makarovnik
Member
- Joined
- Jul 8, 2006
- Messages
- 1,678
Oh yeah! Especially in the wintertime.
Anyone CCW a Hi Power or other full-sized auto?
- Thread starter LanEvo`
- Start date
- Status
fishingjld
Member
yeah i carry a p35 feg clone. i am 5'10" and pretty big guy. i use a clip draw and stick it behind my left hip since i am a lefty. if i were a smaller guy in your case i would go with an iwb holster and since you will be in suits it should be VERY easy to conceal. good luck
jd
jd
A.ENGIN IDEMEN
Member
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2007
- Messages
- 18
LanEvo,
In a few months Stoeger will give MKEK some amount of .40SW Cougars, and the ammo offered for the pistol will be 180 gr American Eagle FMJ.
The NIB Stoeger Cougar sells approximately 1500 USD. You may get 200 rounds of ammo for each pistol with you. But if you want to make extensive amount of practice, you may shoot as much as you want at the range of MKEK, where the pistols are being sold. There are also private ranges in different provinces, but all of them are closed ranges since the open ones are not allowed.
The NIB pistol prices are in USD; HKP2K 3600, HK USPc 3500, P226/228 4000, HK P7M13 3800, P229R Two-Tone, P220 3500, P225 3400, Walther P99 3500, P99c 3500, SteyrM9A1 3000, SteyrS9A1 3000, HS2000/XD 1700, BHP Practical 3200.
Glocks are not being imported by the government facility, so they can only be bought from private importers, but you can not buy a G19 under 4500 USD.
You may consider domesticly manufactured Sarsılmaz pistols. They have various amount of compact models. The prices will not exceed 1500 USD.
So, there is no need to get ripped off, you may get a .40SW Cougar, 9mm XD or a compact Sarsılmaz, and get your job done with a reasonable cost. If you insist on a BHP since you are accustomed to the manual of arms of a single action pistol, you can get a second hand MKIII for about 2000-2500 USD. It is one the most widely used pistols in our country, spares and accessories are easy to get.
On the other hand, I am sure that it will not be easy for you get a carry permit unless you come with a diplomatic mission, maybe impossible.
As a private citizen, I rearrenge all the paper work for my permits in every five years. All the paper work is arrenged seperately for each firearm you want to hold. After the security investigation, I must get a health report assigned by five different specialists, ophtalmologist,oto-rhino-larengeologist, neurologist, psychiatrist, and finally and internist. For example, someone with colorblindness can not get any permission concerning firearms.
The tax must be paid for a carry permit is approximately 1500 USD for five years. If you want to take a carry permit for two different pistols, then you have to pay 3000 USD tax. The amount of tax must be paid for each firearm to hold it in your home is 500 USD for five years. In every five years, all the paper work is done from the beginning and additional taxes are being paid for the next following five years.
A shooter who does not have a carry permit must get a permit from his/her local police agency every time he/she goes to a range or a gunsmith. Even if you have a carry permit for one of your pistols, again you have to get a permission for the pistols which does not have a carry permit.
If you are caught with a pistol with just a '' have it in your property'' permit, it is taken as an illegal weapon, you take a considerable amount of money punishment instead of a postponed prison punishment, with loosing all your rights concerning firearms, and your weapon is taken under goverment property.
When you come to Turkey, you may send a message to me, and I will be glad to help you about any kind of concerns you will have.Did I mentioned I live in People's Republic of Turkey
?
Regards.
In a few months Stoeger will give MKEK some amount of .40SW Cougars, and the ammo offered for the pistol will be 180 gr American Eagle FMJ.
The NIB Stoeger Cougar sells approximately 1500 USD. You may get 200 rounds of ammo for each pistol with you. But if you want to make extensive amount of practice, you may shoot as much as you want at the range of MKEK, where the pistols are being sold. There are also private ranges in different provinces, but all of them are closed ranges since the open ones are not allowed.
The NIB pistol prices are in USD; HKP2K 3600, HK USPc 3500, P226/228 4000, HK P7M13 3800, P229R Two-Tone, P220 3500, P225 3400, Walther P99 3500, P99c 3500, SteyrM9A1 3000, SteyrS9A1 3000, HS2000/XD 1700, BHP Practical 3200.
