Airsoft and the Broken Window - Update

[BeverlyD]

Thank you to everyone that responded to my post about my neighbor's window that he thought was broken by my son's airsoft gun. I sincerely appreciate everyone's response. I finally got a close look at the second story broken window. It has an actual small hole in it through the first pane of the double pane glass. A very small circle of glass is laying between the two panes, but no BB. The hole looks to be the size of a metal BB. My neighbor had a window company come out and look at the window and the service person told him it was definitely broken by a BB from a pellet or pump gun.

My neighbor has no experience with airsoft and was not open to any other explanation for the damage other than my son or one of his friends hit the window with an airsoft BB, or that they used metal BBs in their airsoft guns. He said circumstantial evidence pointed to them and is understandably upset about his window. I've questioned all the boys individually - all their stories match up with what my husband and I had observed while they were playing. No one had metal BBs or the type of gun even that would fire metal BBs.

I had previously told my neighbor that I would want to be responsible for any damage that my son or one of his friends caused and I still hold to that statement. However, I do hope that my neighbor will do some research on airsoft and come to understand that there is quite a difference between an airsoft gun and a pellet or pump gun and that it is extremely unlikely that an airsoft gun broke the window. Also, it's not fair to assume that because my son and his friends play with airsoft guns that they are up to mischief. My neighbor said there was no other explanation, but in a neighborhood with over 1500 school age children, there is definitely an explanation - we just don't know what it is.

Again, thank you to all. I'm glad I found THR! Bev

 

[cordex]

Thanks for the update, Bev.

 

[Fosbery]

"circumstantial evidence pointed to them"

Well, that's good enough for a court of law, so it's good enough for him

 

[LiquidTension]

1500 school age children in the neighborhood? That's a huge neighborhood Or is it full of Mormons?

 

[BeverlyD]

Big new neighborhood - just a few Mormons! Lots of families all here for the schools which are unfortunately already overcrowded after only being open 5 years.

 

[Deer Hunter]

It's times like these that I'm glad I grew up in a place where my closest neighbor was across the pasture...

 

[kludge]

Ask you neighbor if they'd allow a bargain...

Allow you to shoot at his broken window with your kid's air soft gun (it's already broken).

If it breaks you'll pay 100% If it doesn't break, offer to shoot at it again, but only offer to pay half... every time you attempt it and it doesn't break the offer goes down by the percentage of shots fired.

 

[NineseveN]

I like Kludge's idea. BRILLIANT!

 

[WinchesterAA]

Nah, what you do is.. tell your son to go over to his house, introduce himself or whatever, pull out his airsoft gun and shoot himself in the palm of his hand.

 

[rustymaggot]

metal bbs have far greater range than airsoft. the one that broke his window probably came from 6 yards over.

i like the idea of the percentage thing but the already broken window is compromised a bit already.

why not hand the neighbor a airsoft and let him have 5 shots at your windows from the same distance. if it doesnt break then you dont pay.

 

[dartos]

Winchester, are you serious?

Telling a child to shoot himself....

Please clarify.

Thanks!

 

[Lupinus]

you still face the same problem if he takes you to court

you admitted guilt, agreed to pay, and later changed your mind. In a court of law depending on the judge and local laws you will loose reguardless of how much you provide that an airsoft is not likely to break a window.

 

[Stiletto Null]

Winchester, are you serious?

Telling a child to shoot himself....

Please clarify.

With an airsoft gun.

The things sting, but generally can't break skin, even from near contact range.

 

[WinchesterAA]

I've had similar problems with neighbors thinking I did stuff back when I used to play airsoft in my backyard. Upon hearing about it I always shoot myself in the palm of the hand and grin. It's cleared me of blame on the spot.

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

Since you already agreed to pay I'd pay, otherwise there will probably be bad blood between your neighbor and you and will face problems in the future. However, I'd have your son shoot the broken window a few times to show the neighbor it couldn't have been done with an airsoft (or if it breaks, whoops maybe it was!). Maybe he'll realize it wasn't the kids and give you back some of the money with no hard feelings and no future animosity towards the airsofters if another window mysteriously breaks (I bet it was a bird).

 

[Aguila Blanca]

Aside from one being metal and the other plastic, the basic difference beween BBs and airsoft pellets is size (caliber). Traditional, Daisy Red Ryder metal BBs are .177 caliber. Airsoft pellets are 6mm, which equates to approximately .236 caliber, which is almost exactly one-third larger. Hold 'em side-by-side in your hand and the airsoft pellet will appear to be about twice as large.

 

[Jim March]

Which means if you DID put BBs in an airsoft gun you'll get almost no velocity.

