9x19 vs. 7.62x25

[dispatch55126]

Here's the deal, I'm a sucker for cheap (money) guns and an even bigger sucker for cheap ammo. With the price of 9mm going up, 7.62x25 keeps looking better.

I know there are only milsurps chambered in this round, but how are the ballistics and handling of this vs. the 9mm?

 

[MCgunner]

I give about 2 dollars a box of 50 for 9mm.......cast bullet, a dab of Bullseye, and primer. Cases and lead are free for the taking at the range. I've never seen 7.62x25 laying around and if I did, it'd probably have berdan primers and a steel case. I got no use for that caliber.

Reload, you cheat yourself if you don't.

For cheap milsurp pistols, I'm sorta wanting a Makarov. It'd be fun to play with and my son-in-laws is pretty accurate. Crappy sights, though.

 

[gripper]

I actually like both calibers( all three if you count the Makarov!).There ARE JHP loadings available for the 7.62X25 nowadays...personally I have always liked the Sellier &Bellot stuff .I kinda (make that definitely! ) wish I still had a lot of the stuff I had to get rid of before I escaped the Peoples Republic of Massghanistan,but as funds become for "spendable" for me I am making a seriou seffort to re-stock my Easten Block stuff.
The Tok is a seriously under-appreciated caliber in this part of the world...yes ,its a hi speed small bore with all of the attendant issues of (over)penetration...that said;it DOES give very good performance(at least in my own expewience). Individual milage may vary

 

[MCgunner]

I had a Chinese Tok. It fired, it fed, but it was a POS. I didn't like the lack of a decent safety positioned where I could actually swipe it off on the draw and, well, what's with that damned master link clip on the side of the thing? Too, the instructions said "2500 round life expectancy" and after several hundred rounds, it was pounding the frame/slide pretty bad. The Russian ones no doubt use better steels or something, but I'll pass.

BTW, my Tok was in 9x19....LOL!

 

[Mastiff]

That's strange. My 9x19 Chinese Tok didn't say anything about a service life of 2500 rounds. I got it new in 1992. I've got over 55,000 rounds through it with no problems whatsoever. It is the most reliable and accurate handgun I own.
I have asked for someone who has it to send me a copy of whatever told them the Chinese Tok has a service life of 2000 or 2500 rounds (I've heard both figures used). No one has done so.

 

[Joe Demko]

How interesting. My 9x19 Chinese Tok beat itself to death in less than 50 rounds. It had to be pounded apart with a mallet just to get the last live round out of it. Beyond any doubt, it was the biggest POS I ever owned. The average Lorcin is several steps up in quality.

 

[JShirley]

I think the 7.62x25mm makes the most sense as a PDW-style short carbine/SBR. Put it in a 10" barreled rifle, and it'd be perfect, and to hell with the 5.7x28mm.

'Course, I guess that's pretty similar to how the 7.62x25mm was originally used, eh?

 

[Joe Demko]

In my wife's home town of Ivano-Frankivsk Ukraine, some photos of partisans recently came to light. These guys fought against the Germans and then Russians well into the 1950's. They were armed with a motley assortment of weapons, but the Shpagin seems to have been extremely popular with them...they certainly had a bunch of them in the photos.

 

[Mastiff]

I guess the quality control on these Chinese Toks must have been real spotty. The guys I know that have them like them. I have never owned a better pistol.

 

[gtmerkley]

7.62 tt hands down

 

[Joe Demko]

I guess the quality control on these Chinese Toks must have been real spotty. The guys I know that have them like them. I have never owned a better pistol.

My Chinese Tok's self destruction was like an accelerated version of how disappointed purchasers of Helwan pistols describe their guns going TU. Crap steel combined with poor/no heat treatment leads to very short service life.
Good on you if you got one done right.

 

[tinygnat219]

Well, considering that the 7.62 Tok round only had 2-3 handguns made for it, and there are 3-4 new 9MM pistols released a day (or it seems) I think we know which caliber won major acceptance.

All in all, I DO enjoy the Tok round. It's fun to shoot.
buy up as much of that milsurp ammo as possible. They aren't making much more of it.

 

[woad_yurt]

I have two Norincos, a 54 and a 213. They are simple, rugged, well-made, reliable, incredibly accurate weapons. What Mastiff said, me too.

The Norincos you're liable to see will be those originally made for commercial sale here. They have virtually no wear and tear on them (ammo was hard to find,) unlike service TT33s used maybe for decades.

 

[FEG]

When the mil surp is gone or completley unreliable (getting there now), I suspect that commercial 7.62x25 will become fairly expensive, due to zero competition.

7.62x25 is difficult and expensive to reload, while 9x19 is about the easiest and cheapest. (.38 Special probably still wins, even today.)

 

[Deanimator]

7.62x25 is difficult and expensive to reload, while 9x19 is about the easiest and cheapest.

EXPENSIVE, maybe. Difficult? How is it more difficult to load than any bottle necked rifle cartridge?

 

[FEG]

EXPENSIVE, maybe. Difficult? How is it more difficult to load than any bottle necked rifle cartridge?

The relative size of the components. Granted, it's easier than .32 ACP.

If you use a progressive, I suppose it doesn't matter as much. On a single stage, I found it to be a PITA. I was also using Lee steel .30 Luger dies, which may not have helped in forming a positive opinion.

 

[strat81]

EXPENSIVE, maybe. Difficult? How is it more difficult to load than any bottle necked rifle cartridge?

Bottle neck cartridges are more difficult to reload than straight wall cartridges, mainly due to the lube/sizing issue.

And even if it's not more difficult, it's certainly more time consuming.