Glocks are not being imported by the government facility, so they can only be bought from private importers, but you can not buy a G19 under 4500 USD.
You may consider domesticly manufactured Sarsılmaz pistols. They have various amount of compact models. The prices will not exceed 1500 USD.
So, there is no need to get ripped off, you may get a .40SW Cougar, 9mm XD or a compact Sarsılmaz, and get your job done with a reasonable cost. If you insist on a BHP since you are accustomed to the manual of arms of a single action pistol, you can get a second hand MKIII for about 2000-2500 USD. It is one the most widely used pistols in our country, spares and accessories are easy to get.
On the other hand, I am sure that it will not be easy for you get a carry permit unless you come with a diplomatic mission, maybe impossible.
As a private citizen, I rearrenge all the paper work for my permits in every five years. All the paper work is arrenged seperately for each firearm you want to hold. After the security investigation, I must get a health report assigned by five different specialists, ophtalmologist,oto-rhino-larengeologist, neurologist, psychiatrist, and finally and internist. For example, someone with colorblindness can not get any permission concerning firearms.
The tax must be paid for a carry permit is approximately 1500 USD for five years. If you want to take a carry permit for two different pistols, then you have to pay 3000 USD tax. The amount of tax must be paid for each firearm to hold it in your home is 500 USD for five years. In every five years, all the paper work is done from the beginning and additional taxes are being paid for the next following five years.
A shooter who does not have a carry permit must get a permit from his/her local police agency every time he/she goes to a range or a gunsmith. Even if you have a carry permit for one of your pistols, again you have to get a permission for the pistols which does not have a carry permit.
If you are caught with a pistol with just a '' have it in your property'' permit, it is taken as an illegal weapon, you take a considerable amount of money punishment instead of a postponed prison punishment, with loosing all your rights concerning firearms, and your weapon is taken under goverment property.
When you come to Turkey, you may send a message to me, and I will be glad to help you about any kind of concerns you will have.Did I mentioned I live in People's Republic of Turkey
?Regards.
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Will Fennell
Member
LanEnvo, sounds like A.ENGIN IDEMEN is your new friend
Nothing like good intel from someone "one the ground".....
I regularly carry a custom FN HP, and find that it is as easy, or easier to conceal comfortably than my Commander sized 1911's. the more I shoot my HP's the more I like/trust/carry them. With good sites, good trigger, and good thumb safety, they are EASY to shoot well. The only thing a 1911 shooter has to get used to is that the trigger re-set is quite a bit longer.
If I were in your shoes, and with the info provided, I would purchase in advance a GOOD IWB and matching dress belt[and mag pouch] for a HP, a set of SPEGAL grips for a HP[nothing I've found matches them for slimness and good feel], or alternately a set of Crimson Trace BHP grips. You might not have these choices in Turkey.
Also consider, a Cylinder and Slide "No Bite" drop in Hammer Sear set and thumb safety that you could have fitted to your HP once you get to Turkey. Ditto a good set of Sites like Hienie's[my favorite] or Novaks.
On thing about current production MKIII's and FN HP's, they WORK, right out of the box, and are generally quite accurate. A great website for HP's is Stephen Camps "Highpowers and Handguns".....don't have the exact website at my fingertips, but google is your friend.
Nothing like good intel from someone "one the ground".....
I regularly carry a custom FN HP, and find that it is as easy, or easier to conceal comfortably than my Commander sized 1911's. the more I shoot my HP's the more I like/trust/carry them. With good sites, good trigger, and good thumb safety, they are EASY to shoot well. The only thing a 1911 shooter has to get used to is that the trigger re-set is quite a bit longer.
If I were in your shoes, and with the info provided, I would purchase in advance a GOOD IWB and matching dress belt[and mag pouch] for a HP, a set of SPEGAL grips for a HP[nothing I've found matches them for slimness and good feel], or alternately a set of Crimson Trace BHP grips. You might not have these choices in Turkey.
Also consider, a Cylinder and Slide "No Bite" drop in Hammer Sear set and thumb safety that you could have fitted to your HP once you get to Turkey. Ditto a good set of Sites like Hienie's[my favorite] or Novaks.
