Berry’s 9mm info?

[JmacD]

I’ve got a bunch (as in 1000) berry’s 115 gr FMJ 9mm bullets I’m wanting to load up for plinking. I’m using red dot powder and berry’s web sight says essentially to us comparable info from a manual. Well… I’m finding a lot of variety here. I had to go way back to even find red dot in some instances. any input appreciated.

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

For Berry's plated bullets (lead electroplated with copper) I typically use cast or swaged bullet data matching the shape and diameter of their bullet, then work up until I get "good" 25yd groups. In my case, that means they all hit the paper and were generally clustered around where I think the front sight might have been, mostly.

Here's a good starting point. Hope it helps.

Lyman's data from 2002 (48th Ed.) for 120gr. #2 Alloy. Berry's cores are "about" as hard as #2 Alloy so it should get you close. Stick to the starting loads and work up in 0.2gr increments and you will get to a good load pretty quickly. Use the COAL/COL data from Berry's for their bullet and plunk test in your chamber(s) when looking for a good seating depth.

 

[JmacD]

For Berry's plated bullets (lead electroplated with copper) I typically use cast or swaged bullet data matching the shape and diameter of their bullet, then work up until I get "good" 25yd groups. In my case, that means they all hit the paper and were generally clustered around where I think the front sight might have been, mostly.

Here's a good starting point. Hope it helps.
View attachment 1024551
Lyman's data from 2002 (48th Ed.) for 120gr. #2 Alloy. Berry's cores are "about" as hard as #2 Alloy so it should get you close. Stick to the starting loads and work up in 0.2gr increments and you will get to a good load pretty quickly. Use the COAL/COL data from Berry's for their bullet and plunk test in your chamber(s) when looking for a good seating depth.

I’ve currently loaded a few with 3.9 gr red dot and oal of 1.12 The charge differential makes me a little wary. One place says 3.5 is high. Another says it won’t cycle the slide. Allianz themselves says 4.5 and hornady has 4.1 for a max. Makes a newbie shake his head a bit.

 

[LiveLife]

berry’s 115 gr FMJ 9mm ... red dot powder ... any input appreciated.

Berry's 9mm 115 gr bullets are copper plated and I have had good results using lead load data or start-mid range jacketed load data as going higher would reduce accuracy.

I like Red Dot for 9mm and interchange load data by weight with Promo.

From recent 9mm Red Dot discussion thread -
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/anyone-using-red-dot-in-9mm.894187/#post-12040827

2004 Alliant load data - http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=182147&d=1364769070

• 115 gr FMJ Red Dot COL 1.120" Max 4.5 gr (1150 fps)

For 115 gr FMJ/plated RN, I load to 1.130" with 4.0-4.2 gr (Target load) or 4.2-4.4 gr of Promo (Factory white box like load. Almost 100% case fill load) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...for-more-accurate-loads.841097/#post-10919894

For 115 gr FMJ FP Match Winner, I load to 1.045" with 4.2 gr of Promo (Almost 100% case fill load) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...endence-from-work.853305/page-4#post-11219888

I find Red Dot/Promo well suitable for carbine loads, especially blowback action, as faster burn rate seems to seal the case better with chamber and produces less sooty cases than slower burning than W231/HP-38 powders with greater accuracy.

Here are some Promo chrono data (These are carbine loads so subtract around 200 fps for pistol velocities. BTW, Promo is reverse temperature sensitive - Higher velocity at colder temps) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...n-9mm-40s-w-45acp.799231/page-4#post-10338994

115 gr Berry's HBRN 3.9-4.0 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1275-1261-1316-1287-1294 fps (59 F - PSA carbine)
115 gr Berry's HBRN 4.5-4.6 gr Promo @ 1.130": 1414-1377-1375-1420-1372 (75 F - JR carbine)

115 gr RMR HM RN 3.9-4.0 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1204-1276-1259-1273-1247 fps (59 F - PSA carbine)
115 gr RMR HM RN 4.0-4.2 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1331-1358-1346 fps (59 F - PSA carbine - ran out of test rounds)
115 gr RMR HM RN 4.5-4.7 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1351-1364-1363-1357-1342 (71 F - JR carbine)

BTW, for 115 gr FMJ/plated RN, 4.0-4.2 gr of Promo but loaded shorter at 1.110"-1.115" to squeeze out more accuracy and produced mild recoil target load. 4.4-4.5 gr of Promo produces firmer recoil on par with factory load with greater accuracy.

