45C BP loads

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Before I found a set of Lee Dippers (which is probably the best $10 I ever spent) I made my own .45 Colt dipper rather than run black powder through my Dillon Powder Measure. No need to debate the safety of running black powder through a Dillon measure for the nth time, I just did not want to put up with the mess.

Anyway, I determined how far down into the case the bullet would go when crimped, cut off a case just above that level with a Dremel, and epoxied the trimmed case to the blade of a small screwdriver. Instant custom made dipper.

I later did the same for .38 cases.

Driftwood Johnson is right...keep it simple.
 
Someone care to explain what is so complicated about pouring a charge of black in a case, thumbing the wad on top, then run the case into the flaring die to flare the case mouth (that you have to do anyway) then seating the bullet?
 
I dunno what your flaring dies look like, but the expander plugs on mine extend too far into the case to fit in if there is a full charge of Black Power in the case. I always resize, prime, and flare first, then drop the powder, then seat and crimp the bullet.

And I keep saying, you don't have to slow pour it in for pistol cartridges. Do you really think they were slow pouring the powder in when making thousands of cartridges in factories? I don't think so. My Lyman BP measure does not have the option for slow pouring. I throw the rotor and it dumps the powder in all at once.

Here is a photo of one of my Hornady Lock & Load presses with the Lyman Black Powder measure mounted on it.

HornadyLLandLymanBPmeasure01.jpg


Here is a photo of the entire sequence on the L&L. In the rear, at station one, a case as been resized. It receives a primer between station one and two. The flare happens at station two. At station three the powder is dumped in from the Lyman BP powder measure. Station four has no die in it, but you can see the flared case is full of powder. No room for the flaring die to go in with all that powder in there. At station five the PRS Big Lube 250 grain bullet is waiting to be seated and crimped.

HornadyLLandLymanBPmeasure04.jpg
 
Everybody has there problems I suppose, but the flaring die in the hornady dies is just perfect for compressing a full 40 gr charge weighed on a scale and slow poured thru the funnel.
 
Driftwood, you remember how much bandwidth we used up on the Open Range trying to get you convinced that when someone "put a wad" in their load , it didn't automatically mean a lube cookie? It could mean anything from a piece of wax paper to a purchased gasket material?

Well this is the same thing. You are talking about loading for the dress up squib shooting done at targets the size of a pickup door at 15 ft. Accuracy doesn't count as much as having the proper "costume" and shooting fast.
I'm talking about when I use my handgun I want what ever I shot to know it got shot, and in some cases I don't have a second opportunity to pull the trigger. So there fore I want those blackpowder handgun rounds to be just as efficient as a smokeless round. So yes I want 900 fps from a 5.5 inch barreled Colt, and I want accuracy running something close to one big ragged hole at 35-50 yds. Because while I don't wear batwing chaps, spurs , cuffs and all the rest that you "cowboys" do, I do need every calf that is born , to make the bills and be able to keep on ranching for the next year, so again if I need to pop a coyote at 100 yds he needs to be popped and for real, if I shoot a skunk in the middle of the afternoon before he gets to the house, he needs to be shot and shot for real...
Different types of shooting we're talking about here old son.
 
"You are talking about loading for the dress up squib shooting done at targets the size of a pickup door at 15 ft. Accuracy doesn't count as much as having the proper "costume" and shooting fast."

Ouch!!

I wish you had been with me in Cassville, MO on Saturday...no door sized targets there...
 
Just to keep this thread going, isn't this fun boys and girls.

Driftwood just what is the melting temp of that white lube on your bullet. Black powder lube turns to liquid in my Florida garage in the summer, god only knows what the trunk of the car or the inside of the van gets up to. No chance of that lube leaching into the powder with long term storage. And yes one can keep loaded rounds out of the sun or heated places, but what if.......


Just asking. There is a learning curve to this, however simple and we are frigging around with mini pipe bombs.
 
Don McDowell said:
Driftwood, you remember how much bandwidth we used up on the Open Range trying to get you convinced that when someone "put a wad" in their load , it didn't automatically mean a lube cookie? It could mean anything from a piece of wax paper to a purchased gasket material?

Well this is the same thing. You are talking about loading for the dress up squib shooting done at targets the size of a pickup door at 15 ft. Accuracy doesn't count as much as having the proper "costume" and shooting fast.
I'm talking about when I use my handgun I want what ever I shot to know it got shot, and in some cases I don't have a second opportunity to pull the trigger. So there fore I want those blackpowder handgun rounds to be just as efficient as a smokeless round. So yes I want 900 fps from a 5.5 inch barreled Colt, and I want accuracy running something close to one big ragged hole at 35-50 yds. Because while I don't wear batwing chaps, spurs , cuffs and all the rest that you "cowboys" do, I do need every calf that is born , to make the bills and be able to keep on ranching for the next year, so again if I need to pop a coyote at 100 yds he needs to be popped and for real, if I shoot a skunk in the middle of the afternoon before he gets to the house, he needs to be shot and shot for real...
Different types of shooting we're talking about here old son.
Click to expand...
got to be one of the funniest, and snarkiest comments this week. you get a cookie....
 
