45 Colt, Blackhawk or SAA?

[Ohen Cepel]

There are Rugers out there which come with both the 45LC and 45acp cylinder if that is a gain to you.

 

[45 Dragoon]

A new Uberti is fine for +p loads. You can also fit an extra ( acp) cyl as well.

Mike

 

[dickydalton]

I have a short New Model 45C/ACP and a 2008 New Vaquero so I have the best of both. I do think I am going to get one of the Italians also.

RBI

• dickydalton
• May 29, 2021

NMV

• dickydalton
• May 29, 2021

 

[Onty]

@ gilgsn

Mes excuses monsieur! I omitted that you in France. Well, we in "golden age" have a tendency to blame age for everything we do wrong; from laziness and carelessness, to ignorance and irresponsibility.

One question, how come your obtained mold RCBS 45-270-SAA? IMO, this bullet is bit on heavy side for regular shooting, including cowboy events. Unless you are allowed to use handgun for coup de grace while hunting. For that purpose, 45-270-SAA tops.

As for brass, I would go with Starline, wouldn't bother with any other brand. See https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/category/categoryId/484 . I have no experience with them, but they do export, empty brass shouldn't be a problem, see https://www.grafs.com/retail/terms-of-service#section_64 , "INTERNATIONAL"

As for new Ruger handguns in EU, yeah, they are pricey. However, used Vaquero could be found from time to time. To my surprise, not just 45 Colt, but also, 357 Magnum, 44 Magnum (even with 7.5" barrel!) and 44-40. More here https://www.gunfinder.de/suche?query=Ruger Vaquero Revolver .

Also, new to me a safety feature on Uberti revolvers, plus 45 ACP cylinder could be fitted. As for +P loads, here is something https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...cs/17042150/re-p-45-colt-article#Post17042150

In a nutshell, if revolver could be fitted with factory 45 ACP cylinder, and since 45 ACP could goes up to 21 000 psi, I see no reason why 45 Colt loads couldn't be loaded also on 21 000 psi. However, before start reloading such ammunition, I will make sure that loading data are right. In that respect, I stay away from any load recommended in magazines and websites, unless tested and verified by reputable company.

 

[NeroM]

Ruger vs. Colt clone discussion is on-going, as previously mentioned neither is good or bad - just slightly different.
One clear difference between Ruger and many clones is the sight pattern - Ruger sights are better for aging eyes.
Also Ruger is stronger. However many feel SAA clones feel or handle better.
Don't know what is available in France, however France is clearly closer to Italian clone production locations than USA.
Suggest considering [if available] the Uberti El Patron - sights are better than most clones. I also like the "grizzly paw" model
with "army" style grip - it handles and feels great.
PS.... If you are not set on a single action revolver, suggest a S&W M25. I think my favorite 45 Colt. Good sights, fits hand well, shoots great, carries nicely - more I shoot it more I like it.

 

[Tallball]

Uberti, Pietta, and Ruger have made various models of 9mm revolvers.

I think you can still get a Blackhawk as a "convertible" with a spare cylinder in 9mm

I'm pretty sure I've seen both Uberti and Pietta 9mm SAA clones and "convertibles". There's no reason why not. They just need to make some 9mm cylinders and install them onto 357 revolvers.

Mine is a Cimarron Pistolero by Pietta that I bought recently.

I think the one imported by Taylor is by Uberti and is a Model TP9

My 357 Blackhawk didn't come with a 9mm cylinder, but I bought a random used one that happened to fit.

Due to current ammo costs, my 9mm and 22lr revolvers are getting shot a lot lately.

 

[Tall]

uberti 45 - Mit Gunfinder finden

 

[Obturation]

I like Blackhawks. I like saa & clones. It's good to have a revolver from a company with good cs and parts readily available instead of someone overseas and parts may differ widely . the strength and modern design of the blackhawk makes it superior in my opinion, just doesn't look as good. The large frame Blackhawks are older and are immensely strong, newer ones are still good though. For use- blackhawk. For looking at- saa or clone.

 

[45 Dragoon]

@ gilgsn

Mes excuses monsieur! I omitted that you in France. Well, we in "golden age" have a tendency to blame age for everything we do wrong; from laziness and carelessness, to ignorance and irresponsibility.

