Barrel Break-in? Yes or no?

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IMO, just shoot it, clean it, shoot it some more. if you bought a special target barrel, then, i would break it in according to the barrel manufacturers request. but on a box stock barrel...... if you want to think about IMPROVING your new barrel, you might think about shooting a box of "david tubb's final finish system" bullets through your rifle. they are a series of abrasive bullets that polish the bore. they really do work! i ran a box through my 45/70, which looked like it was made with a hammer and chisle (well, almost). it polished the heck out of it. makes cleaning a breeze. and it copper fouls way less now. it is supposed to give you better velocity and accuracy as well. i did not check velocity, but it did improve the accuracy of my rifle. eventually, i would like to run a box of these through all of my guns. but that is kind of expensive.
 
moose,

Why'd you have to go and do that? Now my mind is wondering about that Final Finish ammo. I am on the site right now reading about it. Now I have to try it. Thanks a lot.

Maybe you can start a thread about Final Finish instead of hijacking this one 'cause I have some questions and maybe some others do too.
 
Thumbs up to Tubbs final finish. Makes cleaning much easier and certainly did not hurt accuracy. (I think it's more accurate, but don't have statistically valid numbers to back it up). Not sure I would do that on a custom barrel though, they're already in good shape.
Breaking in a new barrel now. I ran some patches through it during the first shooting session, cleaned it when I got home. Will see how it does next time out. I'm guessing it will be fine. I do know that it takes a fouler shot to regain consistency after cleaning which is why I never clean my rifle during hunting season.
 
Might make a difference on a military surplus barrel. I have a bud who owns a bore scope. He had a new in the wrap WWII 03 barrel. He installed the thing on an action and looked down the tube. Lots of tool marks.

He fired one round and looked down the tube. Said incredible copper fouling, maybe even copper chunks in tool marks. So he really cleaned it. Took a lot of time to get the patches to come out clean.

Fired another round. Less copper chunks. Another cleaning job.

He did this five times, took the whole blasted afternoon. He claimed at the end of this, the barrel had a lot less fouling.

He of course did not have a comparable barrel to shoot five rounds, clean, etc.

I don't do the barrel break in, outside of cleaning the barrel when I am finished zeroing. That takes about 50 - 70 rounds. My Krieger barrels are still tack drivers.

When you are shooting something like a 6.5-284, 6 mm X, or 6.5-08, which have barrel accuracy lifetimes from 1700 to 2400 rounds, putting 50-100 rounds up front in a barrel break in ritual may not make sense.
 
SlamFire1 said:
When you are shooting something like a 6.5-284, 6 mm X, or 6.5-08, which have barrel accuracy lifetimes from 1700 to 2400 rounds, putting 50-100 rounds up front in a barrel break in ritual may not make sense.

That's a good point and that's why I used the break-in shots (13 per barrel) to obtain some preliminary load data. I increased the loads in 0.5gr increments for the .308 Win and 1.0gr increments for the .300 Win Mag so I don't feel that I "wasted" any of the barrel life. At the end of the session I shot these two groups ... shots #24 to #28 in the .308 Win and shots #19 to #23 in the .300 Win Mag.

308_300.jpg


Once I start neck-sizing the cases, find the "perfect" load AND improve my technique, the groups should be even smaller.

:)
 
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We should make a drinking game out of these weekly barrel break in threads.

Take one shot every time someone posts a link to Shilen, Douglas or Krieger's break in procedure.

Take two shots anytime anyone says they couldn't find anything using the search

and take three shots when someone like me makes fun of the whole notion and posts nothing relevant other than a futile attempt a little comic relief
 
clean it first
sight it in about 10 round
clean it
take it hunting
clean it at the end of season
take it hunting next season
clean at end of each season every year after
 
A fiber in the periphery of your thread...
A local dealer that had an AR15 I was interested in offered to "break-in" the gun for me for an extra $100 (I think he said he would have to fire a couple hundred rounds through it). I thought it was a scam. Anyone know if 'AR break-in' is fiction or not?
 
