45 ACP and 45-70 handloads

[Hog huntin Harry]

Is it possible to load 45 ACP bullets in 45-70 cartridges ?
45-70 uses a .458 bullet while a 45 ACP uses a .451 bullet, so would the .007 difference be a deal breaker ?

 

[Obturation]

Nope. You could squish the smaller bullet then size it back down but it won't be an ideal weight or have a crimp groove.

 

[Hog huntin Harry]

Nope. You could squish the smaller bullet then size it back down but it won't be an ideal weight or have a crimp groove.

If I did do that would I get any real velocity increase with a 230 grain HP ?

 

[gotboostvr]

If I did do that would I get any real velocity increase with a 230 grain HP ?

You'd be able to sling them well past the velocities they were designed for, sure. They'd work if you want to turn your 45-70 into a varmint rifle.

 

[Obturation]

If I did do that would I get any real velocity increase with a 230 grain HP ?

Well you would be able to get some high velocity but I doubt you'd get good accuracy. Squishing the bullet isn't a repeatable thing and the jacket may be damaged and will lose concentric balance. Plus then you'd have to size it back down anyway, it's just not a realistic thing as far as it being worth it. You would have to develop a load as data won't exist either.
You can get 200something grain 45-70 bullets if you want velocity.
One thing that could be possible could be paper patching and sizing but that's generally done with cast bullets and I have never paper patched anything and I could be way off. Hopefully someobe with experience could speak to the possibility of doing that. The 45-70 really lines big heavy bullets and if you want to try to replicate 460 s&w mag ballistics the bullets used wouldn't be suitable for 45 cap velocities anyway.
So overall I've gotta say just not worth trying . If you do try something like this be careful, without loading data you could do some real damage to yourself and your gun.

 

[Hog huntin Harry]

You'd be able to sling them well past the velocities they were designed for, sure. They'd work if you want to turn your 45-70 into a varmint rifle.

Perfect

 

[Hog huntin Harry]

Looked up some 250 grain 45-70 bullets, found some Hornady 250 grain mono flex bullets. I'm just going to get those instead of loading inaccurate pistol bullets that could destroy my gun and kill me.

 

[Obturation]

Looked up some 250 grain 45-70 bullets, found some Hornady 250 grain mono flex bullets. I'm just going to get those instead of loading inaccurate pistol bullets that could destroy my gun and kill me.

250 May be about as light as you can go because the twist rate of the barrel may have trouble stabilizing such a light bullet. Copper bullets are longer at lower weights and can stabilize when a jacketed bullet having a lead core will be denser and so shorter.
Do you have a specific use or just exploring the possibilities ?

 

[gotboostvr]

Looked up some 250 grain 45-70 bullets, found some Hornady 250 grain mono flex bullets. I'm just going to get those instead of loading inaccurate pistol bullets that could destroy my gun and kill me.

That's probably the most practical way to go about it. Definitely less work.

I wouldn't think it'd be any more dangerous than working up an oddball loading for any other cartridge. Stick to similar powders as the next heavier bullet, start low and work your way up.

It's not the craziest load I've thought of doing with a 45-70, that's for sure.

 

[Hog huntin Harry]

That's probably the most practical way to go about it. Definitely less work.

I wouldn't think it'd be any more dangerous than working up an oddball loading for any other cartridge. Stick to similar powders as the next heavier bullet, start low and work your way up.

It's not the craziest load I've thought of doing with a 45-70, that's for sure.

What's the craziest 45-70 load you've come up with ? I'm intrigued

 

[gotboostvr]

What's the craziest 45-70 load you've come up with ? I'm intrigued

I was thinking about getting a fast twist T/C Encore barrel, and loading 200-250gr .358 Sabots. Pretty much a straight-wall 35 Whelen.

I live in a straight walled cartridge only state for deer gun season.

 

[Obturation]

I load these, they're pretty wicked. Massive hollow point. Not cheap though, I don't waste them on paper.

