7.62x25

[pakmcc]

I need reloading dies for 7.62x25. any brand, but Lee, I have lee and they don't work. I think I could use .30 Luger or .30 mauser??? Bear with me on the spelling. Any one????
yours truly, Pat McC [email protected]

 

[Black Snowman]

Every other brand I've seen they're a special order item, up to a 90 day wait. RCBS makes them for certain because they're on the MidwayUSA site.

What trouble are you having with the Lees? I understand it can be a tricky round to reload. I just picked up a CZ-52 and a set of dies so I'll probably be running into similar problems as yourself

There was a recent post either here or on the CZForum of someone having trouble. They were crushing S&B brass but it was working OK with others. Other people were having the opposite problem, now I can't remember the solution.

 

[Black Snowman]

Here's the CZ forum thread

 

[pakmcc]

The problem I'm having reloading the 7.62x25 is that I or my dies will not keep the bullet straight in the case as I "crimp" the bullet in. Lee Dies have a floating bullet seat inside the bullet seating die and if the bullets gets cocked just a little, it will stay that way . Then the shell will not go into the gun and/or the slide will not close.
I'm trying to find something that will hole the bullet straight in the case while I'm seating the bullet to the depth that I want it. I was using my 9mm bullet seater and that helped a little, then I got a .308 rifle die, grown off about an inch and a half off the bottom, grown off aobut half the nurlled part of the top. and after getting this into my press the locking ring had to go on the bottom of my press. It looked good, but today i shot a box of the shells that I had made and it looked like a shotgun did it. Usually, the CZ52 that I use is just about a tack driver.(I've got three of them and one is converted to a 9mm)
After loading the the shells then I have to run the loaded cases back through the resizing die. That was my last plan. Now I'm back to trying to find the real thing.
And yes, if you try to hard to crimp the bullet, you can crush the case. (ok, ok, I've been there and done that)
"O", you can make the brass out of .223 cases. and they work fine. Just have a case trimmer. I've got a lyman and it works just fine.
I used the barrel out the one that i made into a 9mm for a go, no go gage.

yours truly, Pat McC

 

[Black Snowman]

I should have payed more attention to your ID, looks like that's your post on CZF

Hmm, maybe try crimping on a second pass. Back the die out and screw the seater in, seat the bullets, when done go back and crimp with the seater removed.

Not sure. I'll have to take a look at mine when I get home, I have some mil-surp brass I picked up at the range I can experiment with.

Might also look at a universal seating die with interchanging bullet profile inserts, or modifying the insert in the Lee to match the bullets you are using. I believe Lyman and Redding both make them but that's just off the top of my head.

Edit: I just had another thought, if they're tilting on you a slight flare on the brass may help. Lee has a universal flaring die that would do the trick and is only like $10 from MidwayUSA. It's a handy thing to have, particularly if you are trying to seat soft lead or sabot loads.

 

[pakmcc]

7.62

Yea, it's probly my post on CZf, I'm a CZ nut also, my wife and I have five CZ75's and one is a Champion and one is a CZ 85, then I have a CZ83 in.380. I reload for all of them and every thing is fine for the other cal.
I tried seating the bullet with just the bullet seater and them backing it out to crimp the bullet., But when I send the dies back to Lee, A fellow named Patrick said he opened up the crimp just a little. Well, the little made it so that I have to resize the case to crimp the bullet and get them to go into the chamber of the gun.
I have a Norinco in 7.62 and i can't shoot any of my reloads in it because it's chamber is too tight. I shoot factory S&B in it.
I tried the Sabot loads, They didn't work for me. If I ever get some good dies I'll try it again. The problem with the sabots are the .223 bullets have to long of a pointed nose. I had to cut the nose off the feed them into the CZ 52 mag.
Isn't it nice to be on the cutting edge???????????
Pat

 

[Black Snowman]

Ya, I see the problem.

OK, I've just finished giving my Lee dies a good looking over and I have to say that the seating die has to be the most ill-conceived thing I've seen them put out.

The seating surface is tapered perfectly for the 90 grain XTPs I bought but I can't see how they could possibly seat a round nose bullet, like the one the round is supposed to use, consistently.

I've already applied the o-ring trick suggested in the CZF thread but I didn't have the right o-rings to fit it evenly and give a consistent position. The only way I can get the seater to stay centered is to tighten it all the way down, which means I'll have to crimp in a 2nd pass or figure out how I can use a generic crimping die with it.

If I get round nose bullets it looks like I'd have to steal a bullet seater for a round nose bullet from another die or somehow shape the other side of the existing seater to do the job.

As a side note the seating/crimping die and belling die both are labeled .30 Luger and only the resizing die is labled 7.62x25 Tok.

 

[tex_n_cal]

Try the Hornady dies, they also have a floating bullet seater.

Black Snowman is right, try seating, then crimping in seperate operations.

 

[Clark]

I have a 7.62x25mm Lee die set.
It will not form 9mm mag brass small enough to fit in a CZ52 chamber.
I wrote Lee about that, and they said it is a sizing die and not a form die.

