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ATF FAQs

Discussion in 'Legal' started by bobelk99, Apr 12, 2010.

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  1. bobelk99

    bobelk99 Member

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    Before they create their 'new' website, ATF maintained fairly comprehensive FAQs at http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/index.htm

    I just learned that webpage no longer exists. I found a set of NFA FAQs, but cannot find anything similar to the old FAQs.

    Can anyone tell me they are there somewhere?

    Does anyone have a copy of the old FAQs they saved that I could have? Obviously I have 'lost' mine.

    Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2010
  2. bobelk99

    bobelk99 Member

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  3. Zak Smith

    Zak Smith Moderator Emeritus

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  4. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    While the FAQs may be helpful, if you want the source information, it's almost all at the below United States Code and Code of Federal Regulations:

    http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/usc_sup_01_18_10_I_20_44.html

    http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/tex...c=ecfr&tpl=/ecfrbrowse/Title27/27cfrv3_02.tpl

    Another extremely helpful resource is the BATFE's Federal Firearms Regulations Reference Guide, which I believe has all their FAQ's in a section of that publication as well:

    http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf
     
  5. Lee Roder

    Lee Roder Member

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    Same with their Rulings. Now only a "few" are maintained online. You wanna read Ruling 85-10? Too bad. Judge will "summarize" it for you at your trial.
     
  6. NavyLCDR

    NavyLCDR member

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    Not true. It's on page 129:
    http://www.atf.gov/publications/download/p/atf-p-5300-4.pdf

    ATF Rul. 85-10
    Section 233 of the Trade and Tariff
    Act of 1984, 98 Stat. 2991, amended
    Title 18, United States Code, section
    925 to allow licensed importers to
    import firearms listed by the Secretary
    as curios or relics, excluding handguns
    not generally recognized as
    particularly suitable for or readily
    adaptable to sporting purposes. The
    amendment had the effect of allowing
    the importation of surplus military
    curio or relic firearms that were previously
    prohibited from importation by
    18 U.S.C. section 925(d)(3).
    130
    Congressional intent was expressed
    by Senator Robert Dole in
    130 CONG. REC. S2234 (daily ed.,
    Mar. 2, 1984), as follows:
    First. This provision is aimed at
    allowing collectors to import fine
    works of art and other valuable weapons.
    Second. This provision would allow
    the importation of certain military
    surplus firearms that are classified as
    curios and relics by regulations of the
    Secretary of the Treasury.
    Third. In order for an individual or
    firm to import a curio or relic it must
    first be put on a list by petitioning the
    Secretary of the Treasury. The Secretary
    must find the firearm's primary
    value is that of being a collector's
    item.
    Fourth. The only reason a person
    would purchase these firearms is
    because of their peculiar collector's
    status. And, in fact, they must be
    special firearms and classified as
    such in order to import.
    This language clearly shows that
    Congress intended to permit the importation
    of surplus military firearms
    of special interest and value to collectors
    and recognized by ATF as meeting
    the curio or relic definition in 27
    CFR 178.11. The regulation defines
    "curios or relics" as firearms of "special
    interest to collectors by reason of
    some quality other than is ordinarily
    associated with firearms intended for
    sporting use or as offensive or defensive
    weapons." The regulation further
    defines curios or relics to include "firearms
    which derive a substantial part
    of their monetary value from the fact
    that they are novel, rare, bizarre, or
    because of their association with
    some historical figure, period or
    event."
    In classifying firearms as curios or
    relics under this regulation, ATF has
    recognized only assembled firearms
    as curios or relics.
    Moreover, ATF's classification of
    surplus military firearms as curios or
    relics has extended only to those
    firearms in their original military configuration.
    Frames or receivers of
    curios or relics and surplus military
    firearms not in their original military
    configuration were not generally recognized
    as curios or relics by ATF
    since they were not of special interest
    or value as collector's items.
    Specifically, they did not meet the
    definition of curio or relic in section
    178.11 as firearms of special interest
    to collectors by reason of a quality
    other than is ordinarily associated
    with sporting firearms or offensive or
    defensive weapons.
    Furthermore, they did not ordinarily
    have monetary value as novel, rare,
    or bizarre firearms; nor were they
    generally considered curios or relics
    because of their association with
    some historical figure, period or
    event.
    It is clear from the legislative history
    that Congress did not intend for
    the frames or receivers alone of surplus
    military firearms, or any other
    surplus military firearms not in their
    original military configuration, to be
    importable under section 925(e). It is
    also clear that only those firearms
    classified by ATF as curios or relics
    were intended to be approved by ATF
    for importation.
    Held: to be importable under 18
    U.S.C. section 925(e), surplus military
    firearms must be classified as curios
    or relics by ATF. Applications by
    licensed importers to import frames or
    receivers alone of surplus military
    curio or relic firearms will not be approved
    under section 925(e). Surplus
    military firearms will not be classified
    as curios or relics unless they are
    assembled in their original military
    configuration, and applications for
    permits to import such firearms will
    not be approved.
     