On thing about current production MKIII's and FN HP's, they WORK, right out of the box, and are generally quite accurate. A great website for HP's is Stephen Camps "Highpowers and Handguns".....don't have the exact website at my fingertips, but google is your friend.
The Lone Haranguer
Member
I think something like this might be your best option for the times when you are not wearing your suit coat. And don't be afraid to get more than one holster.mec said:
When did you get yours? I ordered a Watch Six a couple of weeks ago and Marty said a five- to six-month wait.mec said:
Back to the actual topic. I've lugged around a steel Commander-sized 1911 and do not find the sheer weight bothersome. The secret is a good gun belt. A Wilderness five-stitch is not going to work for you in your social situation. But all the holster makers also make leather dress gun belts. A dress belt not made to carry guns is not going to be stiff enough to support the weight of a gun. I am very fond of my own from Jim Speidel, the Beltman. I suggest a 1 1/2-inch tapered to 1 1/4" at the front, and/or a straight 1 1/4" for when your coat is off. (Again, don't be afraid to get more than one belt.) The Beltman also offers seven holes 3/4 inch apart instead of the usual 5 x 1" for more "fine tuning."
As far as your gun choices, the BHP and CZ are going to be slimmer than the "Block."
The Glock 19, if you can get it over there, is much smaller than the 17 but still holds 15 rounds.BHPshooter
Member
Yep, I carry a BHP all day, every day. Mine is lightly customized (mag disconnect gone, tritium Novaks), and I plan to have it hard-chromed by Tripp's.
Personal preference is a big thing. The Hi Power, to me, is the perfect handgun. Nothing fits me as well as it does.
Were I in your position, I would get my hands on each of them and choose whichever felt better to you.
Good luck,
Wes
Personal preference is a big thing. The Hi Power, to me, is the perfect handgun. Nothing fits me as well as it does.
Were I in your position, I would get my hands on each of them and choose whichever felt better to you.
Good luck,
Wes
Hello, Engin.
Thanks so much for the incredibly helpful info! I can see that I was off the mark regarding a whole lot of stuff. I've been having quite a hard time identifying the relevant laws. Your post helped to clear up some of my misconceptions
Thanks so much for the incredibly helpful info! I can see that I was off the mark regarding a whole lot of stuff. I've been having quite a hard time identifying the relevant laws. Your post helped to clear up some of my misconceptions
That's good to know. If the H&K P7M8 is readily available and cost is similar to a Hi Power, then that is definitely an option to consider.A.ENGIN IDEMEN said:
I have handled the Sarsilmaz Kilinc. I was quite impressed. Quality seemed slightly better than the CZ-75B, which is a firearm I quite like.A.ENGIN IDEMEN said:
I've been told that I have a reasonable shot at getting a permit by someone who seems to know what he's talking about. But you never know until you put the application together.A.ENGIN IDEMEN said:
I'm hoping there are pistol ranges in the Istanbul area that rent pistols in that case. Travelling to Ankara to use the MKEK facility seems a bit impracticalA.ENGIN IDEMEN said:
Thatnk you very much. I certainly will do so. I'll be moving to Istanbul in mid December.A.ENGIN IDEMEN said:
A.ENGIN IDEMEN
Member
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2007
- Messages
- 18
Sorry for the double post.
Best.
Best.
A.ENGIN IDEMEN
Member
- Joined
- Feb 22, 2007
- Messages
- 18
Evo,
If you will stay in İstanbul, your NIB choices will be limited with the Stoeger and Sarsılmaz. If you would like to get a foreign design NIB, you will have to make at least a one day journey to Ankara. I do not advice you to try to get a second hand or LNIB / NIB pistol in İstanbul, since the dealers are asking incredible amounts of money, you must add at least the half of the prices I gave you. Also the ammo and pistol rental prices in private ranges are incredibly high in İstanbul.I do not want a guest to be robbed by opportunity hunters.
As for the HKP7, only the M13 model is available.
