Alaska Safe Schools Act

[D.B. Cooper]

But would you agree all of those in bold are the biggest stakeholders in this, particularly parents? Because I do.

I would agree as well.

A better bill would be to just carve out a new position, which the state itself funds, that assigns a qualified security officer to each school.

1.) We already have that. and 2.) That still denies constitutional rights to teachers. It is past time to restore those rights to teachers.

Lot's of people in education aren't 2A prohibitionists.

I don't know what world you're living in.

 

[The Night Rider]

That's a plausible scenario, but even in that scenario, I'm not sure how being able to run an 8 minute mile, do a bunch of sit ups or jump 14" in the air will make much of a difference.

Have somebody try to take your gun away from you even in training. Once the exercise is over however it turns out have somebody do your basic vitals and see what your heart rate respirations and blood pressure are.

If that scenario is your concern, why not at a requirement that all armed teachers must all be black belts in martial arts?

Because they set a minimum requirement not a maximum

 

[D.B. Cooper]

But these aren't citizens exercising their Second Amendment rights.

Yes, actually, it is.

If they're letting you carry on the clock they have the right to set the ground rules

The second amendment states otherwise.

But your statements do give me pause. I can see now that these rights will continue to be trampled unless and until the Supreme Court somehow puts a stop to it. I do not have high hopes.

 

[The Night Rider]

I don't know what world you're living in.

There are over 2,033,623 certified teachers currently employed in the United States.

Do you profess to know all of their political leanings?

 

[Basura Blanca]

Just as small point of reference here too, the vast majority of incidents in the schools where I work, which required summoning LE, have been ones that involved unruly parents --not students or outside parties. I'm not opposed to people being armed on a campus but realistically speaking, most people in an existing position aren't going to volunteer for an additional job responsibility, especially one that opens them up to legal hassle. That said, I'm not opposed to people doing it either.

 

[The Night Rider]

Yes, actually, it is.

No, actually it's not. These are people employed by the school district. The school district has the right to set the standards they can carry under.

I would object if the law was to allow anybody who is legal to carry to carry on school grounds but they had to pass the PT test.

The second amendment states otherwise.

The Second Amendment lists an enumerated right of The People not agents of the State who are carrying on the state dime.

 

[Basura Blanca]

1.) We already have that.

So there's already a paid armed security position that exists in each school in Alaska?
If that's so and I'm understanding it correctly, wouldn't this proposal be a bit redundant?

It makes way more sense to have that be a standalone job.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

So there's already a paid armed security position that exists in each school in Alaska?
If that's so and I'm understanding it correctly, wouldn't this proposal be a bit redundant?

It makes way more sense to have that be a standalone job.

There is security, but they're unarmed.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

No, actually it's not. These are people employed by the school district. The school district has the right to set the standards they can carry under.

So by that logic, every employer in America can deny their employees their rights.

I would object if the law was to allow anybody who is legal to carry to carry on school grounds but they had to pass the PT test.

Well. Thanks for your support.

The Second Amendment lists an enumerated right of The People not agents of the State who are carrying on the state dime.

So strip out the paid portion. Don't pay teachers to carry guns. Make the carrying of a gun entirely voluntary with no remuneration. That removes "on the state dime" from the equation.

 

[buck460XVR]

Lot's of people in education aren't 2A prohibitionists.

I don't know what world you're living in.

I don't know what world you are living in either. At the High school I work at, it's hard to find any 2A prohibitionists........period. We have a school sponsored trap team. Deer hunting is an excused absence. Maybe Florida, maybe California, but not here. Quit doing what we accuse the antis of doing and stereotyping.

 

[The Night Rider]

So by that logic, every employer in America can deny their employees their rights.

You mean to tell me that you've never worked for an employer who explicitly forbade you to bring a firearm to work?

Well. Thanks for your support.

OK

So strip out the paid portion. Don't pay teachers to carry guns. Make the carrying of a gun entirely voluntary with no remuneration. That removes "on the state dime" from the equation.

Are you going to require all the teachers to pay their own liability insurance?

School property belongs to a corporate entity known as the school board or the school district. Does the property owner have the right to forbid firearms on their property? Do I have the right to tell you that you can't carry a gun in my home?

I'm not aware of any school that is open to The General Public. They limit who can come there to students, parents of students, employees of the school district and people who have business there such as mail delivery.

 

[N555]

I call slippery slope BS. What’s next?

EVERYBODY should have to pass a physical test to be able to exercise their rights?

Who decides the physical test? “Experts?” We saw how experts in science were used in early 2020..

Pass the concealed carry shooting test and let the teachers carry in school.

I say it's a trap. They pass the law then the physical fitness part get an ADA act court challenge and that part gets tossed.
The "physical fitness part" satisfies the gun free zone enthusiasts who really believe a 90 old teacher packing heat will be disarmed by some unstable teen that probably should have been kicked out of school a long time ago.