  7. Lee Roder

    Lee Roder Member

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  8. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    The FOPA '86 erased the federal "contiguous states" restriction put in place in the GCA '68.

    As an unlicensed person you may:
    1) Buy a rifle, shotgun, or handgun from a dealer or other citizen of your state, in your state. (As long as your state laws allow.)
    2) Buy a rifle or shotgun from an FFL dealer at their place of business or at a gun show in ANY state. (As long as both states' laws allow.)
    3) Buy a rifle or shotgun from a private party in another state -- IF you transfer it (filling out the 4473 form) at a dealer in that state or your state. (As long as both states' laws allow.)
    4) Buy a handgun from a private party in any state -- IF you transfer it (filling out the 4473 form) at a dealer in your state.

    You may NOT:
    1) Buy a rifle or shotgun from anyone who is not a licensed dealer (FFL) who is a resident of any other state besides your state of residence. (Unless you have a dealer do the transfer paperwork as mentioned above.)
    2) Buy a handgun from anyone, including an FFL dealer, in any state outside your state of residence.

    All of this is spelled out pretty clearly in the ATF's FAQ.
    ...

    So, to answer your questions directly:

    Down south, up north -- all the same. Some states have more restrictive laws, but that's true throughout the country.

    This is completely illegal. Federal law says that if the buyer and seller are not residents of the same state, both commit federal felonies.

    Obviously not legal anywhere on the show grounds, or anywhere else in the country. Transfer MUST be done through an FFL dealer on the 4473 form. Period.

    Yup. Or at a gun show. Or anywhere.

    Again, both parties commit federal felonies. If one of the parties is an ATF undercover agent, the other party goes to prison and pays large fines.

    Really? I know we covered it regularly here -- already once this month: http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=7151019

    Not at all! It is a matter of federal law, and the answers are VERY clear. No mystery, no sensitive info.
     
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2011
  9. bobelk99

    bobelk99 Member

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    Sam:

    Thank you for taking time to do updates.
     
  10. Trader Ray

    Trader Ray Member

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    I did not think this through, I recently moved to one state to another. I have handgun on layaway in my old state and now have the new states Drivers License. Should I just get what cash I can get back or have it transferred to a FFL in my new state?
     
  11. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    Explain the situation to the FFL you have the gun on layaway with and work out an arrangement to have it shipped to an FFL in your new location. A driver's license isn't required to prove residency, but he's going to ask for it when you do the 4473 paperwork and you'll have to explain anyway. Better tell him now and work it out before hand.
     
  12. newbuckeye

    newbuckeye Member

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    So how are on line auctions legal if you buy the hand gun from an FFL in another state? Even with the transfer going thru a LGS, the purchase was made FROM the FFL in another state.
     
  13. Librarian

    Librarian Member

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    The prohibition is on the transfer from an FFL or resident in state X to a resident of state Y.

    Auction purchases by a person in state Y generally get shipped to an FFL in state Y for delivery to the buyer, following both Federal law and the laws of state Y.
     
  14. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    Yes, that would be clearer if it said "transfer" rather than buy. You can send or give your money to whomever, wherever, and can receive a bill of sale. However, you cannot take posession of that firearm until it has been transferred to you by a dealer in your state.
     
  15. Trader Ray

    Trader Ray Member

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    Sam1911, thank you for your reply. It helped to come to the conclusion I have.
     
  16. m2steven

    m2steven Member

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    May I as a non FFL holder ship a non curio pistol or revolver to an FFL in a state other than my residence for delivery to a buyer?

    In other words, if I put my Glock 26 on Gunbroker, sell it to someone out of state, do I have to have an FFL ship it to the buyer's FFL, or may I ship the pistol to the out of state FFL myself?
     
  17. Sam1911

    Sam1911 Moderator

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    You may ship it directly -- IF the buyer's FFL agrees to accept shipments from non-licensees. Some do not for reasons of their own. Get the whole thing squared away with all parties involved before you send anything.

    (And don't put it in the USPS!)
     
  18. m2steven

    m2steven Member

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    Thank you Sam1911.
     
  19. Lo8080

    Lo8080 Member

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    How about flash suppressors? are they considered the same as a silencer? I wanted to attach one to my KELTEC PLR but wasn't sure if it required a tax stamp. Lastly would a muzzle break also require a tax stamp?
     
  20. dogtown tom

    dogtown tom Member

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    Neither a muzzle break or flash supressor/hider is considered a supressor.
    Muzzle breaks and flash hiders are perfectly legal under federal law and do not require NFA tax stamps.

    Only NFA firearms such as sound supressors or silencers require registration and payment of a tax stamp.
     
  21. Lo8080

    Lo8080 Member

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    Thanks for the info, Dogtown!
     
  22. ctrs

    ctrs Member

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