Always carry a firearm, always …

[Bruce in West Oz]

Gran wrestles croc
John Wright
12oct04

A BRISBANE grandmother, 60, was being hailed a hero last night after taking on a 4m, 300kg crocodile to save a friend and his family during a horrific attack in far north Queensland.

Alicia Sorohan, of Chandler, was beach-camping with family and friends at remote Bathurst Bay, 250km north of Cooktown, when a saltwater crocodile invaded their campsite at 4am yesterday.

Alerted by screams, Mrs Sorohan and her husband Bill rushed to a nearby tent to find a member of their party, Andrew Kerr, of Tingalpa, in the jaws of a crocodile and being dragged towards the sea.

Mr Kerr's wife, Diane, said she was in her tent with him and their three-month-old son Kelly when she was awoken by a noise outside.

"I heard a thud and I got up and looked through the netting on the tent door," Mrs Kerr said.

"I saw this croc right there looking at us. I said 'there's a croc, Andrew'. He sat up and the croc just lunged at him. The croc was attacking and he was screaming saying 'get the baby, get the baby'.

"The croc had him by the legs and was dragging him out of the tent. I picked up the bassinet and I had hold of it with one hand and I had Andrew's hand with the other and the croc just ended up dragging us all outside the tent.

"I was just screaming 'Andrew, Andrew, Andrew'."

When Mrs Sorohan saw Mr Kerr in the jaws of the crocodile she jumped on its head. The animal turned on her, grabbing her by the arm. Mrs Sorohan's son Jason then shot the croc in the head.

The horrified onlookers included Mrs Sorohan's two granddaughters, Kaitlyn, 6, and Rhiannan, 3, and their parents Wayne and Melinda Clancy, of Greenbank, Brisbane.

The family, still in shock at the site late yesterday, said Mrs Sorohan's bravery had been astonishing.

"She deserves an award of some kind," Mr Clancy said. "The croc just came up out of the water straight to Andrew's tent. It just crashed straight through the tent and grabbed him.

"We heard screams, jumped up and ran over. We couldn't see a thing at first because it was black. Then we saw the croc. It had ripped into Andrew pretty badly and had hold of Alicia by the arm.

"Fortunately, there was a gun handy and that was the end of it.

"Jason (Alicia's son) shot the croc in the back of the head."

The two victims, suffering serious multiple wounds, were evacuated from the site by road and helicopter after their radio distress calls were picked up by quarantine service officers working in the area.

The party of three Brisbane families had been on an annual four-wheel-drive fishing/camping holiday to far north Queensland.

They knew the area around Bathurst Bay well having camped there every year for the past five years.

The beach where they were camping is adjacent to Cape Melville National Park and is a popular campsite for four-wheel-drive and fishing enthusiasts in the dry season.

Queensland Parks and Wildlife rangers who attended the scene late yesterday said there had been no history previous crocodile attacks on humans in the area.

The male crocodile involved in yesterday's attack was estimated to be about 50 years old.

Mrs Kerr and her young son last night were evacuated from the site by helicopter to Cooktown.

The other family members in the group had packed up by sunset and they were heading away from the area towards Cooktown.

http://www.couriermail.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5936,11046297%5E952,00.html

 

[twency]

there was a gun handy and that was the end of it

And that is all I have to say about that.

-twency

 

[HankL]

Hiyah Mate! A good ending to that story. Good thing that they thought to bring the pistol along.

 

[Highpower1]

Puts a whole new meaning to the Dingo took my baby

 

[enfield]

Next - Jason goes to jail for having a gun, killing an endangered species, etc, etc.

 

[Parker Dean]

Next - Jason goes to jail for having a gun, killing an endangered species, etc, etc.

It would be interesting to know if there is a subsequent legal action like that. Since I doubt we can count on the press to report that or not, Anybody got any contacts in the area?

 

[Brian Dale]

Thanks, Bruce. Good piece.

 

[wasrjoe]

Hahaha, that story is about 10x better when the quoted parts are read out loud in an Australian accent with "CRICKEY!" thrown in every now and then.

 

[Stand_Watie]

Hahaha, that story is about 10x better when the quoted parts are read out loud in an Australian accent with "CRICKEY!" thrown in every now and then.