Are there metal airsoft-sized pellets even commonly available? And would an airsoft gun have the power needed to fling them at respectable speed?

 

[warwagon]

Airsoft

BeverlyD,

There are a couple of posabilaties here, one of them is not an air soft breaking the pane. From the angle you desceibe, and distance, it would be impossible foe a blastic bb to penetrate.

I did an experiment after reading your original post, and found that even with the most powerful electric, the bbs would do no more harm than inflict painful stings, in sensetive places, upon riccochet. This was from six feet away, and a second story window by definition, is ten feet from the ground, and at an acute angle to a shooter positioned six feet from the base.

As for court, it will be a matter of whom said what, and witnesses to those statements. You will have to take the decision on the course you wish to follow.

As to shooting the pane, remember, is is already compromised, and may be much weaker than an intact pane of like kind, also consider the angle, and distances, otherwise you may inadvertantly prove thier point, even though the findings would be false. Convincing them of the facts after that would be next to impossible.

I hope it works out well for you, and hope our advice on this forum has helped,

Blair

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

BTW, since you said it's a double pane and the outside pane is already broken I would shoot the unbroke side for the demonstration (outside of the house when they change the window if he doesn't want you in his place).

 

[dartos]

I have several airsoft guns, electric and gas, the electric fires at appx.280FPS, the gas is appx. 320FPS,I love to shoot those AOL CD's they send you in the mail, the guns rip them apart , I have also seen a photo in the airsoft mag FPS that showed an airsoft pellet in the back of someones ear, you could see only 1/4th of the exposed pellet, it was a freak shot but if there is a possibility of damage and with some of the upgraded guns out there I would advise against shooting yourself or anyone without protection.

I made a point to teach my sons to NEVER point a gun at someone or something that you didn't want to damage or kill, yes we enjoy paintpall, but we NEVER would shoot someone to prove safety, it just doesn't make sense.

 

[WinchesterAA]

Yeah, I don't point firearms at things unless I intend to shoot them either, as a general rule..

but airsoft.. that's a toy that vaguely resembles a firearm.


ETA -

Hi everyone! I hope someone can give me some information about airsoft guns. Everything I've read and every person I've contacted has told me that airsoft BBs cannot break a window (assuming of course a reasonable range). My neighbor has a broken window that he discovered after a recent airsoft battle that my son and his friends had in our backyard. His house is at least 30 feet from our backyard and the second story window is a good 20 feet high. The kids all have inexpensive guns and use .12g 6mm BBs. I was absolutely mortified when my neighbor showed me the window and of course agreed to accept responsibility. However, I've been doing some research. Everyone I've talked to plus everything online without exception says it is impossible because the BBs and the window must obey the laws of physics: mass/weight/velocity/etc. Can anyone explain this to me so I can go talk to my neighbor again. Or, let me know if you know differently - that these BBs can break a window because I do want to be a good neighbor and be responsible for my son. Thank you so much!

upon reading the original thread.. If I were in your shoes, I'd have laughed at whoever it was blaming my kid for that.

The only way one of those plastic BBs is gunna break a window is if hell freezes over and the massive chill following that caused the window to become so brittle that simply cocking your head back, hocking up a nice ball of phlem, and applying appropriate amounts of pressure to the lips combined with a blowing action and projecting said ball of phlem into that window would indeed.. break that window.

IE - not gunna happen. Not today, not tommorow, not whatever day it was that whatever happened happened.

 

[hso]

I do think the idea of letting him shoot at your window at the distance and angle described is an excellent way of demonstrating to him that it can't have been an airsoft. If your window breaks you've got proof that it could have been as he thinks and if it doesn't it shows him that there's some other explanation.

 

[akodo]

you still face the same problem if he takes you to court

you admitted guilt, agreed to pay, and later changed your mind. In a court of law depending on the judge and local laws you will loose reguardless of how much you provide that an airsoft is not likely to break a window.

Taking your example, if we are in court, there are a few people I'd like to swear in.

second, in a court of law, if you can prove that a witness purgered himself, cases get overturned and thrown out.

and finally, this wasn't handled in a court of law.

 

[pax]

Windows are expensive.

But a new window is a cheap price to pay for peace with your neighbor.

I grew up in a neighborhood where one family was at war with another family. It was very, very ugly. No one won.

pax

 

[Bwana John]

I do not like the idea of kids using airsoft guns as toys.

I do like the idea of kids being allowed to gain the respect due to firearms by letting them have .22's.

I am guessing the stupid little plastic balls all over the neibhors yard gave him the idea that is what broke the window. At the very least you probley owe the neibhor for trash pick up.