Alabama nears no-permit CCW, but LEOs say permit needed

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Not exactly.

The Second Amendment dis not apply to the states until SCOTUS ruled in 1010 that was incorporated via the Fourteenth Amendment.
The 14th addressed issues of Reconstruction, it was about affording rights held by citizens to those who previously we're not considered to be citizens. Long before that, in Dred Scott vs Sandford the opinion of the court was that had Scott been considered a citizen, he would have held the right.
 
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One thing worth pointing out is that law enforcement in other States have made every claim in the book about how bad Constitutional Carry would be if passed and in every situation there has not been evidence to support those statements after Constitutional Carry is passed.
As often as not, they've made EXACTLY the same claims about "shall issue" carry WITH a credential. It's certainly been that way with the Ohio State Highway Patrol.

They fought CCW for years because it was "dangerous to police"... without being able to explain the dashcam video of White supremacists Chayne(sp?) and Chevy Keyhoe trying to shoot a cop BEFORE CCW was legal.

Then when the risible vehicular handling rules were going to be rescinded, they claimed that people could "drive down the street, twirling a gun on their finger". Strangely, there have been no reports of such behavior so far.

I don't lend any special weight to police opinions of the 1st, 4th, 5th and 13th Amendments. I see no reason why I should treat their opinions of the 2nd Amendment any differently.
 
Well unfortunately for Alabama citizens who have the right to own a firearm, they are still required to have a permit to carry one concealed. The bill stalled in the House and is now dead.

In regards to the Sheriffs stating it isn't a money issue and it is a LEO safety issue, they are lying about the money issue and too ignorant to think that a piece of paper/plastic is going to make LEO safer. I happen to work in the Criminal Justice system in Alabama and see the truth behind some of the arrests. Most of those that are arrested for not having a permit is because they cannot get one. The arrests that are made for carrying without a permit usually have more serious additional charges, and the firearm is discovered as they are being searched after the decision to arrest has been made. In my job I have yet to see someone arrested strictly for carrying without a permit, it is always an added charge.

Alabama law that prohibits firearm ownership is not as strict as federal law, meaning you could have a felony conviction for forgery 1st and still be allowed to possess a pistol according to state law, but prohibited federally: "(a) No person who has been convicted in this state or elsewhere of committing or attempting to commit a crime of violence, misdemeanor offense of domestic violence, violent offense as listed in Section 12-25-32(15) (forgery isn't in the list under this section), anyone who is subject to a valid protection order for domestic abuse, or anyone of unsound mind shall own a firearm or have one in his or her possession or under his or her control"

The fact of the matter is that a criminals do not obey the law in the first place, hence them being criminals. The law states they need a permit, they don't have one because they can't get one and they continue to carry. Technically the permit really does not do anything except for generate revenue and provide a list of people who own firearms, and let people carry a pistol which should be covered by the 2nd Amendment, but sadly isn't.
 
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"...a defacto registration scheme..." That's what all those ATF forms are for. This is a scare tactic by a lying civil servant. Next Sherriff's election is 11/06/2018.
"...stating it's a safety issue..." Is what our cops' union said when they wanted tax payers to buy 'em pistols instead of junker revolvers. Our Customs types union said the same thing a few years ago when they wanted to arm the clerks and part time housewives and students collecting taxes at the border. Last I heard, most of 'em failed the training course.
 
I've enforced laws and investigating crimes in Alabama for 22 years. (Boy, saying it that way and I all of a sudden start to feel old!) I cannot think of a single criminal I ever found thanks to his pistol permit. I DID track one down one that we prosecuted for attempted murder by his hunting license in Mississippi. That one was like a sitcom come to life.

Blake Dorning is toeing the official line of the Alabama Sheriff's Assn. They have an extremely incestuous relationship with the Alabama Peace Officer's Standards and Training Commission (APOST) and they are part of the most corrupt part of Alabama government. Right now, there are FAR more Republicans in Alabama than Democrats in most counties. What tends to happen is that the Republican executive committee in most counties will go and recruit someone from one larger nearby departments and agree to back them in a bid for Sheriff. Since they have donors lined up YEARS ahead of elections, there is little chance of a primary challenger upsetting the apple cart, and NO chance of a Democrat or 3rd party challenger upsetting the plan. The newly selected candidate tends to hold the office for 3+ terms which qualifies them for state retirement, and they either retire or look at going on to higher office.