So I tried to think about that, and all I get is, "I though one can form with sizing dies unless the change is so big that the brass gets too hard or colapses. I know I can form .308 brass into .243 with a .243 die, an 8x57 into a 7x57 and a 7x57 into a 257R."

ANyway, a 9mm die will push the shoulders in far enough to make the ammo fit in a CZ52.

Now I have some RCBS dies in 30 Mauser, and I will try them.

30 Luger dies for Tokarev ammo runs the risk of making the ammo headspace and the gun headspace not agree. The ammo may work, may not fit, or may have a case head separation.

Except that all the current published handloads are so wimpy, they could not stretch the brass that far.

 

[Clark]

OK, I tried it.
The RCBS 30 Mauser sizes 9mm super comp to fit in all CZ52s, but the Lee 7.62x25mm sizer die can form 9mm super comp brass to fit in SOME CZ52 chambers. The Lee has a rough shoulder in the die, and scratches the brass worse than any die I have ever seen. The RCBs defiately makes the shoulders narrower by a couple thousands.

 

[pakmcc]

I told youuuuuu. Hi, snowman and others, I haven't tried the rubber O ring trick yet, I just ordered RCBS dies in .30 Mauser, they should be here by this weekend.
I went to the Pasadana Gun show this weekend and Lee reloading was there. I got to look at all three dies that could load .30 bottle neck car. Lees were all the same. A floating bullet bullet seater. (floating as in up and down and sideways also.) Like someone said, you have to seat the bullet and then crimp the bullet. Well, my lee dies will not even crimp the bullet and the shell go into the chamber. I have to completly resize the loaded case. I cut down a .308 bullet seater and it didn't work. I've an idea why. but My RCBS dies should be here soon.
HEy Clark, let me know your reloads come out with the .30 Mauser dies come out. Patmcc

 

[pakmcc]

hey Clark, I've used the 7.62x25 lee dies to reform .223 into 7.62x25 and it works fine. The only problem is my shell holder is The #19 from lee and it for the 9mm. I did pull the rim off one .223 case, I think the #19 shell holder might be just a little big. (someone help me out here).
After I trimmed the case to leanth, they worked fine. I use a Lyman case trimmer. But you might have to cut the ridge out of the primer pocket. (ok, I didn't, but it worked anyway)
I used a tubing cutter to cut just behind the bottle neck of the .223 case, and it was a very cheap tubbing cutter, one of the little plactic things that I got at a hobbie shop.
Pakmcc

 

[Clark]

The .223 must be fire formed out at the shoulder from .360" to .372".
The 9mm Super comp must be formed in at the shoulder from .380" to .372".

 

[pakmcc]

Hey Clark and black snowman, I just got my RCBS .30 cal. reloading dies today and I've now got 75 shells loaded. They all passed the Spin test, in the CZ 52 barrels. They didn't past the spin test in the MaKarov barrel that I had on one of my 52's. All three guns are back with their original barrels .
The reason that there are 75 shells is that there are three different kinds(brands) of powders. I used unique, WW231, and Acc#2. 25 each.
you can't believe the joy in getting the bullet to seat and it's a true vertical(as the spin test)
The only bullets that I could find anywhere were Sierra 85 gr. RN at aobut 12 to 13 dollars a box of 100. I'm still looking
If this works, I'll let ya'll know if the 100 gr plinkers work with this set of dies.
I had a can of ACC#9 on the counter at the gun store this morning and didn't remember if I had a load for #9(I did) But that's for another day.
It's a two die set and i think it's great. If I can get the 52's to shoot(one of them is a tack driver) them I'll start on getting my norinco to see what loads it likes. I've got one in 7.62x25 also plus a couple in 9mm.
of course, if a certain party calls me about seeing the plane,!!!!!!!!! all bets are off.
(ok, ok, it's a Piper Cherokee 235 and it's for sale.)
ya'll have a good one, Patmcc

 

[pakmcc]

Well, I shot my new reloads with my CZ52's and they shot good, not great' but good, (I"m a little under the weather at the moment) It looks like I need to work up a load for my 52's. The WW231 was ok, but the Max load in the book wasn't as strong as standard S& B ammo. either was the unique or Acc# 2. The Unique seemed to shoot as good as any of the powders. But looking at the primers, (to see how flat they are) these loads could be a little heaver.
I brought a pound of Acc#9 on the way home and I'll load up a bunch of shells with Acc#9 and unique and see what happens. Someone said that Acc#9 was the powder that the factory uses to load 7.62x25.
But you can't believe how nice it was to have all the bullets feed correctly and eject correctly.
Hey, Black Snowman, you are just going to have to get you some RCBS .30 Mauser dies and try some real reloading. it's a two die set.
Mr. Clark, the Mauser dies work just fine, But my cut down .223 brass doen't work with the Mauser dies. "0" well, I've got plenty of S&B brass and I don't have a problem with the S&B brass at all.
I'll load up a batch tonight and If I'm feeling ok, I'll try again tomorrow. later. Patmcc