problems sleeping at night knowing that she doesn't have anything to really defend herself with out there (shy of a short Ka-bar that I bought for her when we lived together)
Am I an idiot for wanting to help?
Am I an idiot for wanting to help?
Crowcifier666
Member
Yes.
idk. I tested a bunch of 12 and 20 gauge slugs to see if they matched up with the published specs and not one brand did. They were usually 200ish fps slow.
So, now that you are using something comparable to pistol velocities, why not use a PCC? .410 would "git 'er done" but a PCC would have similar (or better) penetration, less noise, less recoil and a larger magazine. Probably cheaper to practice with too.
So, now that you are using something comparable to pistol velocities, why not use a PCC? .410 would "git 'er done" but a PCC would have similar (or better) penetration, less noise, less recoil and a larger magazine. Probably cheaper to practice with too.
In some states many PCC's aren't an option...if they are you have a 10 round limit, bullet buttons, or other wonderful restrictions. My glorious state contains over 12% of the US population so 1 in 8 people have limited options in that department just counting us.
Mohawk
Member
Lots of various factors to consider when choosing shotgun calibers for HD.
I had an "Expert" survey my situation and limitations and he custom built me the perfect HD platform for my circumstances.
My situation was
1. I'm old, with medical challenges
2. Because of my blood thinner meds, whenever I shoot 12 ga. my whole shoulder turns Black and Blue and hurts for days afterwards.
3. I've sold the big homestead and moved into a much smaller home in a high density neighborhood
4. The HD platform must be effective for all to use if need be. That includes the 5'0" wife.
5. Must not overpenetrate and kill my neighbors through the walls.
6. Must be light and easy to handle with lots of firepower.
7. Must pattern well at ranges between 10 and 30 feet. This gun pattarns orange sized at 30 feet.
8. Must stop a meth crazed intruder dead in his tracks.
9. must travel well when we go on long trips. We don't do Hiltons because of finances. We do Motel 6s or Best Westerns on the edge of strange towns. The shotgun comes in at night with our luggage.
Here is what he built for me. It's always loaded with Winchester XXX OO Buck, 5 pellets to the 3" load.
Saiga, 410 with 8.5" barrel, Choate folder, 10rd mag, HK foregrip with HK sights. SBS stamp lives with the gun.
We keep the shotgun readily available in hanging brackets by the door , inside the bedroom with no mag in it to keep it safe from the Grandkids when they visit. The full mag is well hidden, a second away.
LOL, someone said that it looked like a Russian Saiga and a German HK got drunk one night and had a baby. I like that
I'm not saying that this is the very best option and "better" than a 12ga. But for us, it is the perfect platform that meets all our needs. Others have different needs and will use a different HD weapon. We practice with it often and it is lots of fun to shoot. On family outings, everyone gets in line to shoot the watermellons with it.
I had an "Expert" survey my situation and limitations and he custom built me the perfect HD platform for my circumstances.
My situation was
1. I'm old, with medical challenges
2. Because of my blood thinner meds, whenever I shoot 12 ga. my whole shoulder turns Black and Blue and hurts for days afterwards.
3. I've sold the big homestead and moved into a much smaller home in a high density neighborhood
4. The HD platform must be effective for all to use if need be. That includes the 5'0" wife.
5. Must not overpenetrate and kill my neighbors through the walls.
6. Must be light and easy to handle with lots of firepower.
7. Must pattern well at ranges between 10 and 30 feet. This gun pattarns orange sized at 30 feet.
8. Must stop a meth crazed intruder dead in his tracks.
9. must travel well when we go on long trips. We don't do Hiltons because of finances. We do Motel 6s or Best Westerns on the edge of strange towns. The shotgun comes in at night with our luggage.
Here is what he built for me. It's always loaded with Winchester XXX OO Buck, 5 pellets to the 3" load.
Saiga, 410 with 8.5" barrel, Choate folder, 10rd mag, HK foregrip with HK sights. SBS stamp lives with the gun.
We keep the shotgun readily available in hanging brackets by the door , inside the bedroom with no mag in it to keep it safe from the Grandkids when they visit. The full mag is well hidden, a second away.
LOL, someone said that it looked like a Russian Saiga and a German HK got drunk one night and had a baby. I like that
I'm not saying that this is the very best option and "better" than a 12ga. But for us, it is the perfect platform that meets all our needs. Others have different needs and will use a different HD weapon. We practice with it often and it is lots of fun to shoot. On family outings, everyone gets in line to shoot the watermellons with it.
Attachments
Last edited:
au_prospector
Member
Hey still looking for a softer than 12 GA HD shotty?
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=663363
One just posted on our forums Rem 870 18 inch bbl in 20 GA.
Might work for you. I have heard most Remmys in this config are 12 GA.
http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=663363
One just posted on our forums Rem 870 18 inch bbl in 20 GA.
Might work for you. I have heard most Remmys in this config are 12 GA.
- Status