One question, how come your obtained mold RCBS 45-270-SAA? IMO, this bullet is bit on heavy side for regular shooting, including cowboy events. Unless you are allowed to use handgun for coup de grace while hunting. For that purpose, 45-270-SAA tops.

As for brass, I would go with Starline, wouldn't bother with any other brand. See https://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/category/categoryId/484 . I have no experience with them, but they do export, empty brass shouldn't be a problem, see https://www.grafs.com/retail/terms-of-service#section_64 , "INTERNATIONAL"

As for new Ruger handguns in EU, yeah, they are pricey. However, used Vaquero could be found from time to time. To my surprise, not just 45 Colt, but also, 357 Magnum, 44 Magnum (even with 7.5" barrel!) and 44-40. More here https://www.gunfinder.de/suche?query=Ruger Vaquero Revolver .

Also, new to me a safety feature on Uberti revolvers, plus 45 ACP cylinder could be fitted. As for +P loads, here is something https://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbt...cs/17042150/re-p-45-colt-article#Post17042150

In a nutshell, if revolver could be fitted with factory 45 ACP cylinder, and since 45 ACP could goes up to 21 000 psi, I see no reason why 45 Colt loads couldn't be loaded also on 21 000 psi. However, before staring reloading such ammunition, I will make sure that loading data are right. In that respect, I stay away from any load recommended in magazines and websites, unless tested and verified by reputable company.

The "proofing" is more stringent in Europe and the cylinder is bigger on the Uberti.
The guys posting about someone blowing up an Uberti means absolutely nothing. You can " blow up" anything with a double charge ( which is most certainly what happened). They'd probably say you can't shoot 45acp in an open-top revolver to.
As for +p's, it's 23K for both 45's.
Check out Brian Pearce's article on 45+p's in the latest Handloader magazine. He's tested Uberti's et al and lists the "yays and nays".

Mike

 

[Jim Watson]

My main thought on the subject is that a Blackhawk has adjustable sights and Vaqueros and most Italians have the old "hog wallow" typically harder to see and maybe not on target. That is OK for CAS where the targets are large and close and style counts, but not for general use.

 

[45 Dragoon]

My main thought on the subject is that a Blackhawk has adjustable sights and Vaqueros and most Italians have the old "hog wallow" typically harder to see and maybe not on target. That is OK for CAS where the targets are large and close and style counts, but not for general use.

I don't know, "hog wallow" sights do pretty good.





6 shots ea. 21ft off hand.

Mike

 

[Lo-Profile]

I have the Ruger New Model Blackhawk and a 7. Pietta 1875 Remington clone.

Like shooting them both. I'm sure the Ruger will outlive the Pietta without issues. Just a better built gun

 

[Jim Watson]

Mine are OK, too. I got lucky on the Colt, but the copy took gunsmith intervention to square the notch and twist the barrel. My Legal Defender got a new sight along with its barrel liner.

My No 3 New Model .38-44 shot smokeless to center but grouped better with a fake, although well off zero. I did not keep it long enough to twiddle the teeny little 19th century adjustable sight.

 

[Crunchy Frog]

Others have mentioned this but there are two different Blackhawks available in .45 Colt. The standard New Model Blackhawk is built on the large cylinder frame. It is suitable for the “Ruger only” category of handloads.

Ruger also makes the New Model Flattop in .45. Some if not all of these come with a ,45 ACP cylinder. It is built on the same “medium” cylinder frame as the New Vaquero and has the “reverse indexing pawl” that makes loading and unloading easier. A better proportioned revolver in my opinion but not suitable for the “Ruger only” ammo.

 

[.308 Norma]

I'd take a Freedom Arms 97 over both but I can't imagine the cost here, if it's even possible to get one. FA never replied to my inquiry about dealers.

I could be wrong, but I’m not sure that there are any Freedom Arms “dealers” in the conventional sense of the word. I mean, I’ve never seen a Freedom Arms revolver that wasn’t a special order (like mine) in any of the gunstores around here, and we’re only 80 or 90 miles from the Freedom Arms factory.
Anyway, I don’t suppose this will help, but when I first got my genuine Colt SAA (a 44-40 Win) I was showing it off to my wife. I pointed it (unloaded) skyward, and slowly cocked the hammer back. “Click, Click-Click-Click” it said. I asked my wife, “Did you hear that?” “It said, C-O-L-T.”
That’s when my wife (an unapologetic Ruger SA lover) picked up her Super Blackhawk, pointed it (also unloaded) skyward, and slowly cocked the hammer back. “Click-Click” it said. Then she asked, “Did you hear that?” “It said, RU-GER.”

