Are flashlights on a firearm a really good idea?

[the iron horse]

I was watching a movie the other night and the good guys were making their way through a dark building with lights fastened to their pistols and shotguns.

I'm thinking...is that really a good idea?
Doesn't it just give away your location to the bad guys?

What do you think?

 

[COMPNOR]

What movie?

This topic from what I can gather has been done to death.

So basically it boils down to what you prefer, or how easily you care what others think or a swayed by public opinion. There are those who see the uses and prefer it, and those who think its just another gimmick to make yourself look cool.

Generally speaking though, tactical flashlights aren't mean to run continuously. You shine your light briefly, see if anything is there, if not, cut the light.

They're also extremely bright. So while it might give your position away, it might also blind the BG enough that it wouldn't matter.

Ultimately, it comes down to you.

 

[dunlop]

if your where pursuing someone and they where hiding... would u rather just shine a flashlight at something, and see someone pointing a gun at you, or would u want to be seeing the same thing that, the end of your barrel is seeing.

the only place i would see it really being usefull, is in a confined dark place.
with flashlight attached to a pistol. pretty much NOT OUTSIDE

 

[RX-178]

The obvious advantage is that with the flashlight mounted on the weapon, you have one hand free for whatever else might need doing. In my personal experience, reloading a weapon that has a weapon-light on it is a lot easier than juggling the magazine, and a hand-held flashlight in one hand.

The obvious disadvantage is, that if you want to illuminate something, you have to point your gun at it, which could cause rule 2 violations.

 

[f4t9r]

COMPNOR
Has it covered, Whats next

 

[the iron horse]

"Whats next"

Why being in the dark is a good thing.

 

[possum]

1)get a light and take a training course in how to use the light to your advantage, and you will see the pro's of the flashlight. lots of people talk and speculate but they don't know the facts.

2) i love weapon mounted lights but with that said 2 is one and 1 is none. you need a back up, weapon mounted isn't the answer for all your lowlight needs. neither is one of the many hand held techniques but you need to know, understand, and train on the various techniques.

where i am comming from is this, i have spent alot of time in low and no light operations, with both white light, as well as under ir and nods. i am very profeccient in the dark and well trained in how to use a light source to acomplish my mission, any battle drill, any task that i would need to acomplish i can do under nods, and in the complete dark. i don't speak from speculation and the normal he said she said, i speak from experience.

 

[JoeSlomo]

tactical flashlights aren't meant to run continuously. You shine your light briefly, see if anything is there, if not, cut the light.

That about sums it up...

 

[WardenWolf]

A bright light such as a Surefire or Inova can easily blind your enemy and cause them to flinch, but a better-disciplined enemy is just going to pull the trigger.

My personal opinion is that you, as a civilian, have NO business searching a darkened building in search of an intruder. Unless you already know where the bad guy is, you should NOT venture out of the room you are in. In situations like that, all the advantages are held by the person who keeps quiet and stays hidden. The moving person will invariably make enough noise to give away their position to the person who is trying to remain unseen. What this means is that you should get your gun, position yourself in an ambush position on the door, and listen. Eventually the person may indeed give away their location, allowing you to maneuver to an advantageous position on them. But going out in search of an unknown intruder in a darkened house or shed will get you shot, almost guaranteed.

 

[COMPNOR]

My personal opinion is that you, as a civilian, have NO business searching a darkened building in search of an intruder.

I assume you live alone. The problem with this mentality is that some people have family living with them. Whether parents, a wife, or kids. Who more than likely won't be in the same room(if kids or parents), or even on the same floor.

So are you advocating that a father just hold up in his room and leave his kids to the intruder because he could get shot??

And this is where having that flashlight attached can be helpful. When you're carrying that sleeping child.

 

[gunnie]

good advice above

i agree with "COMPNOR", but would add that the better rail mount lights have a momentary on function that will allow just a very quick BRIGHT burst of light. remember to move as soon as you turn the light off if that bump in the night was a perp!!!

i agree with "possum" that if you are going to go the distance and get a rail light, keep a SMALL flashlight beside it for backup and/or saftey. get one that easily fits into a pocket for carrying.

this will not only show you who/where the person is but will render the perp legally blind and disoriented long enough to do what you deem best in that situation.

also, to get the most advantage out of a rail light on a handgun, i'd suggest most any brand of tritium night sights you like along with it. daylight accuracy is easily attained with the pair in tandem. even out to longish handgun distances, where standard sights can be hard to pick up. try to find some that do not hinder good sight definition in the daylight to YOUR eyes. not some one else's pick.

gunnie

 

[David904]

YES... The flashlight mounted to your weapon is an invaluable tool.

NEVER engage a target that you cannot identify. The weaponlight is not intended to be employed the way headlights on a car are used. If you want that sort of thing, get creeper lights and NODS. You'll be able to walk around in the dark just fine. A standard weaponlight is intended to flash - meaning you do a quick on/off on things you are checking out and then use it to blind/ID your target.