I understand that just before the attack Steve Irwin was poking it with a sharp stick...

"Crikey!, you're a grumpy buggaahh, ahhn't you?"

 

[Andrew Rothman]

Was it legal for the guy to have a gun while camping? Anyone?

 

[duckslayer]

Didn't Austrailia only outlaw handguns like England? Or did they take everything? The article didn't say what kind of gun he had.

 

[Justin]

I too would be interested to know if there is any subsequent legal action taken against the person who shot the croc.

For any of our Aussie members, under what circumstances can one legally carry a firearm?

 

[Standing Wolf]

I don't leave home without shoes, socks, trousers, a shirt, my wallet, and a gun.

 

[SMLE]

I don't leave home without shoes, socks, trousers, a shirt, my wallet, and a gun.

The first five are negotiable, the gun is NOT!

And open carry is legal in NM. (although it applied to pistols and not "guns")

 

[Cacique500]

That's why I dont go camping...anywhere.

 

[TRanger]

For camping and hunting it is ok to have a rifle if you are licensed

Handguns are very tightly regulated and the laws vary from state to state

Crocs are a protected animal so he could possibly face charges

But I would hope that logic prevails and he gets to keep the hide at least

Because the has been a ban on shooting crocs for a long time now their numbers have increased to the point of them being out of control

Thankfully being from Victoria we don't have crocs

Steve Irwin is just about the only Aussie that says crikey

Rob

 

[Bruce in West Oz]

Was it legal what Jason did?

Let's see:

• Strictly speaking, he was not allowed to have a firearm in a national park. Authorities have said they will not charge him, given the gravity of the situation.

• The croc is protected -- but Jason won't be charged on the same basis as above.

• There was no mention of whether he had the firearm "stored securely" as required by law. From the speed with which he retrieved it, I would guess not. It depends on the coppers as to whether he'll be charged or not. I doubt it, but it is possible. Depends how loudly the antis and animal libbers bleat.

• Different states have different rules about carrying firearms in vehicles. Friends of mine wanted to carry a .22 on a round-Australia trip, but would have had to have had a steel cabinet welded inside their vehicle to carry it in.

• I doubt very much that it was a handgun. That is simply verboten. He'd be in all sorts of strife if he'd been carrying a handgun. We have no idea what sort of firearm it was, but it took (reportedly) six shots at zero range in the back of the head to stop the croc. Wouldn't be at all surprised to find it was only a .22 rimfire or WRF magnum, because they're relatively easy to get a licence for.

• You can't, strictly speaking, carry a firearm for self-defence in Australia -- that's not even a valid reason for owning a firearm any more. However, you can use a firearm in self-defence; the difference is crucial.

• Firearms are NOT prohibited in Australia (well, not yet, anyway ) -- just damned hard to legally acquire and use.

• I'll keep an eye out for any further news on this -- especially if any legal action is aimed at Jason. So far, the media are far more concerned with making a hero out of Alicia. But we'll be watching.

Bruce

 

[Baba Louie]

Whew!
Up here we blather on about bears and caliber, handgun, long gun ad nauseum (well, it beats 9mm vs .45)

"Fortunately, there was a gun handy and that was the end of it.

So tell us Bruce... whats the best gun for hungry crocs down under? (Besides the one you have handy at the moment?) Is it a question asked over and over and over? Heavy solids going slow or lighter, fast hollowpoints?

What type of gun did they have that was handy? (I assume it was a rifle) Are the politicians now working to remedy that situation by slapping them on the wrist and recommending wearing bells and using pepperspray???

Thats a big lizard lying there. (Or is it?)

 

[Joey2]

Bruce in West Oz,

Where in Western Australia are you? I have family living in Perth.

 

[Bruce in West Oz]

BabaLouie

Since crocs are (now) protected, not many of them get shot! However, "use enough gun" to quote Ruark seems to be the rule. I believe big and slow(er) gets the nod -- I know of one company that provides its employees with a .444 Marlin on a corporate licence for protection against crocs (they work on pearl farms up north).

Joey2
I'm in Perth. Northern (beachside) suburbs.

 

[Joey2]

Bruce in West Oz,
My cousin is a doctor in Perth. His sister (cousin to me also) and her husband have a big tomato farm somewhere in the area.

