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45 acp set-back problem-ugh

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C

corpo

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Oct 23, 2011
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I need the collective help and opinion of the wise ones. You know who you are.
Here are examples of my 45 acp loads that are vexing me.
Round on left is loaded to 1.262 topped with a 230 plated pill.
Round on right is same load once chambered in my Sr1911 and post chambered measures 1.241.
Crimp is .470
Range brass loaded indeterminate number of times.
Have run this and other loads thru several k times very sucessfully and am not really that worried about excessive pressures or functioning,
I just don't like it! Ugly and looks and feels wrong to me.
Plunk test is fine. I don't understand why one chambering sets it back.
Ideas?
 

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Well, you obviously do not have enough neck tension. Is it RP brass perhaps. It tends to be the thinnest. I have one .45 sizer that is fine with all but RP .45 brass.

If not, either your sizer is too big, or your expander is too big, or perhaps a bit of both.

Pull that bullet. Size the case and seat a new bullet without expanding. Then try chambering it a couple of times. If you do not get setback the expander is the problem and you need to polish it down some.
 
From what I have read many things can cause the problem you are describing.
1- plated bullets are slick and many people report problems with set back using them.
2- make sure you are full length resizing you cases and that it measures as it should be about .002 smaller than the bullet before expanding.
3- don't over crimp. Over crimping can decrease bullet tension. Lead
will size smaller and stay there , brass will spring back.
4-'don't over expand the case for bullet seating. Just enough to seat without shaving the projectile is all you want.
These are a few things I have read to check when having set back problems.
 
What Walkalong said about the expander being to big, as I had this issue too when I was loading .45's on my RCBS Rockchucker using Lee dies. When I went to loading on my Dillon 550B still using the Lee dies minus the expander because the Dillon needs its own conversion expander die for the powder hopper, my set-back problems went away. LM
 
I concur the neck tension is subpar. The only other thing I would add is that you might want to measure the diameter on that batch of bullets. I received a batch one time and several were .008" smaller than they should have been. Needless to say after all the headaches and figuring out the problem I received 2000 rounds in place of the one bad 1000 round box.
 
I have read on this board I believe as well as other boards that the plated bullets are squishier and the plating has more lubricity to it than extruded jacketed bullets. The squish factor is a result of the thinner covering of the lead core.
 
I have not had any problems with neck tension and plated bullets and I use the same expander for lead, plated and jacketed. If squishy was bad for neck tension, soft alloy lead bullets would be problematic, and they are not.
 
Here is a post from here all be it an old one where the guy talked about the softness of the plated bullet and the slipperiness of it. Hey I'm not saying this is this posters problem just another possibility of many. In all cases neck tension is the culprit of set back issues. But adding a slippery projectile to a situation of marginal neck tension won't help any.

http://www.thehighroad.org/archive/index.php/t-44851.html
 
Here's my take on it.

1. I have never noticed any difference in 'slipperiness' between copper plated bullets, and jacketed bullets.
At all.
Because there isn't any.

2. I have noticed in every set of Lee dies I own, the expander was too big, and left rough as a cob.
To the extent of filing off brass frags inside the case in some calibers.

3. My personal opinion is, the expander on any straight-wall pistol die set, should be small enough to not expand at all.

4. If it isn't, make it so with fine emery cloth & an electric drill.

5. It should only act as a tight slip-fit 'guide' to keep the belling portion of the expander centered in the case during belling the case mouth.

That's my story, and I'm sticking too it!

If you stick too it too, you will never again have bullet set-back problems to worry about.
Regardless of what type of bullet you use.

Rc
 
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You need to carefully measure your bullets and your expander die button. As RC stated every Lee expander button I own was oversized and had to be turned down to 3 to 5 thous. under my bullet's diameter and polished. Now they work perfectly and I have no setback whatsoever. You should be able to seat a bullet in a case with no crimp applied and then press the round into the edge of your bench as hard as you can and the bullet should not move any at all. If it does your case is being overexpanded (not overflared) and no amount or type of crimp will hold it in place. Trust me on this. If you seat a bullet (again without crimping) and it goes in with no resistance at all then your case is overexpanded (not to be confused with the amount of flare on the mouth). Check your expander button's dia. The bullet needs to be a tight fit before any crimping is done, tight enough that you can see a faint bulge where the bottom of the bullet is in the case on the outside of the case. Then crimp only enough to remove the flare you put in it. PM me if you have any questions I can answer. We can fix this.
 
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Zactly!

If you can push a seated bullet further in with your bare hands without a trip to the ER for finger bruising & skin damage?

You got an expander problem!
Or you are a Super-Hero reloading in your secret underground Lair.

rc
 
Emmmmm????

How do you bell without using an expander?

Every die set I have has the belling part made as part of the expander stem.

It has to be part of the expander stem to center the bell in the case mouth.

rc
 
No RC, he's not "flaring" cases - he's "belling" them. That would be interesting to watch. I used to have a drill Sgt. that could "bell" you really good.
 
3. My personal opinion is, the expander on any straight-wall pistol die set, should be small enough to not expand at all.

4. If it isn't, make it so with fine emery cloth & an electric drill.

5. It should only act as a tight slip-fit 'guide' to keep the belling portion of the expander centered in the case during belling the case mouth.
Click to expand...
Belling without expanding. ;)
 
He guys just passing along what I have read. It's not just one post that is claiming this but quiet a few over the net. Is there something to it I don't know. But I can tell ya this dont kill the messenger, I just saw it talked about a few times and thought I would relay it.
 
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