 

[Zendude]

My plinking load mirrors LiveLife’s post above with 115 grn Berrys over 4.1 grn Red Dot at 1.135 OAL.

 

[Pat Riot]

I cannot help you with a Red Dot load, but I use these bullets and as long as you don’t go beyond a 1250 FPS velocity that will be fine per Berry’s. You should have a sticker on your box that has this info:


I have loaded these with Universal and Unique to around 1150 FPS and they are very good bullets for target practice and plinking.

 

[JmacD]

Berry's 9mm 115 gr bullets are copper plated and I have had good results using lead load data or start-mid range jacketed load data as going higher would reduce accuracy.

I like Red Dot for 9mm and interchange load data by weight with Promo.

From recent 9mm Red Dot discussion thread -
https://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?threads/anyone-using-red-dot-in-9mm.894187/#post-12040827

2004 Alliant load data - http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=182147&d=1364769070

• 115 gr FMJ Red Dot COL 1.120" Max 4.5 gr (1150 fps)

For 115 gr FMJ/plated RN, I load to 1.130" with 4.0-4.2 gr (Target load) or 4.2-4.4 gr of Promo (Factory white box like load. Almost 100% case fill load) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...for-more-accurate-loads.841097/#post-10919894

For 115 gr FMJ FP Match Winner, I load to 1.045" with 4.2 gr of Promo (Almost 100% case fill load) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...endence-from-work.853305/page-4#post-11219888

I find Red Dot/Promo well suitable for carbine loads, especially blowback action, as faster burn rate seems to seal the case better with chamber and produces less sooty cases than slower burning than W231/HP-38 powders with greater accuracy.

Here are some Promo chrono data (These are carbine loads so subtract around 200 fps for pistol velocities. BTW, Promo is reverse temperature sensitive - Higher velocity at colder temps) - https://www.thehighroad.org/index.p...n-9mm-40s-w-45acp.799231/page-4#post-10338994

115 gr Berry's HBRN 3.9-4.0 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1275-1261-1316-1287-1294 fps (59 F - PSA carbine)
115 gr Berry's HBRN 4.5-4.6 gr Promo @ 1.130": 1414-1377-1375-1420-1372 (75 F - JR carbine)

115 gr RMR HM RN 3.9-4.0 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1204-1276-1259-1273-1247 fps (59 F - PSA carbine)
115 gr RMR HM RN 4.0-4.2 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1331-1358-1346 fps (59 F - PSA carbine - ran out of test rounds)
115 gr RMR HM RN 4.5-4.7 gr Promo @ 1.135": 1351-1364-1363-1357-1342 (71 F - JR carbine)

BTW, for 115 gr FMJ/plated RN, 4.0-4.2 gr of Promo but loaded shorter at 1.110"-1.115" to squeeze out more accuracy and produced mild recoil target load. 4.4-4.5 gr of Promo produces firmer recoil on par with factory load with greater accuracy.

Thanks. I have a couple I’ll try over the weekend.

 

[JmacD]

I cannot help you with a Red Dot load, but I use these bullets and as long as you don’t go beyond a 1250 FPS velocity that will be fine per Berry’s. You should have a sticker on your box that has this info:
View attachment 1024610

I have loaded these with Universal and Unique to around 1150 FPS and they are very good bullets for target practice and plinking.

Ok. That’s the exact ones I have. Thanks

 

[GeoDudeFlorida]

I’ve currently loaded a few with 3.9 gr red dot and oal of 1.12 The charge differential makes me a little wary. One place says 3.5 is high. Another says it won’t cycle the slide. Allianz themselves says 4.5 and hornady has 4.1 for a max. Makes a newbie shake his head a bit.

Check the materials in your sources. There’s no equivalency between swaged, cast and jacketed. If you look at swaged loads and then jacketed, yes they will be all over the place. They should be. Most swaged bullets are very soft - soft enough to strip the rifling if the pressure is too high or the powder is too slow. Jacketed need a slower powder at higher pressure because they are very hard and need constant pressure to assure they exit the barrel. Plated bullets are a thin layer of copper over cast. The copper plate replaces lubricant to prevent leading. That’s about all it matters for.

