Allowing Access to Your Home

[RX-79G]

So you think that I should have allowed someone unfettered access to the property before I verified they had a legitimate reason to be there, just so I didn't make him suspect that there might be something of value? I'm sorry but I fail to see the logic in that.

No. I just don't agree that you increased your security by chasing him away.

I like that the guy came to your door, and if I had to choose between that guy and whomever ended up coming out next time, I would go with the one I met. So I probably would have called the insurance company right then to have them confirm and get it over with since I was home and might not be next time.


I agree that my neighbors aren't my security. But their proximity may make shattering my windows unappealing to criminals.



Overall, houses are about as secure as sieves when we aren't there. Many vinyl sided houses can be broken into by kicking through the walls between joists. Some things we do actually increase security, and some things increase our feeling of security but don't actually change much.


My main feeling about the guy who came to your house was what happened with Shaq's cable guy. While Shaq did the right thing, I'd rather not have people needing to come back - especially not in a bad mood.

So I thought the topic and discussion was worthwhile, regardless if you and I agree completely or not. We should all be thinking about what happens when we aren't there and how we handle people who come by.

 

[huntsman]

I've had the same insurance company for 40 years and they've never come to the house to "take pictures"....at least once it was built. I can't remember if the agent even came there when we constructed it. All they cared about was the appraisal cost.

What if they came and you aren't aware of it?

 

[PCFlorida]

My dog would not be pleased

Oh, I don't know. I think our pack of Rotties would have loved a new toy.

 

[khegglie]

Question....

What are your opinions on the "We are doing a roof in the neighborhood, could we come and set up a long term quote"? Approach.
This is common in my region.
They have the shirts, badges and clipboards props.
I am polite for a while but I consider any unsolicited doorknocker as a suspect caser until proven otherwise.
No one comes in.

 

[RX-79G]

The local public service announcements recommend against that kind of sales, but not because they are criminals casing your house, but because of the poor work they do.

 

[old lady new shooter]

"I get two or three calls a week from someone who can barely speak English claiming to be from the IRS, the Sheriff's office, or my credit card company making one kind of claim or another trying to scam me."

I must be the least important person in America, I've never even been contacted by that Nigerian prince.

Years ago for awhile I had a business arranging business financing. This was before email. (Yes, boys and girls, there was a time before email...) I once received a paper letter by postal mail with a variation on what became the Nigerian prince scam (well, it was from Nigeria and equally unbelievable as the prince flavor), in this case looking for financing for some totally cockamamie supposed business plan.

 

[old lady new shooter]

I'd be thinking of changing insurance carriers if they think they have the right to "inspect" your property in the first place. Complaints about insurance company practices go to The Insurance Bureau(really just a lobby group for the companies), up here. Illinois probably has something similar.
"...I get two or three calls a week from..." No "Do not call." list in Texas? Unsolicited marketing or other calls are illegal up here. If you put your number on the list. Cost Bell 1.5 Million, as I recall, for ignoring it.

The do not call list is worthless, I stopped reporting scam calls to them a long time ago. I blocked all the numbers that would fit in my phone's blocked number quota, now just don't answer calls from any unblocked number I don't recognize, look up the number online afterwards, most are scams so I haven't missed anything.

 

[old lady new shooter]

I did think it was pretty foolish of my provider to send a LETTER instead of calling or emailing - i.e. something a heck of a lot faster.

Not to mention the possibility of the letter being stolen out of your mailbox. I once had a credit card stolen out of my mailbox, the thief charged $5000 on it the very next day. (This was before they made you validate the card by calling from your home phone.)

 

[old lady new shooter]

I was reminded of an incident several years ago. At 10pm I heard my dogs barking. I went out to my security gate & a young guy wearing a tool belt & climbing equipment is standing there. He says, "I'm from Century Communications & I'm investigating people who are stealing cable TV in this area."
I said, "Well, I don't have cable TV - just regular antenna TV."
He says, "I'm going up on your roof to check."
I said, "No, you're not going on my roof."
He actually said, "I have a legal right to go on your roof to see if you're stealing cable."
I said, "You're pretty young....that attitude & stupidity may prevent you from getting any older. Like I said, you are not going up on my roof & now would be a very smart time to get off my property."
He again said, "I'm going up on your roof."
I said, "If you do, you'll stay up there for the rest of your life...I'm armed & I'll do whatever I have to do to keep you off my roof & you're not getting a second warning."

He left. The next day, when I wasn't home & the gate was open to allow the gardener to work, he cut my TV antenna where the cable comes out of the living room. I phoned the company & told them what happened. I also told his boss he had exactly 30 minutes to have someone over here to replace my antenna. TEN minutes later, a technician showed up & replaced it with a better-quality cable & said the $250.00 service call will come out of his clown employee's next check.

That idiot was really an employee of the cable company? And they didn't fire him after that? Yikes...

 

[old lady new shooter]

I've had the same insurance company for 40 years and they've never come to the house to "take pictures"....at least once it was built. I can't remember if the agent even came there when we constructed it. All they cared about was the appraisal cost.

Honestly I no longer remember whether my insurance company photographed this house when I bought it. They have never asked for photos since though. They did require photos of my rental property which is in a different area, but only when I first bought it, never since.

 

[berettaprofessor]

What if they came and you aren't aware of it?