One of the problems with this arrangement is that ASA\APOST and the newly cobbled together Alabama Law Enforcement Agency (ALEA) all tend to take the attitude that unless you are POST certified, that you should leave guns at home. I believe that most of this is fear that someone will shoot someone else and administrative types HATE to have to stand in front of reporters and answer questions like "Why didn't you stop this before it happened?" I mean honestly, if we just told everyone to leave the guns at home, won't that just fix every conceivable type of violent crime? (hint: the correct answer is either "no", or to simply roll your eyes.) You combine this attitude of "we'll just put the brakes on this by not letting\discouraging the carrying of guns" with the easily shocked "respectable citizens" of the world (picture Aunt Bea here), you can see how we get this "I'm a gun owner and member of the NRA but..." type of logical disconnect.

Then you have one of the truly comic figures in this saga. Bobby Timmons is the Executive Director of the ASA, and the closest thing to Sorrell Booke's portrayal of Boss Hogg that you will EVER see. Timmons has, from what I can tell, NEVER worked in law enforcement, but I have seen him riding around in what he has made up to look like a police car, complete with blue lights, a misdemeanor in Alabama. (As I said, it'll hurt your head...) Here is the story exposing the internal ASA email about permit fees, which range from a low of $7.50 to a high of $20.00, depending on county. (They will let you pay for up to 5 years up front, and renew by mail as long as you come in once every 5 years for a new photo. Where did I put that Excedrine?)

Keep in mind that Alabama is an open carry state, and the primary reason we have preemption now is because certain cities tried to pass "no open carry" statutes. I know at least in one case that the open carriers were doing so because back then, we were still shall issue, and that particular Sheriff wouldn't issue. That still doesn't address the issue that if you are open carrying, under our truly bizarre laws, as soon as you get into a car, you are carrying concealed and therefore need a permit.

in my mind, the whole permit thing should be admitted for what it is, a tax to fund various projects that the Sheriff can't get county\state money for. Originally, the Sheriffs and Constables in Alabama were set up to work primarily on a fee for service basis, but that system was seriously altered in the 60's and 70's culminating in the changes in the 1975 Code of Alabama. Howell Heflin, who some of you might remember as a former u.s., Senator who bore a striking resemblance to Mr. Haney on Green Acres created the Unified Judicial System as a state legislator. He abolished the Justices of the Peace, almost abolished the office of Constable, laid the framework for APOST, and in general did much to screw up the system as it existed. With the JPs gone, the District Courts were FLOODED with petty cases that now take months to bring to trial, traffic tickets are now $20.00 with court costs in some jurisdictions soaring to over $150-200, and the Sheriff is now paid whether he does his job or not. Personally, I'm not out there arresting Julius T. Badguy for shooting up the mall and finding his pistol permit on him. The arrests I have made for violent crimes seem to involve bad guys who DON'T have permits. Go figure...

The truth is a background check and plastic card don't make officers safer. Good guys aren't a threat, and bad guys will carry without a permit. It isn't that the political class can't see this, its that they lust after the money. They've admitted it in private, but refuse to in public. Even after the aformposted al.com story (and they are NOT gun friendly) they still insist that its not about the money. If there was a training requirement (something I oppose to exercise a constitutional right) their position would at least be consistent, but it isn't. What you have here is a Constitutionalist swimming against the tide. We had a permit reform bill go through a few years ago to get from may to shall issue. It looks like it'll just be a little harder to get to permitless\Constitutional carry.
 
I don't lend any special weight to police opinions of the 1st, 4th, 5th and 13th Amendments. I see no reason why I should treat their opinions of the 2nd Amendment any differently.

Police are civil servants. They don't have a crystal ball or any way to know exactly how they will be affected without permits to carry. If voters and legislators decide they want permit less carry then it's up to the police do their job without permits. I would like to think that the police get enough money and training to do their job safely but CC isn't their call. That belongs to the citizens and their state representatives. These days if you confront a cop with a weapon you're probably going to get shot anyway, permit or not.
 
I work along side police officers and sheriffs all the time. Very few prefer constitutional carry. But not for any reason other than they like to see the card when it is asked for. Personally I don't care either way, most counties in Alabama charge a very small fee for a CC permit. And I like to have mine in my wallet for when I travel to another reciprocity state. Paying $16 to carry is nothing compared to the $150+ NYS wanted to charge me on a "maybe."
 
Sheriff Dorning is out next term, he won't be running again. He should realize that Madison County permit holders will still purchase permits due to the close proximity to TN and the amount of people that frequent into Nashville or Pigeon Forge or just go over the state line for lottery tickets, plus a trip to Atlanta is only 4 hours away and quite a few people will make that drive for concerts and what not. Besides, once they allowed the permits to be purchased for multiple years, quite a few I know went a head and did the full five year purchase, I know I did, so that money has already been collected up front. Either way it has died and hopefully one day it will pass.
 
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