Years ago when I went through sniper school, everybody at the school did barrel break-ins. None of the people at the sniper school would even begin to think of any barrel or rifle as being broke in until it had, at the very minimum, 500 rounds through it. The overall consensus was that barrels can take thousands upon thousands of shots before you will ruin one.

The key was to use good ammo, clean frequently and shoot slowly with the first several hundred to 300 rounds. Do not heat up the barrel with the first few hundred shots. Fire one round and pause. Fire another round and pause. Keep doing that along with periodic bore swabbing and cleaning. The most rounds that you want to shoot before cleaning or swabbing is no more than 5 at any one time.

Before you begin, get yourself a decent 5 round shot group from the barrel right as you begin to break it in. After about 300 to 350 rounds get another 5 round shot group to compare to the first group. At 400 rounds you get a third shot group and then at 500 rounds you get a fourth shot group for comparing. By the time you get your fourth shot group, you will actually see a very noticeable difference between the 1st shot group and the fourth shot group. Often you will see a group come out of the barrel of a rifle that is the size of about a man's palm or about 3 to 4 inches across. By the time you hit 500 rounds, the group drops down in size to about the size of a nickle or even smaller. Once I learned that breaking in a rifle barrel is a good thing, I've done some form of it ever since to include doing it for my AR-15s and M-4 clones.

Next time you get a new rifle, try it out. In addition to breaking in the barrel, the slow fire initial shooting allows other parts in your rifle or carbine, especially in the ARs and M-4 clones, to mesh together better or smooth out.
 
Sage advice Rifleman 173, unfortunately I fear it's wasted on a few here. Some do not have the discipline because their lives are on fast forward and they don't feel the need.
Thanks for your insight and experience.

NCsmitty
 
Thank you Rifleman 173 for the good advice!

I must say I never really thought of doing it, but there can always be a first time for me to try it!

Thanks again for some new insight that I didn't have before I read your post!
 
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Thanks Rifleman173, I take it that you know what you're talking about, so I'll definitely try this on that new AR I'm saving up for.

+1 NCsmitty
Too many people, especially here, simply dismiss and ignore good advice. I figure that these forums here are primarily for the purpose of obtaining good advice, but anymore it's becoming something else.
 
Before you begin, get yourself a decent 5 round shot group from the barrel right as you begin to break it in. After about 300 to 350 rounds get another 5 round shot group to compare to the first group. At 400 rounds you get a third shot group and then at 500 rounds you get a fourth shot group for comparing. By the time you get your fourth shot group, you will actually see a very noticeable difference between the 1st shot group and the fourth shot group. Often you will see a group come out of the barrel of a rifle that is the size of about a man's palm or about 3 to 4 inches across. By the time you hit 500 rounds, the group drops down in size to about the size of a nickle or even smaller. Once I learned that breaking in a rifle barrel is a good thing, I've done some form of it ever since to include doing it for my AR-15s and M-4 clones.

I'm sorry and I realize things are different for lowest bidder government issue rifles but if I buy a firearm or barrel that takes 500 rounds to stop shooting hand sized groups it's going to be viewed by me with extreme displeasure in that I would NEVER buy another product from that manufacturer again.

A gun that takes 500 rounds to stop shooting patters is a piece of garbage. Buy decent equipment and you can start with "nickel" sized groups from round one.

You barrel break in proponents ever stop the think that the deciding factor may be the additional practice you got during "break in":rolleyes: Or better yet possibly just mabye shooting a barrel breaks it in even without all the voodoo superstition
 
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I also had that SAME thought,

"I wonder how much of the actual BREAKING IN is the user getting used to shooting and holding, and the 'feel' of a (the) new gun."
 
Rifleman 173's post is utter nonsense. I am probably guilty of ignoring "good advice" from time to time, but some of you are way, way too credulous.
 
Years ago when I went through sniper school, everybody at the school did barrel break-ins.
Well, 40 years ago, when I was helping run a new sniper school for 5th. Inf. AMU, every new student didn't get a new rifle or a new barrel to "break in".