 

[The Bushmaster]

Lasers work better then a flash light. The laser has a narrower beam making aiming and hit accuracy much better...

I can't think of a better way to give your position away then with a flashlight mounted on your gun

 

[expvideo]

Lasers work better then a flash light. The laser has a narrower beam making aiming and hit accuracy much better...

I can't think of a better way to give your position away then with a flashlight mounted on your gun

They serve different purposes. A flashlight is not there for aiming, but for illuminating so that you can identify and possibly blind your target. A laser is not there for illuminating, but for aiming. That is all a laser is for, so it is not a substitute for a light. A light is not a substitute for a laser. They are completely different accessories that serve completely different purposes.

 

[The Bushmaster]

I'm sorry expvideo...I meant that tongue-in-cheek.

But...I don't need to identify my target in my house. My wife sleeps beside me. If I hear a noise in the house and she is still next to me. Then either the cat or the intruder is dead...No one else belongs in the house after dark.

And you would be suprised how much alumination a laser makes in a dark room.. I still do not want to expose my location or position with a flashlight. Especially one attached to my handgun.

 

[conw]

I think the "blind your target" lore is a dangerous myth. At best, you can maybe surprise your target and, combined with verbal commands, gain submission. I DO think the flashlight would be useful for IDing your target if you were trying to capture a particular individual.

However, if your target is armed with a knife or a firearm, I have no idea how a light - even a 3000+ lumen spotlight, let alone a 100-300 lumen firearm light - is going to disorient him enough to prevent you from getting stabbed or shot.

As far as I can tell, this myth was started by SureFire and tends to get repeated without any actual evidence, anecdotal or otherwise. Think about it. A "blinded" attacker can still charge you, and anyone who knows point shooting basics can easily shoot into the light.

Summary: The blinding your attacker and saving the day mumbo jumbo is horse puckey. It's marketing jibber jabber put out by SureFire and repeated by everyone who has spent hundreds on high-output lights. Yes, a flashlight has many uses, but it is not an offensive tool!

 

[conw]

It's ludicrous, the SureFire site is filled with so many permutations of this story:

Yesterday I was on patrol in an area known for high narcotics sales. My partner and I were in civilian dress and driving a new, unmarked department vehicle, which the usual street criminals didn't recognize. While patrolling, we observed an individual attempting to conceal himself between two cars, so we stopped to investigate. As I exited the vehicle, I could see panic in the suspect's eyes as he contemplated whether or not to run. He then raised his hands, and the look in his eyes indicated he was clearly contemplating a different way to deal with the situation. Out came a rather large knife.

I always carry my pistol, equipped with an X200, and I always have a U2 Ultra™ in my vest pocket. But this time...oops—I didn't have my firearm in my hand. Luckily for me, I did have my M3 CombatLight® with a KL6 LED head ready in my hand. Instinctually, I shot the subject in the eyes with a blast of light. He reacted by turning his head and bringing his arm up to cover his eyes, dropping the knife, and letting out a loud "DAMN!" He was taken down and brought in without anyone getting hurt, but it's scary to think what could have happened had I not had my M3 ready to go.

The bad guy always falls down and gets hurt, runs off, or drops his weapon when the good guy shines his SureFire (TM) at him.

This makes me sick. These stories are so obviously false. There are even stories where someone scares off a wolf or a cobra using their SureFire. That is ridiculous; my dogs stare straight into a high-power light without flinching...

 

[bmxr4life87]

its all a matter of preference. My dad is a city LEO here in oklahoma. The department gives them an 870, an ar15, g22 and a surefire weapon light, a midsize surefire light and a large maglight sized surefire with both leds and xenon bulb. So thats 3 flashlights 2 of which are ALWAYS with the officer. Now they use the big light when pulling someone over at night cause they can use the leds to read drivers license,documents whatnot without disturbing their night vision and putting less strain on the battery. It can also be used as a blunt weapon on dogs/car windows/ someones knee etc. They use their smaller flashlights as backup or they can use them for firing if prefered that way. They use the wml if they are going into a building/house/possible shootout and there is even a slight chance of less than perfect lighting. most of the officers do have tritium sights but thats not enough when your chasing someone through a dark warehouse. Now you dont go walking around with the flashlight on constant all the time, you use it on momentary if theres a question because obviously if the bg can make it around in the dark so can you, but first bump or rattle you hear light goes on pointed at the noise and guess whats backing that light up? 16 rounds of .40 s&w ready to deal with any deadly threats at the end of that light. Some wmls now have a strobe setting while some armchair quarterbacks here might not understand the effect of this strobe lights DO disorient you. Jails use them for a reason. Ive had one tested on me by my dad when i questioned how well they worked. i even aimed at him with a orange plastic g17 training replica and after being hit with the strobe i woulda shot the hell outta the ceiling because thats where i jerked too trying to avoid the strobe. These tools do work when people who understand their proper use are operating them.

