45-70 crimp

[txgho1911]

I am reading everything I can find on reactions to heavy and medium crimps. I found nothing specificaly on 45-70. Only cross refrences to it from other calibers. I am shooting a 1895 marlin so I need everything crimped well for the tube magazine.
I am loading up Hornady 300gr jhp, CCI large rifle, IMR 3031. Once fired winchester brass.
So far from the last Siera book I am loading up 49.5gr, 50gr, 52gr, 54gr, 55gr, 56gr, 57gr, and 58gr. Maximum listed is 60gr.
I started with 50 bullets and may buy another weight later to try also.
This is my first loading session ever so I am pretty sore with the gas shortages and prices as I am sitting on my 65 gal loaded pickup instead of driving to the range. It's a hour drive to the nearest public range in central Indiana.

Can a heavy crimp with this slower powder cause me grief?
Should I be crimping as light as possible for these loads to ride in the tube?

 

[critter]

My 45-70 is a Ruger #1 so I don't crimp. However, most folk will tell you that SLOW powders benefit greatly from a good strong crimp. These powders need resistance to get burning efficiently (as if the big ole heavy 45-70 bullets don't offer much resistance!) Try it though.

 

[RecoilRob]

I use the Lee Factory Crimp die on all my 45-70's and like it a lot. The 1895G I have kicks pretty hard with the heavy loads and the heavy crimp keeps the bullets from setting back in the case.

Plus, powder ignition cannot be hurt by a tight grip on the bullet. It can only be helped and your loads should be more consistant with them heavily crimped.

 

[Murphster]

I'm on my second Guide Gun and have owned two other 45-70 rifles- a full size Marlin and a Browning BPCR. Without exception, none of them like crimping. With the Browning, I only had to use neck tension since it was a single shot. With the Marlins, I experiment with reducing the crimp until it's the least amount of crimp that will keep the bullet from setting back. I use the scientific method of starting with a very light crimp (on a round with no primer or powder), and pushing the bullet nose firmly against my reloading bench to see if it sets back in the case. If it does, I add a smidge more crimp, and repeat until it doesn't set back. Once I get the lightest crimp that holds a bullet properly in place, I lock all the dies down and I'm ready to reload.


(My Guide Gun likes the 300 grain Hornady JHP with 49.6 grains of IMR 4198.)

 

[txgho1911]

My first reloads on the 45-70 where sweet. Every load seals the case to chamber much better than the factory loads. I pushed a 300gr jhp with imr3031 with 8 loads from 49.5 up to 58gr. I found several good groups and most where over 5-8" groups with one winner. 54gr made a 2" group so from there I will be loading @ 1/2 gr intervals from 53gr - 54.5. That will cover the loads I didn't try before and maybe I will find an even better group to settle with. I am out of the first bullets and primers I got so I have to go order some more.

 

[Geno]

Ditto on the Ruger #1, .45-70

I owned a Ruger #1. I did want to crimp. I simply could not becuase my dies did not. Several other .45-70 aficionados have repeatedly told me that my loads would be improved by crimping. I never did find out. I would be interested in hearing your future experiences.

Doc2005

 

[BluesBear]

Winchester and Remington have always used a good roll crimp on their factory ammo. There must be a reason.

The key to good ammunition is consistency. Making sure the bullet stays in place and doesn't setback into the case nor creep forward under recoil will help keep pressures consistent.
Consistent pressures mean consistent velocities.
Consistent velocity means better accuracy.

And the slower the burning rate the more important crimp/neck tension becomes.

 

[txgho1911]

I am going to continue with my firm crimp.

I am also going to wander from the IMR3031. Spoke to Dave at IMR today and he confirmed the Trail Boss would be for Lead bullets only. So I will keep looking for the cleanest alternates for this 45-70 and the 45acp. Might buy into clays or something else bulky enough to stay out of the hot water.
Started out with Unique on the 45acp and I'll sell the rest -90% 1lb can for 5$. Someone will allready buy it.
So far I have several personal loads from different folks but I am lazy and out of time with the clean up. I greased up Sat night just in case I never get time to clean it again till next range trip for more load development. Light oil when I set up on the range but between cleanups I am using the Rig grease. I am looking for the cleanest good powders for the 45acp and alternatives for the 45-70.

So far I am finding a mass cunfusion of different opines here and other resources. I am not into the race gun and other competitions yet but I want to use material as close to carry as I can make.
Universal and regular clays is mentioned many times. Are these going to require a full cleanup every range trip?