Sarsılmaz Kılınç is a full size service model. Hançer is a compact version with lighter frame options, shorter slide and 13 rounds capacity. If you are familiar with the EAA Tanfoglios or Baby Eagle pistols, all the technical details are almost exactly the same other than the external appearance.Additionally they all have a frame mounted safety with condition one option which you like I suppose.
If you decide on a BHP, I will advice you to take the words of Will Fennell. You can only get Pachmayr or Hogue aftermarket grips in our country. They are pretty bulky for CCW practice. Buttler Creek grips used to be imported when they used to be Uncle Mike's, but they are not available now. So I advice you to bring a set of Navidrex or Spegel delrins with you.
If you are not satisfied with the out of the box trigger pull of the BHP, bring with you a Wilson Combat spring set which contains a 26 lbs mainspring and 18 lbs recoil spring. The magazine safety is easy to remove and will not give you any law legislations. A no-bite C&S hammer is not a must, but if you are concerned about this issue, it will be hard to find a T series hammer in İstanbul, so take a spare hammer with you. All these modifications can be made by yourself easyly.
Do not try to bring a set of CT laser grips, they are illegal, may be held at customs. All kinds of tactical adds are illegal to civilians, including flash lights. You may bring a set of drop in Meprolights or Trijicon night sights with you. Novak's or Heine will be hard to install.
If you do want a Kydex or a similar kind of holster, only Fobus is available in our country and they are at least 45- 50 USD. And the ones for the BHP are not so much usefull. But, quality leather holsters are much more cheaper than US.
Again when you depart, inform me. I live in a province near to Ankara, but sometimes I travel to İstanbul . I will be glad to have an overseas quest fallen out of a forum.
Regards
If you will stay in İstanbul, your NIB choices will be limited with the Stoeger and Sarsılmaz. If you would like to get a foreign design NIB, you will have to make at least a one day journey to Ankara. I do not advice you to try to get a second hand or LNIB / NIB pistol in İstanbul, since the dealers are asking incredible amounts of money, you must add at least the half of the prices I gave you. Also the ammo and pistol rental prices in private ranges are incredibly high in İstanbul.I do not want a guest to be robbed by opportunity hunters.
As for the HKP7, only the M13 model is available.
Sarsılmaz Kılınç is a full size service model. Hançer is a compact version with lighter frame options, shorter slide and 13 rounds capacity. If you are familiar with the EAA Tanfoglios or Baby Eagle pistols, all the technical details are almost exactly the same other than the external appearance.Additionally they all have a frame mounted safety with condition one option which you like I suppose.
If you decide on a BHP, I will advice you to take the words of Will Fennell. You can only get Pachmayr or Hogue aftermarket grips in our country. They are pretty bulky for CCW practice. Buttler Creek grips used to be imported when they used to be Uncle Mike's, but they are not available now. So I advice you to bring a set of Navidrex or Spegel delrins with you.
If you are not satisfied with the out of the box trigger pull of the BHP, bring with you a Wilson Combat spring set which contains a 26 lbs mainspring and 18 lbs recoil spring. The magazine safety is easy to remove and will not give you any law legislations. A no-bite C&S hammer is not a must, but if you are concerned about this issue, it will be hard to find a T series hammer in İstanbul, so take a spare hammer with you. All these modifications can be made by yourself easyly.
Do not try to bring a set of CT laser grips, they are illegal, may be held at customs. All kinds of tactical adds are illegal to civilians, including flash lights. You may bring a set of drop in Meprolights or Trijicon night sights with you. Novak's or Heine will be hard to install.
If you do want a Kydex or a similar kind of holster, only Fobus is available in our country and they are at least 45- 50 USD. And the ones for the BHP are not so much usefull. But, quality leather holsters are much more cheaper than US.
Again when you depart, inform me. I live in a province near to Ankara, but sometimes I travel to İstanbul . I will be glad to have an overseas quest fallen out of a forum.
Regards
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BHPshooter
Member
Wow, and I thought BHPs were expensive here.
Wes
Wes
Taxes are a big killer in places like Turkey. You should see the price of buying an imported car! You can easily pay as much as the price of the car itself just in taxes and duties. And fuel is in the $4-5 per gallon range.Thefumegator said:Wow, and I thought BHPs were expensive here.
