8-Shot Revolver / Extractor Gears / Endurance

[Armored farmer]

What in particular was happening to your 7 shot? Which model? “Not stay in time,” isn’t very descriptive, and as a wannabe Revolversmith, I’m inteigued to hear which specific timing problems - multiple - you experienced. Did the same breakage/wear/galling recur multiple times, or were there multiple issues at both ends of the cycle which only each needed to be rectified once each?

It was a Taurus Tracker model 617(iirc)
I really liked it. It was 4", accurate, and of course 7 shot. I carried it on a Montana trip, and hunted a took a deer with it here in Illinois. The more I shot it, the more it spat lead.
Closer examination showed that in single action,(80% of my shooting) it would not lock up. The cylinder was over rotating the bolt. It wouldn't do it in d/a. I could cock the hammer, and rotate the cylinder with the hammer back.
I cleaned, lubed the entire gun and polished the rough peened surfaces of the indexing gear on the extractor star. I didnt like the fragile look of the indexing gear on the 7 shooter. The 617 is not a big gun. I doubt it is as big as a k frame. That makes pretty small notches in the gear.
When I said it wouldn't stay in time, I didnt mean that it had been repaired and got out of time again. I meant that sometimes it would, and sometimes it wouldn't be in time. I know that it was probably a bolt problem...maybe a spring....but it was in a defensive role for me, and I wasn't going to tolerate it.
I wasnt going to open up a Taurus and poke around its innards. I told my lgs about it. It got traded before it got worse.

 

[mcb]

I hate to be that guy but I suspect your problems were cause more by the Taurus aspect than the 7-shooter aspect of that revolver.

Taurus revolvers are a great buy, but you need three of them. The one you're shooting, your backup one in the range bag, and one back at Taurus being repaired. Rotate frequently.

 

[Armored farmer]

I hate to be that guy but I suspect your problems were cause more by the Taurus aspect than the 7-shooter aspect of that revolver.

Taurus revolvers are a great buy, but you need three of them. The one you're shooting, your backup one in the range bag, and one back at Taurus being repaired. Rotate frequently.

I will agree.
However, I personally dont care for the smaller ratchet gears on 7-shooters, and I like more meat between the chambers. Another thing is that my internal mental counter never warmed up to 7 rounds.
I feel a six-shooter is the golden mean.

 

[mcb]

I will agree.
However, I personally dont care for the smaller ratchet gears on 7-shooters, and I like more meat between the chambers. Another thing is that my internal mental counter never warmed up to 7 rounds.
I feel a six-shooter is the golden mean.

I think if you do the math or measure there is still about the same material between chambers as there is between a chamber and the OD of the cylinder. With an 8-shot N-frame it is slightly less between chambers but not enough that I worry.

But I am with you on the 7, it does not do it for me. It's not viable as a competition revolver. I would rather have 8 or 6 than 7, I would take 5 over 7 even. 7 is a silly number.

 

[Varminterror]

The more I shot it, the more it spat lead.
Closer examination showed that in single action,(80% of my shooting) it would not lock up. The cylinder was over rotating the bolt. It wouldn't do it in d/a. I could cock the hammer, and rotate the cylinder with the hammer back.
I cleaned, lubed the entire gun and polished the rough peened surfaces of the indexing gear on the extractor star. [...]
When I said it wouldn't stay in time, I didnt mean that it had been repaired and got out of time again. I meant that sometimes it would, and sometimes it wouldn't be in time.

This makes sense - it’s exceptionally rare for revolvers to fall out of time over and over after repairs. But it’s fair to expect a revolver which is out of time will occasionally lock up, but occasionally miss.

It’s also common, although counter-design, to see revolvers lock up when fired DA, but miss lock up when cocked single action. By design, the single action sear causes more travel, which should help lock up at the back end, but more often, guys pull their trigger hard and fast enough to let the inertia of the cylinder roll it to lock. But if a thumb is drug on the cylinder, the DA stroke would fall short of lockup by farther than the SA stroke. Pretty common even for SA to lock up, but DA to fail.

It’s also common for one or a few chambers to lock up while one or a few don’t. Each tooth is a dimensional fit all its own, so it’s common for some chambers to be out of time and some not. If ALL are out, then fixing the pawl is usually the easiest solution.

Skipping the bolt is rare - and is typically a bolt issue, and it shouldn’t be possible to happen preferentially for DA or SA - the bolt has to completely miss its cue to raise. The bolt could be peened and hanging in the frame, the bolt dirty and hanging, the locking notches peened, poor fit between the two, or most often, a weak bolt spring. It’s actually the only of all of these issues which is really a simple fix.

I didnt like the fragile look of the indexing gear on the 7 shooter. The 617 is not a big gun. I doubt it is as big as a k frame. That makes pretty small notches in the gear.

This is the common misconception which seems to refuse to die, despite better knowledge existing in the world. As I described above, in detail, the teeth really are not “stronger” for being thicker. These teeth are under minimal load, and the failure mode is surface galling, not bending or breaking. Having an inch of metal behind them will not make these teeth less apt to fail. The only differentiation is material hardness, which cannot be seen by the naked eye.

Big teeth on the indexing ratchet do not imply strength or durability, no matter how many folks are fooled into thinking it.