Most of our guns were well broken in several times over by our gunsmiths and match shooters before the new students even got their sorry butts in the U.S. Army!

"Break-in" consisted of taking several newly built rifles to the range, and shooting 7.62 LC match ammo through them at increasing yardage, until they proved themselves capable, or not.

Those that "not" got a gunsmiths attention until they did.
And those that did got cleaned for the first time, and put away for issue.

rcmodel
 
krochus said:
... if I buy a firearm or barrel that takes 500 rounds to stop shooting hand sized groups it's going to be viewed by me with extreme displeasure in that I would NEVER buy another product from that manufacturer again.

The only way I'd be happy with a rifle that took 500 rounds to break in is if it had a guaranteed accurate life span of 20,000 to 30,000 rounds. These are the first five shots (cleaning every shot) from a new Krieger barrel on the .300 Win Mag that I just put together. It's not the best group on the planet but it's under 1" at 100 yards with new, unfired cases and the lowest powder charge in the manual. Last weekend I shot a five-shot group just over 0.5" at 100 yards with shots #19 through #23 through the barrel with new, unfired cases (see previous post). Even my out-of-the-box Remington 700 in .300 WSM was grouping at or under 0.75" within 50 rounds. The first four shots fired (factory ammunition at 100 yards, 1/4" grid) from a new DPMS 24" stainless steel fluted barrel grouped at just about 0.5" without any cleaning between shots. The point here is simply to show that as krochus mentioned, good equipment is good from the start.


300.jpg
300WSM.jpg
AR15.jpg


:)
 
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How to laugh heartily over the interweb?

No offense to all the posters, but you clean the cosmoline and re-oil and shoot. If you feel that the factory rust deterrent is not too thick, go straight to the range.
 
I have had a couple rifle that would shoot under a .5 inch moa out of the box.. How tight would they have if I would have done a 500 round break in:neener:
 
Pat4x4 said:
I have had a couple rifle that would shoot under a .5 inch moa out of the box.. How tight would they have if I would have done a 500 round break in

Your rifles are obviously accurate but out of interest, do you get copper fouling in the barrel when you shoot the rifle? If so, do you spend time/effort removing it?

Break-in isn't just about how well (accurate) a rifle shoots, not to me anyway. It's also about how much fouling accumulates in the barrel and how much time and effort you have to spend removing it. If your rifle shoots well with fouling in the barrel and you don't plan on removing the fouling then you're done and this thread means nothing to you. If however, you believe that fouling affects accuracy (everyone basically agrees that lead fouling in a pistol barrel is bad for accuracy) and either you don't want the barrel to foul at all and/or you don't want to have to remove the fouling, then a good break-in procedure may be for you.

Another consideration is that a fouled barrel (with copper) can pit more easily and more severely if left in a corrosive environment. If you're unable to store your rifle(s) in optimal conditions, copper fouling may lead to severe pitting which may affect accuracy.

So for me, break-in is about minimizing the tendency of the barrel to foul with copper which may affect accuracy now or later.

:)
 
My comment is in jest in regards to how much better the groups are after 500 rounds.. Everyone needs to do what they need to do.. The horse is dead.. stop beating it:D that was in fun also
 
:barf: :barf: :barf:

That's me throwing up ... once for each shot!!

HAPPY NEW YEAR!!

:D
 
moose,

Why'd you have to go and do that? Now my mind is wondering about that Final Finish ammo. I am on the site right now reading about it. Now I have to try it. Thanks a lot.

i did, before i tried them. this is the link.

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=371654

i didnt get to much response. i did post after i tried them some place, but i cant find it. take it for what it is worth, but i highly recomend them.
 
500 rounds to break in a barrel?! what was the barrel made out of, diamond?! i can understand 30-50 shots maybe on a special tarrget berrel. but 500 rounds seems horrificly excessive for a break in period! that would be like saying you have to break in your car for the first 40,000 miles. if you put a good break in cleaning regiment in with those 500 rounds, you would be at the range for weeks, if not months. does not sound viable to me.
 
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