OTOH, taxes on stuff like alcohol and tobacco is pretty mild. And income taxes are much lower than what we pay around here.
HorseSoldier
Member
From the price side of things, the domestic CZ clones sound like a winning idea.
I've carried a High Power with an IWB holster with no real problem, so the mechanics should not be an issue. Sounds like the price will be, though.
I've carried a High Power with an IWB holster with no real problem, so the mechanics should not be an issue. Sounds like the price will be, though.
Bones11b
Member
I can't speak for the BHP having never handled one. I have carried both Glocks and CZ 75's though. The CZ wins my vote hands down. It conceals easier on my body type (tall and slim), though I don't have the exact dimmensions for comparison. I fed my CZ plenty of 9mm from plenty of different ammo manufacturers and lots and it never failed to fire and or feed properly. Also under extreme circumstances the CZ can be used as a hammer of sorts, don't even ask
GaryArkansas
Member
- Joined
- Jan 20, 2007
- Messages
- 152
If you're in Turkey - get a Sarsilmaz - they're great guns (CZ Clones), made in an ISO 9001 factory on CNC machines.
Yeah, those Sarsilmaz pistols start to look pretty good when you factor in price!
I've had a CZ-97B (.45 ACP) for 9-10 years now. It's been dead reliable and supremely accurate. So, I'm definitely a CZ fan. I just figured the Hi Power would be slimmer, therefore easier to conceal.
I've had a CZ-97B (.45 ACP) for 9-10 years now. It's been dead reliable and supremely accurate. So, I'm definitely a CZ fan. I just figured the Hi Power would be slimmer, therefore easier to conceal.
dogngun
Member
BHP.
Easy to conceal, reliable accurate shooter, parts,mags, etc readily available.
Many armies carried the BHP for a long time, there is no reason to think it will be less durable or reliable for you.
I carried one for several years, then a full size S&W Model 59, now a full size 1911, along with several 4" revolvers. If you want to carry it, there is always a way.
Suggest you try to handle as many of your choices as you can...what I like may not suit you.
For example, IMO, Glocks suck.
mark
Easy to conceal, reliable accurate shooter, parts,mags, etc readily available.
Many armies carried the BHP for a long time, there is no reason to think it will be less durable or reliable for you.
I carried one for several years, then a full size S&W Model 59, now a full size 1911, along with several 4" revolvers. If you want to carry it, there is always a way.
Suggest you try to handle as many of your choices as you can...what I like may not suit you.
For example, IMO, Glocks suck.
mark
You should definitely invest in a good quality "dress" gun belt while you are in the states. There are many options out there while you are in the U.S. so take the time to find something that looks good with your wardrobe, yet is designed to carry a gun. Check out the options offered by the custom holster makers and also sources such as "the Beltman."
If it were me, I'd also get two high-quality leather IWB holsters while I was still in the U.S. I'd get one for a Browning High Power and the other for the CZ-75. Those seem to be your two most likely options and that way you're set for either gun. Just sell the spare holster that you don't need once you are in Turkey. I'm sure you could make enough on that to cover the cost of both holsters.
Actually, what you should probably do is bring a variety of carry options with you. A couple holsters, a good quality belly band, maybe a large Smart Carry. Get them in the U.S. while they are easy to get and you'll have more options for when you are in Turkey. You never know exactly what's going to work until you try and it's going to be harder and more expensive to get that stuff in Turkey then in the states.
I like the Milt Sparks Versa Max II for carrying larger guns. If you can wear any sort of suit coat or jacket it will hide the larger guns well. I'd get one for the CZ and a second one for the HP. While you can fit the HP gun in the CZ holster, the fit isn't as good, and it's better to have the exact holster made for that model. Spring for a single set of the kydex clips that you can use with either holster and you are set.
The only problem is the Milt Sparks VM 2 is always backordered. I think a company called Lightning Arms or somesuch can get some if you are willing to pay a little more. I've had good luck posting "WTB" ads in various gun forums and shaking loose some near new VM 2's in the past, so you could try that as well.