Well, maybe they've done a great stealth job. If so, they weren't caught by my stay at home wife in all those years. And they would have done better than my county appraisers, who've been noticed a number of times nosing about.

 

[khegglie]

The local public service announcements recommend against that kind of sales, but not because they are criminals casing your house, but because of the poor work they do.

I agree that the door knocker squad does poor work like the new roof work in the neighborhood that needed a tarp on it after the install.

Thats a crime in itself!

 

[huntsman]

Well, maybe they've done a great stealth job. If so, they weren't caught by my stay at home wife in all those years. And they would have done better than my county appraisers, who've been noticed a number of times nosing about.

I averaged between 100-150 of these inspections a year for 5 years. My job was simpler IF no one answered the door, so I knock wait a minute then start my inspection.

A simple ranch or colonial without outbuilding or hazards and I could be in and out the drive in less than 10mins.

FWIW one company I worked for was in business for 25 years before I started in 01 so this is not a new business practice just cloaked well.

 

[Jeff White]

Well it's a moot point now. I'm with a new company this afternoon and I told the old company in no uncertain terms why they lost my business.

They tried to lay it on the contractor saying that their contract called for them to send a post card, then call for an appointment.

I told the nice woman on the other end of the line that a card and call from their contractor wasn't sufficient that it was their responsibility to contact me. I explained to her that anyone can send me a post card or make a phone call. Neither one proves the third party has legitimate business on my property.

No one gets access to my property on an unsolicited visit. Period!


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[Vern Humphrey]

There you go. The most powerful words in the English language are, "I'll take my business elsewhere."

 

[huntsman]

So did the new company promise not to inspect? I ask because I had to do repeat visits to the same homeowner with different companies.

 

[Jeff White]

The new company is a local company that specializes in farms and rural properties, they introduced me to the one man they use to conduct inspections and is their claims adjuster. Told me if anyone but him showed up claiming to represent them, to hold that person for the sheriff.


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[blarby]

I'd be thinking of changing insurance carriers if they think they have the right to "inspect" your property in the first place.

You;d be hard pressed to find a property insurance company that DOESN'T have the right to inspect your property based on the contract you signed.

The new company is a local company that specializes in farms and rural properties, they introduced me to the one man they use to conduct inspections and is their claims adjuster. Told me if anyone but him showed up claiming to represent them, to hold that person for the sheriff.

Regional carriers are often much more pleasant to deal with on underwriting and "special" issues, im glad you found one.

 

[Snyper]

Probably better for him then being proned out in the wet grass waiting for the sheriff to arrive, which is what would have happened had he just walked around the yard taking pictures.

That's a pretty big over reaction.

 

[Jeff White]

I don't see where wanting to be notified in advance when they are sending someone out is a "special" issue.

I have been a homeowner for 35 years. I've been insured all of that time and am on my third mortgage. I've seen all kinds of insurance contracts and mortgages and I have yet to see a clause that authorizes them access to the property without prior notice.

The insurance company I was with for 35 years ( until they went out of business after the 2009-2011 tornado seasons never sent anyone out without prior arrangement. I don't see any reason why anyone else I do business with should either.

Given the number of break ins that happen, I find it especially ironic that an insurance company, who ultimately would write the claim check would expect their insured to allow anyone claiming to represent them onto the property without having the visit coordinated in advance.

I have an 800 number to call to verify the identity of anyone who shows up claiming to work for either utility company.

When I went to verify the identity of the guy who claimed to work for my insurance company I had to call my agent, who had to call the company and then be transferred to someone who could answer the question.

Maybe I'm a little more security conscious then most people. But having worked in LE here and having sent people who live around here to prison and having my lab poisoned in 2008 while everyone was in St Louis at a baseball game, I don't want anyone on the property that I don't know and haven't vetted.

Perhaps my security needs are different. But I don't recommend that just anyone be permitted to wander around anyone's property taking pictures.


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[Good Ol' Boy]

I wholeheartedly agree with you Jeff, and am glad you found a suitable solution.

Not to get to far off topic but if you think what you've experienced with that insurance company was bad, try living in a historical Civil War county. The metal detector guys just stop at any rural plot and start walking the property. The decent ones will come up and ask permission.

 

[RX-79G]

Why would someone poison your dog, Jeff?

 

[Jeff White]

I'm quite sure it was someone I sent to prison. Cops make a lot of enemies, in a rural area you are pretty easy to find.

We were driving home from the cardinals game when my youngest son who was coming in for the weekend from his home in Missouri called and said that there was something wrong with Rebel. Drove home as fast as I could safely and Rebel was in bad shape. Called a vet who agreed to come in to the office but Rebel had died by the time we got there. Vet said he was poisoned.

I haven't found out who is responsible yet, but sooner or later someone will brag about it and word will get out.

You make a lot of friends working in LE but unfortunately you make a lot of enemies too.

Could have been someone I sent to prison, could have been someone I wrote for DUI, could be someone who just doesn't like cops. Who knows?

I've not had the house shot at like a couple of the people I worked with have. I guess I just pay more attention and things like someone wanting around the property that I don't know bother me more then others.


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[Good Ol' Boy]

Yet another endurance LEO's must face even off the job.

That's sad Jeff.

 

[skoro]

I'm looking for a new insurance company now.

I would be too, under similar circumstances. If they were so incompetent on this occasion, how well could they handle an actual claim?