Post # 34:
Can't get my head around why someone would even use a bp gun for something as important as you are saying. And a hand gun on coy dogs at 100 yards, you gotta be the modern version of Elmer Keith, and he had to get the range with the first shot or two. Me, I'd keep a Mini 30 or 14 standing at the barn door and another in the pickup. But I am one of the urban cowboys and the most I am ever going to throw down stands on two legs, and then he would have to be in close and personal. Even then my carry is modern tech.

But to each his own.
 
Whugett, a rifle standing in the porch door or in the pickup gun rack is fine, but a pain in the arse when on foot or horseback.
As to your question on the lube, a high wax content (beeswax or oxokerite) is preferable in those hot storage conditions. This is where a wad of some sort (even a simple one punched out of wax paper) really pays dividends as it will help if not completely prevent lube migration/contamination of the powder charge.
FYI a picture from branding day a while back
DSCN0095.jpg
 
Mr McDowell you are indeed living the good life. And my hat is still off to anyone that can plant a dog size animal at a hundred yards with a hand gun. Elmer Keith describes that kind of shooting in some of his books. Of course Elemer Keith was cut from the same cloth as John Wayne, Tom Brady, Audie Murphy and a few others. We only get so many in a lifetime.
You western guys are going to take exception with the Tom Brady part, but what the hey I am the guy doing the typing. Denver got lucky.
 
:D Tom Brady, isn't he the guy that got throwed off a bronc on the Mile High outfit and trampled so bad:)

We tend to do a good bit of shooting out this direction. I am fortunate to be old enough to have learned a good deal about loading blackpowder cartridges as a young'un, from old guys that said what they missed the most about back then was the King's Semismokeless, it was cheap, shot good, and was easy to clean up.
 
Well win a few lose a few.;)

. Loaded up 50 45c today. Set the powder measure between 35 and 40 grains, no wad no lube. Tomorrow is range day so will see. After loading the conversion cylinder I'll lube over the bullets. Read where one only needs to do that three out of the six
 
Driftwood just what is the melting temp of that white lube on your bullet. Black powder lube turns to liquid in my Florida garage in the summer, god only knows what the trunk of the car or the inside of the van gets up to. No chance of that lube leaching into the powder with long term storage. And yes one can keep loaded rounds out of the sun or heated places, but what if.......
Click to expand...

Howdy

Sorry, I have not idea what the melting temperature of that lube is. It is commercial SPG Black Powder Lube.

http://www.blackpowderspg.com/spglube.html

The bullet in the photo is the Big Lube PRS 250 grain bullet, I size them to .452 and lube them with SPG in my Star lubrasizer.

This bullet carries a huge amount of lube, more than you really need for a revolver, it was designed to be shot from a rifle so the bullet would not run out of lube on its trip down a long barrel. It is overkill for a revolver, but that is what I use. You will notice there are fairly wide drive bands on either side of the lube groove.

bulletandstick.jpg

Believe it or not, it gets pretty hot in New England in the summer too. I store my ammo in plastic cartridge boxes, bullet side down. I have never had any problem with the lube migrating past the lower drive band and adulterating the powder below, without a card wad between bullet and powder. That is my experience anyway. Of course I make every effort to keep my ammo out of direct sunlight on a hot summer day.

I had pretty much the same experience when pan lubing my bullets with 50/50 Beeswax/Crisco. Stored in a cool dry place (basement) bullets down in the box, keep them out of direct sunlight on a hot summer day.
 
Thanks for all the info driftwood.

BTW we are neighbors, my Spring, Summer abode is Rhode Island. Been in the same house for 45 years, got tired of the winters after hanging off telephone poles for 30 years so bought a place in Florida for the cold months. Now I can shoot year round in comfort.:)
 
whughett,

By now you've probably figured out that full house loads of BP in a 45 Colt hurt your hand. One of the things that I'll mention here is that given the price of BP and the scarcity of lead I have a tendency to shoot a lot lighter boolits and considerably less powder in 45 Colt BP loads. I've got a 160+/-gr mold that puts out a boolit that shoots great with 25gr 3f under it.

The formula as Driftwood puts it is "simple". Drop 25gr of 3f in, compress it with a dowel rod to keep it where it belongs then fill the brass up to the top with cornmeal. Seat the boolit down on the cornmeal and then go shoot it. The cornmeal compresses very well and won't damage the boolit during compression. As far as lube is concerned, use what works for you. If that's dabbing Crisco on the cylinder throats after loading then fine it's what works for you. Even though there are those who say absolutely don't use ANYTHING that is associated with smokeless powders, I've found that NRA 50/50 lube does a decent job on BP boolits.
 
Yes the full charge loads are a hand full. I had loaded 50 rounds and I shot them all. Accuracy seemed as good as the smokeless rounds. The bullet I use is the same for both a 255 grain SWC with two lube and one crimp groove. No wad no lube except at the mouth, three per cylinder. If I shoot more of these I will down load them. Right now after cleaning two ROAs' I had to clean the brass, thats more work so........................, plus the loading to start with.

This is a fun thing I'll do once in awhile, think most of my shooting is still going to be load as you go.
 
I'll start a new thread if need be,don't mean to hijack this one, but what is "Kings Semismokeless"? Would a duplex load be the same?
 
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