 

[goon]

From the bill;
"It is the intent of the legislature that the concealed carry of firearms on school grounds by certain qualified persons augment responses by law enforcement during a crisis."

What makes you think it's only about defending a single classroom?

How are tuned-in, heavily armed police clearing a school supposed to differentiate between a teacher with a gun looking for an active shooter and the active shooter himself? I can understand why teachers, LEO’s, and administrators would want teachers to stay in their rooms.

 

[goon]

There is security, but they're unarmed.

No there isn’t. Some Alaskan schools only have ten or twenty students, a couple teachers, and maybe a principal. Some entire communities only have 50 - 200 people total, and often no police presence other than a trooper or VPSO that might cover several communities. Sometimes when you call the police they don’t show up until days later. There isn’t a dedicated security guard at every school.

 

[bearcreek]

How are tuned-in, heavily armed police clearing a school supposed to differentiate between a teacher with a gun looking for an active shooter and the active shooter himself? I can understand why teachers, LEO’s, and administrators would want teachers to stay in their rooms.

I don't know. I'm not a member of the Alaska legislature.

No there isn’t. Some Alaskan schools only have ten or twenty students, a couple teachers, and maybe a principal. Some entire communities only have 50 - 200 people total, and often no police presence other than a trooper or VPSO that might cover several communities. Sometimes when you call the police they don’t show up until days later. There isn’t a dedicated security guard at every school.

I would think that, at least in some cases, this type of situation would help though. Chances are high that the police who respond would know the designated staff person at that school.

 

[D.B. Cooper]

An interesting development. I emailed the Senator who authored and filed the bill addressing my concerns. She replied a few moments ago (on a Sunday evening on a holiday weekend no less) and explained that the committee chairs in the state Senate told her the bill would be DOA and never make it out of committee if it didn't have the same standards as law enforcement.

I can't say I'm surprised. So, as I stated earlier, what is it going to take to get a ruling from the Supreme Court to mandate districts restore 2A rights to teachers?

 

[bubbatime]

The law is a step in the right direction. The physical fitness standards is too strict and needs removed from the bill.

A 300 pound principal can engage a threat just fine.

 

[The Night Rider]

There is security,

but they're unarmed.

Those two things don't go together

 

[bearcreek]

I can't say I'm surprised. So, as I stated earlier, what is it going to take to get a ruling from the Supreme Court to mandate districts restore 2A rights to teachers?

This bill seems to be more than simply "restoring" 2A rights to teachers. It's designating a specific staff person or persons to assist law enforcement with lethal force, should the need arise. Seems to be kind of a different issue really. Unless I'm just reading the bill wrong, which is possible.

 

[goon]

I don't know. I'm not a member of the Alaska legislature.

I would think that, at least in some cases, this type of situation would help though. Chances are high that the police who respond would know the designated staff person at that school.

Even a pro-2A legislator is likely to ask how we’d keep the police from accidentally shooting another good guy. Legislators aren’t any smarter or better qualified than the voters who elect them in my experience. If you don’t have a better idea, neither do they.

 

[hso]

Jeeze, just amend it in committee to get rid of the fitness requirement. THAT's how politics works.

 

[AlexanderA]

But these aren't citizens exercising their Second Amendment rights. These are employees of the school board who are going to be acting as employees of the school board while they're carrying a gun.

Yes. We seem to be overlooking this key aspect. The teachers would not be acting as ordinary private citizens.

 

[westernrover]

An interesting development. I emailed the Senator who authored and filed the bill addressing my concerns. She replied a few moments ago (on a Sunday evening on a holiday weekend no less) and explained that the committee chairs in the state Senate told her the bill would be DOA and never make it out of committee if it didn't have the same standards as law enforcement.

It won't pass the majority caucus in the Senate period. It's just an exercise in position-taking for the senator who filed it.

 

[bearcreek]

If you don’t have a better idea, neither do they.

Did you read the bill? That quote wasn't me guessing. That was a direct quote from the bill.

 

[goon]

Did you read the bill? That quote wasn't me guessing. That was a direct quote from the bill.

I did read the bill.

From the bill;
"It is the intent of the legislature that the concealed carry of firearms on school grounds by certain qualified persons augment responses by law enforcement during a crisis."

What makes you think it's only about defending a single classroom?

Not later than July 1 of each year, each school district shall provide to local and state law enforcement agencies (1) the district's active shooter plan for each of the district's school buildings; (2) the floor plan for each of the district's school buildings; the floor plan must identify locked and unlocked entrances, accessible windows, safe huddle areas, the location of any gun-storage lockers, and the room assignment of each qualified person, if applicable;

Seems they’d want the room assignment on record so LEO’s know who the good guys with guns are and where they are. Maybe the plan is to get everyone in “safe huddle areas” and guard the entrances rather than sending anyone out to confront the shooter. Maybe that’s practical, maybe it’s not…

From what I can see, this bill isn’t about arming teachers or really about the 2A. It might help with school security, but it wouldn’t be a 2nd Amendment win IMO.