 

[br549arkie]

The difference in cost between a Italian clone and a Ruger would buy a lot of ammo or reloading components and that is what I'd opt for.

 

[.45Coltguy]

The difference in cost between a Italian clone and a Ruger would buy a lot of ammo or reloading components and that is what I'd opt for.

In OP's case, totally agree.

 

[Tall]

It looks like Colt SAA's are only slightly more than prices in the USA. I would get one of those before any other kind.

Colt Colt Saa 1873 - Gunfinder

 

[Tall]

This one even seems like a good deal:

SAA Revolver - Colt Mod. Peacemaker 1873 (2nd Generation) | .357Mag - Gunfinder

 

[desmobob]

If you're going to buy a .45 Colt, I think it's pretty nice to have one actual Colt 1873 SAA in the gun safe....

 

[doubleh]

No complaints other than the bright stainless can be tough to shoot with when it’s high noon on a sunny day.

Yes it is. I have gone so far as to mask off a couple of ss guns leaving the top strap of the receiver and the top third of the barrel bare and spraying with that part with rustoleum rust converter paint. It is about as dull a black as anything you will find and makes a world of difference in seeing your sights. Lacquer thinner will remove it. I find early morning when shooting south in my ranges pistol bays to very difficult with the glare only on one side and that is with even blued guns. I have done the paint thing on some sights and find it helps a lot too.The ss guns look weird but it a great help. Unless someone told you only the sights were painted you would never notice.

 

[Riomouse911]

Yes it is. I have gone so far as to mask off a couple of ss guns leaving the top strap of the receiver and the top third of the barrel bare and spraying with that part with rustoleum rust converter paint. It is about as dull a black as anything you will find and makes a world of difference in seeing your sights. Lacquer thinner will remove it. I find early morning when shooting south in my ranges pistol bays to very difficult with the glare only on one side and that is with even blued guns. I have done the paint thing on some sights and find it helps a lot too.The ss guns look weird but it a great help. Unless someone told you only the sights were painted you would never notice.

Most of my stainless .38’s have orange front sights. (S&W Models 64 and 65.)



I just haven’t tinkered with the Vaquero sights… yet. But the matte black paint is always a good option, I did that with my Birdshead Wrangler.



Stay safe.

 

[Corpral_Agarn]

A lot of quality posts.

Sounds like you need both.

 

[Tallinar]

I’ve owned Vaqueros, New Vaqueros, New Model Blackhawks, flattop Blackhawks, of nearly all barrel lengths in .357 and .45 Colt, and one short .44 Special in there. Also owned one Pietta SAA clone.

For me, nothing feels more right than the New Vaquero. Dimensions and weight just feel right to my hand. Has the right grip frame with the right heft, and the right sights. The perfect mix of modernity and old-fashioned. Everything I like about the SAA, and nothing I don’t.

I make it a point not to get attached to possessions, but selling my 7.5” stainless New Vaquero in .45 Colt was the single biggest regret of all the horse trading I’ve done over the years.

Blackhawks are perfectly functional, but I’m not really a fan of the big black adjustable sights. In certain lighting, they can be really terrible. Aftermarket options for sights in .45 Colt NM Blackhawks seem to be more limited than other cartridges. Fixed sight single actions seem to be far more naturally-pointing.

While the NM Blackhawk grip frame is larger than the New Vaq, this can be somewhat overcome with a thinner set of grips. I robbed the stock “gunfighter” grips off a Single Six and put them on my 7.5” .45 Blackhawk. Feels ten times better to me, but still not as good as the New Vaq grip frame.

 

[45 Dragoon]

I have the Ruger New Model Blackhawk and a 7. Pietta 1875 Remington clone.

Like shooting them both. I'm sure the Ruger will outlive the Pietta without issues. Just a better built gun

Hmmmm
Didn't know Pietta made '75 Remington copies.



But either way, they can be fully coil sprung!! 19th century version of a Ruger.

Mike