 

[mcb]

Random thoughts, .451 bullet will not work very well in a .458 barrel. The bore diameter (lands, top of the riflings) on a .458 barrel is .450-.452 inch in diameter depending on who's barrel. That means at best case with a .451 diameter bullet you .0005-inch engagement with the rifling and potentially no engagement. Typically a bullet has roughly .004-inch engagement with the rifling in most cases.

Whether you upset and resize .451 bullets or find lighter .458 diameter bullets they should stabilize fine. Remember the longer/heavier a bullet gets the faster is needs to be spun. A lighter/shorter bullet does not need to spin as fast to be stable. You are unlikely shooting far enough to realize the effects of an over-stabilized bullet.

Barnes bullets are one of my favorite, Obturation has made a good recommendation IMHO if you can afford them.

 

[1KPerDay]

I wonder if a HBRN would work okay in the .458 bore. Kind of like a mini-Minie.

 

[Ohen Cepel]

This gentleman wrote a very enjoyable book on his life with a 45-70. He had some interesting pet loads for taking just about anything. Not a reloading manual but may have some info in it for you. I would check his loads but loaned it out and don't have it on hand now; https://www.amazon.com/Forty-Years-45-Paul-Matthews/dp/0935632840

 

[Obturation]

This gentleman wrote a very enjoyable book on his life with a 45-70. He had some interesting pet loads for taking just about anything. Not a reloading manual but may have some info in it for you. I would check his loads but loaned it out and don't have it on hand now; https://www.amazon.com/Forty-Years-45-Paul-Matthews/dp/0935632840

Excellent read for any 45-70 guys. I keep mine handy. - books & tools never get returned, I loan neither. If there's anything specific in there you want me to check on, I can.

 

[Obturation]

This page does describe paper patching a bullet of .450 diameter

 

[Swampman]

Is it possible to load 45 ACP bullets in 45-70 cartridges ?
45-70 uses a .458 bullet while a 45 ACP uses a .451 bullet, so would the .007 difference be a deal breaker ?

What's the reasoning/intended purpose behind the use of such light bullets?

The .45/70 gained it's reputation as a reliable killer with 400+ grain bullets. I doubt that lighter, faster, cup and core bullets are going to improve on that.

If the desire is reduced recoil loads for practice or small varmint control, then I'll agree that lighter bullets might be desirable.

 

[Hog huntin Harry]

What's the reasoning/intended purpose behind the use of such light bullets?

The .45/70 gained it's reputation as a reliable killer with 400+ grain bullets. I doubt that lighter, faster, cup and core bullets are going to improve on that.

If the desire is reduced recoil loads for practice or small varmint control, then I'll agree that lighter bullets might be desirable.

It's for pesky yotes trying to make a meal out of my kitties

 

[Obturation]

It's for pesky yotes trying to make a meal out of my kitties

What kind of distances are you thinking?

 

[Hog huntin Harry]

What kind of distances are you thinking?

About 30-50 yards

 

[Obturation]

Maybe just round ball would be the ticket.
Like these https://www.buffaloarms.com/muzzlel...dy-swaged-lead-round-balls-box-of-100-hor6080
A few grains of fast burning powder should give you a decent light load good for 50 yards.

 

[Obturation]

Or get the .480 balls and size them down, it would take a little work but you can assure a good fit then

 

[Hog huntin Harry]

Or get the .480 balls and size them down, it would take a little work but you can assure a good fit then

How could anything less than a super duper 600 lightning bolt express Magnum "sniper" rifle even scratch one of those 300 pound invincible yotes ?

 

[Riomouse911]

Get the Barnes 250's. They'll shoot faster than anything else will in the .45/70 for sure.

I just loaded some heavy weight bullets; 450 gr Acme coated LFN over 34.1 gr IMR 4198, W-W cases, CCI LR primers. They pack a bit of a punch at the muzzle end, but aren't abusive in the recoil department.

Stay safe.