45 ACP weirdness

[IP1911]

Hello all,

New here and new to reloading, hope everyone is doing well.

I'll just jump right in.

I have successfully reloaded 200 rounds of 45 acp and had a few FTF that were cleared quickly but all went down range.
Now all of a sudden after I size and de-prime, prime some brass the brass drops into the barrel and seats fine (I have the pistol barrel out.) I loaded up 100 rounds and didn't check, but none of them fit. I can crimp some of them more and get them to fit in with a little push but they don't drop in like the brass above, the push is gentle it pulls right out.

I have taken the brass mentioned above and expand, seat and crimp with a very light crimp but I end up with the cartridge not seating all the way and having to crimp a lot more. This worries me as I may be crimping to much.

I have a bullet that I made in my first 200 that drops in and the COL 1.256
One that won't fit COL 1.258 I have some that are COL 1.62 the drop in.
the two brass are the same size. the crimp on both is .469 I have mixed head stamps and there doesn't seem to ties to any one of them.

I have tried tampering with PTX and the tamper die that came with the die set.
I have done the crimping with the Seat/crimp and the Lee factory crimp die all the same results.

Kimber Custom II 1911
Hornady LNL
dies hornady

Thanks

Tony

 

[Sunray]

Hi. 1.258" is too long. You didn't give the bullet weight, but a 230's OAL is 1.200". A 155's1.220" to 1.230".
The taper crimp doesn't really get measured. However, it doesn't take or need much either. Instead of diameter, think length of the taper. That's about 3/32". Or thereabouts.

 

[IP1911]

Sunray,

Thanks for the quick reply, and sorry yes it is 230. I did run a couple down to 1.200 with the same results. I keep turning the crimping tighter until it would seat and still wouldn't seat all the way with out somewhat hard pushing. I then pulled the bullet and the crimp was way to tight it had went all the way through the jacket to the lead.

Tony

 

[stubbicatt]

Is your bullet cast or jacketed? Do you crimp separately or as part of the seating stage?

I have found with 45's, and cast bullets, if one attempts to taper crimp and seat in the same operation it will mess with the chambering. Not an issue with roll crimps on revolver cartridges IME.

You might try seating and crimping in separate steps to see if this alleviates your issue.

 

[IP1911]

Hey stubbicatt,

the bullets are FMJ, TMJ from 3 different manufactures. I was seat/crimp then the problem showed up and I tried a new lee factory crimp but still no luck.

 

[Sunray]

Hi. Doesn't sound like the crimp. How'd you set up the sizer die? All the dies should just kiss the shell holder with the ram all the way up. Then you adjust the seater plug and decapper up or down.

 

[RussellC]

1.258 may be too long for that particular gun, plunk testing, but certainly not in general. I typically load 230 grain RN at 1.262-265 with absolutely no problem, and that length is specified in many powder/bullet manufacturers specs. Maximum for a 230 grain RN is 1.275. (which I do find long)

The only loads I am finding at 1.20 are HP or FP type rounds. Looking in every book and list I have, I only found one, Hornady 9th edition that comes close, 1.21 listed for their 230 grain FMJ RN. Why is 1.258 Too long?

Russellc

 

[IP1911]

I will go through the setup process again on all dies.

Thanks

 

[2bfree]

I will take a wild guess, over crimping and and causing a slight bulge in the brass. A crimp for me is .471 and works great on 230 RN FMJ.

 

[Gadawg88]

+1 2bfree. Too much crimp. Crimp just enough to take the bell out. 230 gn RN jacketed and plated bullets set to 1.265 run smoothly in both my 45s.

 

[IP1911]

Thanks everyone,

I re-setup all the dies but culprit was the crimp die. Not sure what happened it seems to be working now.

Tony

 

[lckdnldd]

Great! So, what are you doing here? Start pullin that lever.... Actually I need to practice what I preach. Here I set reading forums and I should be cranking out some .357 mag loads I plan on working up sometime tonight.. I drove myself crazy with COL's and crimping when I first started. I had a bad case of information overload.

