45 acp case bulge when seating

[cardinalorange]

Progressive (Hornady LNL)
cases gauge fine after sizing
These are the heavy crimped ones, I'll respond with pics of those that aren't crimped at all when I switch back over- I need to make a mess of 9mm first. It sounds like there isn't any voodoo though, so it's an issue with either the gauge, the bullets, or the crimp. Thanks all.

 

[Charlie98]

Something weird with the crimp. It looks like the flare isn't being removed with that edge hanging out.

That was my first thought.

Ultimately, the critical question is whether or not they fit in the barrel. If they fit in the barrel, you can ignore whether or not they fit in the case gauge.

+1

 

[Charlie98]

Looking at the first photo... with my glasses on this time... I can actually see the 'skirt' at the base of the cartridge. With the LNL, and although you have successfully loaded other cartridges... are you sure the sizer die is set down far enough to hit the shellplate with a cartridge case in the die?

The caveat to all this, of course, is if it will eventually fit in your pistol. Personally, I would tap the brakes on the .45ACP loading until you have the firearm handy, and see if it plunks there.

 

[Englishmn]

Progressive (Hornady LNL)
cases gauge fine after sizing
These are the heavy crimped ones, I'll respond with pics of those that aren't crimped at all when I switch back over- I need to make a mess of 9mm first. It sounds like there isn't any voodoo though, so it's an issue with either the gauge, the bullets, or the crimp. Thanks all.

Don't try to heavy crimp just remove the flare.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

1. Need pics
2. What data source? 1.21 seems a little short for a 230gr RMR FMJ—possibly
3. As noted—bell the case as little as possible
4. Seating and crimping as separate steps might help, but if the COAL is too short, might not
5. Sounds like a seating/crimping die setup issue. Pull the die and start over with setting it up. Follow die manufacturer’s instructions. If the die is set for too much crimp, it will always bulge the case because crimp will start too early in the stroke and the bullet will still push down on an already tight crimp as it continues to seat. Result=bulged case. This is usually not a problem with a taper crimp die, but it could be.

It is very likely too short unless this bullet has an extremely flat nose. Speer lists 1.260 and Hornady list 1.230" for their respective standard 230gr. FMJ so there is some variation but, a full 20 thousandths short from Hornady's data?

The listing in the pic is of a specific Hornady FMJ-RN bullet, not necessarily the one RMR is selling. Try longer COL.

 

[Docendo Discimus]

It looks like the case is being crushed by the seating die. The area by the case head looks like it is ballooning out and the case mouth is pushing out away from the bullet. I think the seating die is suspect.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

Looking at the first photo... with my glasses on this time... I can actually see the 'skirt' at the base of the cartridge. With the LNL, and although you have successfully loaded other cartridges... are you sure the sizer die is set down far enough to hit the shellplate with a cartridge case in the die?

The caveat to all this, of course, is if it will eventually fit in your pistol. Personally, I would tap the brakes on the .45ACP loading until you have the firearm handy, and see if it plunks there.

I saw that too and I "think" it might be an optical illusion.

 

[Misplacedtexan]

I always seat then crimp separately.

 

[joneb]

when I measure a 45 acp case at the base I get .473", and towards the case mouth where the bullet is seated I measure .473" and where my crimp is at the very end the case I measure .471"
Normally with a round nose bullet I will seat the bullet at bearing surface of the bullet and not on the ogive.
The inside case diameter should be a concern as it decreases towards the case head.
The pictures of your loaded rounds seem off to me, something is amiss.

 

[CQB45ACP]

We (well I) wait with bated breath for the next report. Still seems like just one thing is causing the problem, not many different things. It’d just be too much to expect many different things would accumulate each and every time and end up with the identical problem. The probability is too remote in my mind.

 

[film495]

it took me a while to figure out how to make the marker test work. eventually I figured out you plunk it and when it sticks, just rotate it back and forth like 1/16" to put a wear mark on it, and it is very telling. I worked through an issue like this when I could not see the bulge, but the cartridges were all failing plunk tests, and one way to work through the crimp concern, is to put a few dummy rounds through the process, and lossen the crimp die, and start with barely touching the round, and keep going with more crimp slowly until it will plunk in and out, and then keep going slowly with more crimp again until it fails. this will give you a reasonable measure of how many turns are the functional window for crimping to pass, and also - you'll have a feel for how hard the arm on the press should be when crimping, and you'll know if you hit a case that is longer and may have bulged the case with too much crimp. I also, do seat and crimp separately for cartridges that for whatever reason are failing plunking until it all gets worked out, then depending on set up - may go back to doing both at the same time, once the formula for success is realized.

 

[jmorris]

A couple of things about this photo.



First it’s not likely your dies are doing anything to that area of the case. A good portion of that area will be in the shell holder and the bottom of the die isn’t a square shoulder, there will be a radius entry to the die and that won’t contact the case either. The reading seems small for a 45 ACP case but if the instrument only has a resolution to the hundredth, who knows if is rounds up or truncates? Might get a tool that can give you more information.

How about taking a photo like this, holding the round inside the parallel jaws of the calipers, with a back ground that will show us profile irregularities.



Also worth noting how you are measuring.

Like the photo above the lower “knife edge” portion is generally where you want to measure from. While a decent pair will still be accurate in the flat, on the round object being measured you won’t be measuring diameter because the knife edge is to the rear, not centered.

So in the photo above the rim is not in contact with the caliper. The same round in contact shows the rim to be a larger diameter.

 

[joneb]

Here is a pic of a 45 acp with a 200 Xtreme RN at 1.263" and a slight taper crimp,
I was shooting for 1.265"

 

[WrongHanded]

Looking at the first photo... with my glasses on this time... I can actually see the 'skirt' at the base of the cartridge. With the LNL, and although you have successfully loaded other cartridges... are you sure the sizer die is set down far enough to hit the shellplate with a cartridge case in the die?

That's what I saw too. Also makes perfect sense why the cartridge won't go all the way into the case gauge, but will go most of the way. The OP needs to put his calipers right there and check it.

I saw that too and I "think" it might be an optical illusion. View attachment 1010257

I think I see a change in the gap under the line you drew. Seriously though, calipers will tell the truth on that one.

 

[KY DAN]

Could be bullet being seated cocked, I love lyman m dies fir any hand gun caliber because bullets just go straight.

Crimp is a big one, I have never had any luck seating and crimping same time divide it up and see if issues are prevalent.

 

[Walkalong]

Your round looks OK, although I would lengthen it a little bit, maybe 1.240. Maybe ease up on the crimp a hair.
The base does look fat compared to where the sizer squeezed the case down, but that isn't unusual. It's possible
someone fired .45 Super loads in the brass and expanded the case head, making it fail the gauge. It's also possible
the gauge is simply tight. As others have posted, if they fit the barrel, they'll work. I would be very curious why they
did not fit the gauge though. I don't have a .45 ACP case gauge, so I have no idea if mine would fit one.

Berrys 230 Gr @ 1.260/1.265 OAL. I should have measured the case head.

 

[Blue68f100]

I don't know if you tried it but try putting the round in base down into the case gauge. This will tell you if the base is expanded, or the extractor grove has a problem. In some case with steel case gauges you can spin the bullet with the base in the gauge and clean up the problem.