Argentina vs Chile Mauser

[lionking]

In stock @ $1 per shot. Not too bad in today's climate...

https://www.sgammo.com/catalog/rifle-ammo-sale/765x53-arg-ammo

screen shot I took from SGammo in 2018, for now the price hasn't changed that much, unlike7.5 Swiss, 303 Brit and 8mm Mauser which they were selling $13 a box then and now $23 or more a box if you can find it. I was so busy stocking up on 9mm and 5.56 and 7.62 last year in prep for the election year thought I'd do the oddball calibers this year but didn't count on COVID

 

[indy1919a4]

Will post a pic. Busy right now making ammo for my bogus No.4(T)SMLE. My reloading bench right next to my computer, which isn't a good thing. As you can see, I'm easily distracted.

Wow! I didn't know the Monkey did them. Or had them done. Yep that's the two I have. That's very interesting, and adds some "provenance" to the rifles. Of course, I'd take an original over a sporter any day, even it was "sporterized" by the Monkey. Hence forth, these will be called the "1891 Monkey Mausers" among Mauser collectors and shooters. Had no idea the Monkey did it.

But even a Monkey should know better than to sporterize an original, super low serial number 1891 Argentine. What were they thinking?

1st Sir you must be commended for the Monkey Mausers moniker.. I like that.

But now we must be fair.. At the time 1950s/60s you could pick up non/sporterized rifles easily. The fact that a company sporterized it added value to the customer because he was now buying a modern stylist looking sporter rifle at a fraction of the cost of a new rifle. Per it being a low number (Which is pretty darn cool) Someone was being paid money to convert x number of rifles.. they needed to do x number of rifles.

Hey the 1st model 91 I got was a Monkeys Mausers. And I was shocked to find out it was sporterized later.. They really did a fine job with those..

 

[lionking]

Great Mauser pics this thread!!

That being said, don't know much about Latin Mausers ... I'm mostly into the Swedes:
View media item 3287
As far as differences, I think mainly you want to check on ammo availability as your main decision factor, as they are chambered in various calibers.

One of the best Mauser ever. Some will say it is the best.

 

[indy1919a4]

One of the best Mauser ever. Some will say it is the best.

Watch that kind a talk man. In the wrong crowds you may start a rumble.. Or at least a knife duel...

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Lionking:

Playing an instrument is in it's self a full time job. I play the bass, dog-house, acoustic, and electric. Learning some trumpet at the moment, and trying to get good on "taps".

Lately, it's 7.62X54R that's going down-range at my house. Need to get more 5,56 trigger time for sure though. Have not shot the 7.65's for a long long time. Okay, for sure, save that brass. Leave no brass un-saved!

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Here's my Monkey Mausers. Excuse the quick set up for the photo shoot. The top rifle always looked to me like a gunsmith refinished it, has a deep blue like a 1950's S&W revolver. I refinished the stock, with a oil finish. Very nice blonde hunk of wood. The only booger on it is below the bolt handle, above the trigger. Otherwise could pass for a brand new stock. Do you think the Monkey finished any of them to that high of a quality?

Hard to see in the photo, but both stocks have some nice fiddle-back in them. I'll never refinish the older rifle, as I believe it still has it's original finish on it.

The lower rifle is A9XX. It's in decent shape, mechanically is excellent shape. I did the front sight, otherwise it matched the upper rifle. If I was working for the Monkey when they were doing these, and saw that serial number, I'd take it home and have them take it out of my paycheck.

I love these rifles, they handle and balance really nice, are light, accurate, and I like the calibers/cartridges in the "mild" range, like the 7.65, .303, 300 Savage, 7X57 etc. I've hunted with both, but never got a shot. Now it's pretty much always muzzle loaders, but I need to get one of them out again, maybe just take it trekking/exploring.

It's really interesting to learn that the Monkey made them. I've had these for a long time, and have seen others at gun shows, and always wondered who made them. Always figured it was a small company or import company. But it was the MONKEY!

I guess I won't blame them. I'm sure they got a big batch for cheap. Sold as is, they would not have sold well, and a lot of guys at the time would have just taken them straight to the gunsmith, or worse, hacked them up themselves. Now I like them even more, with that little bit of history attached to them.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Two additional observations. Have not had these rifles out for a while.

The low-numbered rifle has all matching serial numbers on everything. And the other rifle does also. Judging from the condition of most Argentine rifles I've seen, I think they were into taking very good care of them.

I also notice that my low-numbered, older rifle is in better condition than I was thinking. The stock has few dents and dings, and the metal very good blue. Again, I don't think it has ever been re-blued, or had the stock finished since new, but who knows.

Both rifles have the crest ground off. The older rifle, it's obvious, but not a real bad job like on some rifles you see, especially Arisakas. On the newer/later rifle, if you did not know there was a crest on it at one time, you would not know. That also tells me the rifle has been re-blued, or confirms it. I'm not kidding, looks like they sent it to S&W. !!!

That is all, thanks for listening. !

 

[indy1919a4]

Thanks, those are damn attractive rifles. One of the best conversations made.. Well except maybe those Krag Carbines...

Thanks again...

 

[indy1919a4]

Both rifles have the crest ground off.

One thing to look for on those 91s, even though the Argentines ground of the receiver crests they forgot to grind off the Service Academy crests on the barrel shanks.. They are beautiful.

I have never seen the Navel Academy one in person yet..