 

[Charlie98]

Makes a newbie shake his head a bit.

Used to be all you had to pick from was lead or jacketed... but these days we have coated, plated, heavy plated... and I'm sure someone somewhere will come up with The Next Best Thing sooner or later (kind of like moly, Back Home, Years Ago.) Anyway, as others have suggested, start with cast lead data and work your way up. With the 9mm, being a high pressure round, pay close attention to your bullet seating depth and cartridge overall length (COAL.) Small differences in COAL can add up to big differences in pressure, and particularly with a faster powder.

 

[JmacD]

Check the materials in your sources. There’s no equivalency between swaged, cast and jacketed. If you look at swaged loads and then jacketed, yes they will be all over the place. They should be. Most swaged bullets are very soft - soft enough to strip the rifling if the pressure is too high or the powder is too slow. Jacketed need a slower powder at higher pressure because they are very hard and need constant pressure to assure they exit the barrel. Plated bullets are a thin layer of copper over cast. The copper plate replaces lubricant to prevent leading. That’s about all it matters for.

That’s definitely supplies the link I was missing! Thank you very much.

 

[mdi]

My suggestions for a new reloader; Pay no attention to any load data you see on any forum, hear at the range, from any gun counter clerk, good intended friend, or gun shop guru. Get your data from published manuals or powder manufacturer's websites. Ignore "they said" reports, internet wisdon. Use a couple different sources and begin with the lowest listed starting load,load and work up if necessary. A good starting place is tried and true loads (38 Special = 158 gr bullet, cast or jacketed, medium fast powder like Bullseye, 45 ACP = 230 gr RN jacketed or cast, Bullseye powder. Etc.).I have been reloading for quite a while and the info/data in my reloading manuals is varied enough, and enough to keep the normal reloader/shooter busy for a very long time.Personally I have no use for plated bullets and don't recommend them for new reloaders. I see waaaay to many questions on forums about plated bullets, "how do I crimp?", "where can I find a load?", "my manuals don't have plated bullet data", etc. (I have 250 9mm plated bullets from one of the best known plated bullet manufacturers and they are in the back of a cabinet in case I run out of cast or jacketed bullets. I tried reloading these and couldn't get a consistent seating depth, and prior attempts at using plated bullets in my semi-autos and revolvers left me unimpressed). Try to use "professional" info before a random forum question (Reloading manuals, reloading texts, retc.). Personaly I add "Celebrity Loads" to my ignore list. Some famous bullet designers, ex LEOs, and competition shooter's loads are often quoted and copied. Don't guess at anything or try to replicate Bubba's experiments...

Go slow. Double check everything. Most important, have fun...

 

[fxvr5]

Check the materials in your sources. There’s no equivalency between swaged, cast and jacketed. If you look at swaged loads and then jacketed, yes they will be all over the place. They should be. Most swaged bullets are very soft - soft enough to strip the rifling if the pressure is too high or the powder is too slow. Jacketed need a slower powder at higher pressure because they are very hard and need constant pressure to assure they exit the barrel. Plated bullets are a thin layer of copper over cast. The copper plate replaces lubricant to prevent leading. That’s about all it matters for.

My goodness there's a lot of BS there.

The issue with swaged bullets is not pressure, it's velocity. Their softness and their lube don't do well when the bullets are pushed fast. But it has nothing to do with chamber pressure. And powder burn speed has nothing to do with it either.

Jacketed bullets don't need a faster powder, and again, it's not a chamber pressure issue. The entire world knows that fast powders at low pressures produce some of the most accurate loads with jacketed bullets. For example, Bullseye shooters prefer fast powders with their 185 grain jacketed bullets for the best accuracy. And these are with starting, or below starting, charge weights. One of the fastest powders available, Vit N310, is a favorite, and it's loaded with starting or below starting charge weights.
https://www.shootingtimes.com/editorial/loads-for-the-bullseye-shooter/99418

Some plated bullets have a thicker coating to better handle speed, and with Speer Gold Dot Hollow Points the copper plating is bonded to the core to prevent 'core/jacket' separation for better terminal performance - or so they claim.

You can stick a bullet in the barrel with any speed powder if there isn't enough of it.