If it were me, I'd also get two high-quality leather IWB holsters while I was still in the U.S. I'd get one for a Browning High Power and the other for the CZ-75. Those seem to be your two most likely options and that way you're set for either gun. Just sell the spare holster that you don't need once you are in Turkey. I'm sure you could make enough on that to cover the cost of both holsters.
Actually, what you should probably do is bring a variety of carry options with you. A couple holsters, a good quality belly band, maybe a large Smart Carry. Get them in the U.S. while they are easy to get and you'll have more options for when you are in Turkey. You never know exactly what's going to work until you try and it's going to be harder and more expensive to get that stuff in Turkey then in the states.
I like the Milt Sparks Versa Max II for carrying larger guns. If you can wear any sort of suit coat or jacket it will hide the larger guns well. I'd get one for the CZ and a second one for the HP. While you can fit the HP gun in the CZ holster, the fit isn't as good, and it's better to have the exact holster made for that model. Spring for a single set of the kydex clips that you can use with either holster and you are set.
The only problem is the Milt Sparks VM 2 is always backordered. I think a company called Lightning Arms or somesuch can get some if you are willing to pay a little more. I've had good luck posting "WTB" ads in various gun forums and shaking loose some near new VM 2's in the past, so you could try that as well.
rellascout
member
I carry a BHP all the time.
No issues. I personally do not like IWB. I have had Milt Sparks VMIIs, kramer etc.... and I just cannot do it.
Currently my BHP rides in a Rafters OWB like this:
You need a good sturdy belt. Not a dress belt IMHO but a double reinforced one made for carrying a gun. Like one from this guy.
http://www.thebeltman.net/
No issues. I personally do not like IWB. I have had Milt Sparks VMIIs, kramer etc.... and I just cannot do it.
Currently my BHP rides in a Rafters OWB like this:
You need a good sturdy belt. Not a dress belt IMHO but a double reinforced one made for carrying a gun. Like one from this guy.
http://www.thebeltman.net/
markh
Member
I carried a P-35 for a while with absolutely no problems. I am about 5'10" 170lbs. No one ever knew.
LegalAlien
Member
Trying to find the Thread . . but somewhere here in THR recently there was a thread started by the marketing guy for some new Turkish firearm . .even had some Youtube videos with full auto pistols . .ifI find it I will link it here for you
Foundit - here it is
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=320322
Foundit - here it is
http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=320322
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My everyday carry is a Belgian Hipower in .40. The reason, I shoot it better than any other gun I've ever tried. I've got about 20,000 rounds through mine and it's like new, can't imagine ever wearing it out, but most of them are cast bullets and they're easy on the barrel.
I see someone else mentioned it, but I'm also going to say if you go with the Hipower get a set of the Navidrex thin grips. They're not pretty, but they're incredibly function. Thin and your hands will love them. I got rid of my pretty cocobolo grips for these plain black ones, it hurt, but they work so much better.
Even the .40 Hipower is relatively slim and easy to carry, just get a good wide, thick belt to support the weight and you won't notice it.
I see someone else mentioned it, but I'm also going to say if you go with the Hipower get a set of the Navidrex thin grips. They're not pretty, but they're incredibly function. Thin and your hands will love them. I got rid of my pretty cocobolo grips for these plain black ones, it hurt, but they work so much better.
Even the .40 Hipower is relatively slim and easy to carry, just get a good wide, thick belt to support the weight and you won't notice it.
SCmarksman
Member
Interesting discussion. Just my two cent's worth....
A couple of years ago, I had the "pleasure" of trying out copies of the BHP and PPK made by FEG. Both had serious feeding problems. The PPK, in particular, jammed really, really badly. I didn't think I'd be able to resolve it without resorting to tools. I'd stay away from anything made by FEG unless I had no other choice.
A couple of years ago, I had the "pleasure" of trying out copies of the BHP and PPK made by FEG. Both had serious feeding problems. The PPK, in particular, jammed really, really badly. I didn't think I'd be able to resolve it without resorting to tools. I'd stay away from anything made by FEG unless I had no other choice.
Josh Aston
Member
Get your suits sized slightly big, not so much that it looks tacky, just enough to make it look comfortable, and any of the pistols you mentioned will disappear.
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