 

[Ugly Sauce]

Those barrel markings are fantastic. A guy I used to hunt with, who always used a '91, had an '09 with the crest still on it. It was really cool, had the shaking hands on it, we used to call that marking the "bro-hands". To us it was two "bro's" shaking hands. At least that's how I remember it. Long time ago.

 

[indy1919a4]

That is a beautiful crest no doubt, maybe one of the top 20 crests..

 

[tbob38]

The 1909 Argentines have hinged floorplates.

 

[indy1919a4]

The 1909 Argentines have hinged floorplates.

So does the 1891. Just one you poke to start the other you screw to start..

You know all kidding aside but has to love the Mauser development from the 1891, You had an external fixed magazine hanging on there and then boom with in 5 years the designers were able to move that magazine inside the rifle.. Its a hell of a ride..

 

[magyars4]

This is a restocked Colombian 98 in 30-06....

 

[indy1919a4]

Wow now that is tiger striped.. Its a beauty.

 

[Mauser lover]

Thanks for all the info everyone. Honestly right now I have a choice between a sporterized 1891 Argentino Mauser with a scope on it (and apparently an unknown caliber?) Or a sporterized 1895 Chilean carbine. Slim pickings, no untouched ones around here.

Of these two, I'd go for the 1895 Chileno. They are both sporterized, so unless the 1891 is beautifully done (which, if it were, I would assume the owner would know the caliber) the 1895 is a better design.

 

[Ugly Sauce]

This is a restocked Colombian 98 in 30-06....View attachment 963668

Oh yeah. Nothing wrong with that. My hunting partner from the past, who always hunted with a '91, had a full stocked version like that, no quite that nice. Wasn't original nor a Monkey Mauser. I think it was about the same length as that one.

You know, from a technical aspect, the other Mausers were "better" I suppose, but were all bigger, heavier, more "clunky" in comparison to the 1891. (I said "in comparison", don't get mad...non of the rifles pictured in this thread, would I call "clunky") They were certainly stronger actions, but the '91 is just fine chambered in 7.65X53mm. And it is a very slim and trim rifle.

I've often thought about, but would not actually do, is to take a Monkey Mauser for instance, (!!!!) or a bubba'd '91, (which I might would do) and convert it to a flat floorplate. I think that would reduce the magazine capacity to three, two in the magazine, one in the chamber, but as one who prefers to hunt with single shots and muzzle loaders, a capacity of three would be, a gattling gun to me. And that rhymes. That would be a sleek little rifle, and really, with 180 grain bullets quite capable of just about anything.

I think the critique of them being weaker really only applies if you (a military) want(s) to step up to the 8X57mm, or wanted to re-chamber one to "7.65-08". I've never heard of a '91 failing with the 7.65 cartridge. ???

 

[lionking]

My experience with the Argentine either 1891 or 1909 is most often they can be found in very good to excellent condition with good to excellent bores sporterized or in original specs while South American contract Mauser's in 7mm from various countries can be hit or miss.

 

[Hoyte]

Went with the Chilean Mauser Carbine for $200 . It’s in better shape than they were describing.

 

[Mauser lover]

Stock has been chopped, but no drill/tap done. If you feel like it needs to be all original, you can probably get a stock and fix it up nice and original.

Or, enjoy it as is if that’s your style.

Looks pretty good!

 

[Nacho Man]

I went with a Argentino.
1909 is my next purchase but prices
are getting up there on those.
I paid $600 for this one last year.

 

[indy1919a4]

I went with a Argentino.
1909 is my next purchase but prices
are getting up there on those.
I paid $600 for this one last year.
View attachment 963984

I like it, does it have a crest??? Damn nice stock is it as pretty up close as it looks??

 

[indy1919a4]

I went with a Argentino.
1909 is my next purchase but prices
are getting up there on those.
I paid $600 for this one last year.
View attachment 963984

And Damn nice bayonet

 

[Archie]

Then this is a good time to look elsewhere and not limit yourself to just the local inventory. Mystery caliber guns always scare me off.

Mystery calibers? The 7.65x53mm Argentine Mauser round is ballistically equal to a .303 British round. It fires the same diameter and weight bullet at the same velocity as .303 British. Large rifle primers and designated rifle gunpowder are practically universal. Bullets are the same as .303 British, 7.7mm Arisaka and I think 7.62x54Rmm (Russian). Cases are the main problem, but PPU makes them and they last for a while.

If one is not a reloader, one is limited to buying the round from PPU.

The rifle is likely NOT the best first choice for an 'only' rifle. Something in the .308 Winchester or one of the bangalot type rifles would be more suited to casual use. The rifle and caliber would serve well as a hunting rifle for game up to Moose. Probably would do for bear, but little margin for error.

 

[indy1919a4]

Mystery calibers? The 7.65x53mm Argentine Mauser round is ballistically equal to a .303 British round. It fires the same diameter and weight bullet at the same velocity as .303 British. Large rifle primers and designated rifle gunpowder are practically universal. Bullets are the same as .303 British, 7.7mm Arisaka and I think 7.62x54Rmm (Russian). Cases are the main problem, but PPU makes them and they last for a while.

If one is not a reloader, one is limited to buying the round from PPU.

The rifle is likely NOT the best first choice for an 'only' rifle. Something in the .308 Winchester or one of the bangalot type rifles would be more suited to casual use. The rifle and caliber would serve well as a hunting rifle for game up to Moose. Probably would do for bear, but little margin for error.

Agreed the 7.65 is a wonderful caliber. Personally developed by Paul Mauser himself.. I think at the time there was debate as to what caliber the rifle was still in.