 

[expvideo]

I'm sorry expvideo...I meant that tongue-in-cheek.

But...I don't need to identify my target in my house. My wife sleeps beside me. If I hear a noise in the house and she is still next to me. Then either the cat or the intruder is dead...No one else belongs in the house after dark.

And you would be suprised how much alumination a laser makes in a dark room.. I still do not want to expose my location or position with a flashlight. Especially one attached to my handgun.

What if the neighbor gets so hammered that he doesn't realize that he is in the wrong house? His key didn't work in the door so he climbed through a window. Now you have a dead neighbor, and sure it's justified, but you could have easily identified him as a drunken neighbor if you had a flashlight on your gun. Come on, your defending your home, not sniping. There is no "giving away your position" in your home. You ALWAYS need to know what it is that you are shooting. Rule number 4. If you blindly shoot at shadows in your hallway, you're just as likely to kill someone you know and even care about as you are to be shooting an armed intruder.

What if that intruder is your 10 year old neighbor who snuck into "that scary guy's house" on a dare from his friends? How are you going to sleep at night knowing that you shot a kid that meant you no harm?

A flashlight does not hurt an intruder, but in a dark room it does disorient him and gives you the advantage. You're not a sniper. If your defending your home, you shouldn't be trying to conceal your "position".

The bad guy always falls down and gets hurt, runs off, or drops his weapon when the good guy shines his SureFire (TM) at him.

This makes me sick. These stories are so obviously false. There are even stories where someone scares off a wolf or a cobra using their SureFire. That is ridiculous; my dogs stare straight into a high-power light without flinching...

I've personally warded off violent individuals with a surefire. It works. Naturally it's only a good defense if it has a good weapon to back it up. But I'll agree with you about dogs. They don't care.

 

[Eightball]

I assume you live alone. The problem with this mentality is that some people have family living with them. Whether parents, a wife, or kids. Who more than likely won't be in the same room(if kids or parents), or even on the same floor......this is where having that flashlight attached can be helpful. When you're carrying that sleeping child.

I had never even thought of this contingency. It's not a problem ATM, but it poses an interesting scenario to think about, and might possibly warrant a light on a firearm at some point in my future.

 

[The Bushmaster]

Then expvideo...The drunk is dead or subdued...I find being drunk not an excuss to be in someone's home after dark unwarrented...There are front doors with door bells or you can knuckle the door, but you don't enter by breaking a window of busting a door down...

You get soo drunk you can't find your way home...You have a different problem...And it ain't mine...

And you are correct...I'm not a gun fighter. I am, however, a damned good shot and part of my home defense is to hide and ambush inside my home...I sure as hell am not going to stand in plain open sight and yell at him...

This ain't the movies or Holywood. It's real life and I plan on a long one.

 

[COMPNOR]

I think the "blind your target" lore is a dangerous myth. At best, you can maybe surprise your target and, combined with verbal commands, gain submission. I DO think the flashlight would be useful for IDing your target if you were trying to capture a particular individual.

However, if your target is armed with a knife or a firearm, I have no idea how a light - even a 3000+ lumen spotlight, let alone a 100-300 lumen firearm light - is going to disorient him enough to prevent you from getting stabbed or shot.

I don't know you're experience, so have you ever been shined in the eyes with a tactical light?

Its not fun.

Now having been blinded, will it stop me from being able to hit my target? Don't know, never tried.

But whats the saying around here, when seconds count...

I don't envision the flashlight as being a substitute for a gun. I have no visions of blinding the guy so he can't react and I become the hero. But it just might give me those one or two seconds I need to ID my target and get the shot off before he does.

That is ridiculous; my dogs stare straight into a high-power light without flinching...

So are your dogs professional intruders then? Do they go around breaking into your neighbors house? If not, who cares what your dogs do! Better question, do you start right at a high-powered light?

 

[The Bushmaster]

See...I'm not a bad guy...Just particular who comes in my home and how they enter...

Gotta go feed my horses...

 

[Fred Fuller]

Folks,

Keep it on topic and leave off the namecalling, please.

lpl

 

[BullfrogKen]

I do find it interesting that those who believe a high powered light is powerful enough to blind and disorient an attacker into practical helplessness will at the same time eschew the value of OC spray.


Lights are tools. I would not trust them to do anything the marketing hype says they'll do. Then again I don't believe the hype about one-shot stop handguns rounds, either. So take my words with a grain of salt.


The only advice I'd give for weapon mounted lights is learn to use them properly. A light on a gun is still a gun; now it just has a light on it. I'm not comfortable pointing my gun all around my house, or in places I'm not sure are safe yet. Just little things like Rule #2 & #4 and all. Those set ups have their place, just learn how to use it.


The majority of gun owners don't seek any training at all. With that in mind, my general advice is to avoid them. But it's not my house, or my family, or my livelihood on the line when someone makes a mistake using one, so everyone has to make his own choice on the matter.