 

[Toprudder]

1.258 may be too long for that particular gun, plunk testing, but certainly not in general. I typically load 230 grain RN at 1.262-265 with absolutely no problem, and that length is specified in many powder/bullet manufacturers specs. Maximum for a 230 grain RN is 1.275. (which I do find long)

The only loads I am finding at 1.20 are HP or FP type rounds. Looking in every book and list I have, I only found one, Hornady 9th edition that comes close, 1.21 listed for their 230 grain FMJ RN. Why is 1.258 Too long?

Russellc

It all depends on the bullet profile. I can seat Xtreme 230 RN to the SAAMI max of 1.275" in my Witness pistol. I have to seat the RMR 230 to 1.200", if I seat them to 1.220", they are touching the lands. If I seat the Xtreme to 1.200", the ogive is recessed inside the case mouth.

 

[Conservidave]

So what bullet exactly is the OP trying to load or having problems with here....RN, TC, FP, HP? Im really confused here

 

[Delmar]

Taper crimp is almost a misleading term, because unlike a roll crimp for a revolver, all you should be doing is taking out the flare at the case mouth. It shouldn't be digging into the bullet at all. Once you have seated your bullet but not run it up high enough to engage the taper crimp, take the round out of the case and measure the case mouth diameter. Adjust your dies accordingly.

Personally, I like to seat and crimp in separate steps to avoid bulging the case below the bullet and running the danger of bullet setback.

 

[IP1911]

I thought the problem was fixed but out of 10 bullets I made 3 of them would not fit in the barrel. I am using Reminton, Hornady and . RMR Hardcore Match all are 230 FMJ or TMJ RN.

 

[Conservidave]

To start with just load one brand bullet at a time because they're going to all have a slightly different profile. I am using the RMR hardcore match and have no problems what so ever at 1.265ish. Next measure the bullet diameter at the base, anything more than .454 might be a problem and of course do your plunk test with each.

When you say the bullet wont fit in the barrel i assume you mean it wont chamber. A picture is worth a thousand words around here. Keep us posted, we'll get you through this!

What brass is giving you problems?

 

[joem1945]

If you changed bullet manufactures there might be a slight difference in bullet profile which will require you to reset your seat and crimp die. It can be a great help to purchase a maximum length case gauge and try your reloads before you load a bunch. If your reload fits the case gauge it will fit the chamber every time.

 

[IP1911]

Ok I do have the Hornady LNL but I am using it at this point as a single stage and making one at a time.
I was using just the RMR Bullets until I ran into this issue so I tried other bullets that I had.
Yes I am using the barrel as my case gauge and after making 10 rounds on the same die settings using the RMR bullets I have 3 that would not seat in the barrel and headspace correctly while the other will seat flush with correct headspace. All 10 pieces of brass seated flush in the barrel with correct headspace after the de-prime, size. The 3 that did not seat stuck up about 1/16". I did measure all 10 bullets and all were under .454 all crimps were around .468 to .469. it doesn't seem to be any specific brass I have had some work and some no on the same headstamp brass.

Tony

 

[IP1911]

so here are two rounds out of ten processed at the same time, same die settings both dropped into the barrel after de-prime and size. After the expand, seat and crimp one will one won't seat right.

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[Conservidave]

a properly crimped .45 case should measure around .471 at the mouth and you should feel just a slight "bump" through your press handle in this step. Are you trying to seat and crimp in one step? if so try seating them all first then come back and crimp because case lengths can vary causing issues. Consistency is the key.

Measure the rounds that do chamber compared to the ones that wont and see what you find. Is the brass nickle plated? The reason i ask is its the only brass i've really had any trouble with.

OK i see your brass is brass....

 

[Conservidave]

this is probably one of three things.....

1. youre seating your bullets too long

2. you flared and didn't crimp enough to just straighten the case back out

3. you have over crimped and bulged the case below the mouth

were almost there

 

[IP1911]

Ok I ran another test round of 10.

All federal brass all

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All case mouths were after de-prime and size .468 all dropped right in to the barrel and seated perfect.
All cases were expanded to .474 this is the point were I could get the bullet started without to much trouble.
All cases were seated to 1.25
All cases were crimped to .468 measured at the mouth.
I have two that will not seat.

The one on the left will not seat correctly this is one of two

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here it is not seating

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here is a proper seated one of the ten

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[Cemetery21]

Where is RC with his black Sharpie when we need him?

 

[2bfree]

All cases were crimped to .468 measured at the mouth.

Why are you crimping at .468 ?