These are cousins on my fathers side, his brother migrated to Australia in the early 20's. My uncle was a tailor and owned several tailor shops in the area. After he retired his eldest son ran them until he retired.

My uncle was run over by a car while crossing the street to visit his girlfriend.

If you want to know the family name we can go to PM.

 

[45Badger]

BOOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[roscoe]

Bruce, how hard is it to acquire licencing or pump/lever shotguns or pistol-caliber rifles? It seems lile those might me pretty handy, but not seen as so 'dangerous'.

 

[Bruce in West Oz]

Bruce, how hard is it to acquire licencing or pump/lever shotguns or pistol-caliber rifles? It seems lile those might me pretty handy, but not seen as so 'dangerous'.

OK, I'll (briefly) explain the system that works here in Western Australia -- other states are similar but not identical.

A pump action shotgun is a prohibited weapon; mine was crushed by the police in 1997. (In certain extenuating circumstances you can get a licence for one, but for "ordinary" people, forget it. The same applies to self-loaders.) We used to be able to buy a lever action shottie, but I think that all fell in a heap and was never very popular anyway.

Shotguns can be held on a "low power" licence -- the same as .22 rimfires and air rifles.

Centrefire rifles (all calibres, from Hornet to .444 or whatever) are held to a "higher" licensing regime, and require a waiting period.

For any firearm, you need to establish "need" and "reason" with the police.

This is itself is quite complex, as a brief look at the following will make obvious (from the WA Police website):

What does a "genuine reason" and a "genuine need" mean?

An applicant is required to demonstrate that he or she has a "genuine reason" in all applications, including additions, to acquire a firearm(s).

A "genuine need" is required in some applications.

Extract Firearms Act:

Genuine reason required in all cases:

11A(1) An approval or permit cannot be granted, and a licence cannot be issued, under this Act to a person, who in the Commissioner's opinion, has not been shown to have a genuine reason for acquiring or possessing the firearm or ammunition for which the approval, permit, or licence is sought.

(2) A person has a genuine reason for acquiring or possessing a firearm or ammunition if and only if -

(a) it is for the use by the person as a member of an approved shooting club and the person is an active and financial member of the club;

(b) it is for use by the person as a member of an organisation approved under this paragraph;

(c) it is for use in hunting or shooting of a recreational nature on land the owner of which has given permission for that hunting or shooting;

(d) it is required by the person in the course of the person's occupation;

(e) it is to form part of a genuine firearm collection or genuine ammunition collection; or

(f) it is for another approved purpose.

(3) A person does not have a genuine reason for acquiring or possessing a firearm or ammunition of a particular kind unless the Commissioner is satisfied not only as to the person's reason for acquiring or possessing a firearm or ammunition, but also that the particular kind of firearm or ammunition can be reasonably justified.

(4) The reasons described in subsection (2)(e) are not genuine reasons for acquiring or possessing a firearm or ammunition under a licence other than a Firearms Collector's Licence or an Ammunition Collector's licence.

(5) Approval cannot be given under subsection (2)(f) to the possession of a firearm or ammunition for the purpose of personal protection.

(6) Regulations made under Section 34 may limit the purposes that may be approved under subsection (2)(f).

A genuine need required in some cases:

11B (b)(1) The regulations may provide that, for prescribed categories of firearms or ammunition, an approval or permit cannot be granted, and a licence cannot be issued under this Act to a person unless the Commissioner is satisfied that the person has a genuine need to acquire or possess a firearm or ammunition of that category.

(2) the regulations may make provision as to the circumstances in which a person can or cannot be considered to have a genuine need to acquire or possess a firearm or ammunition of a particular category.

This in effect means an applicant has to satisfy Section 11A in all cases of application. The applicant would have to satisfy Section 11B in some cases, these being for high power applications, handguns, etc, showing a genuine need for the class applied for, i.e. why a lower category firearm would not suffice.

http://www.police.wa.gov.au/Services/FirearmsandWeapons.asp?FrequentlyAskedQuestions
(An interesting site to visit, by the way.)

 

[SAG0282]

<-----------thanks God he lives in the US

Do not construe this as a bash on Australia, as I'm sure there are many fine things about that country. I prefer the US.