best bolt action for a scout rifle build?

[jason41987]

hey everyone.. ive been thinking of building a scout rifle (small, light weight, lighter caliber bolt action with open sights)...

anyway, my goal is a 16-18 inch barrel, maybe 20, open sights, adjustable real leaf (like the ones used on old mausers and nagants), id like to be stripper-clip fed, but less of a PITA with stripper clips than my mosin nagant is...

umm... my options are the remington 700 action, or a mauser 96/98 action... since its only a .308 and not some giant magnum caliber, i dont think i need the added diameter, length, or third locking lug present in a large-ring mauser, and believe the small ring to be the better choice

what do you guys think would match this criteria best?

 

[Robert]

rcmodel will be along to explain in detail why a small ring mauser is not a good idea for 308. Long story short I believe they are not rated for the pressure that 308 can produce. If you hand load for it and keep the pressure low it should be ok. Using full pressure ammo could end poorly.

 

[jason41987]

aah yeah... i just noticed the 6.5x55 has a SAAMI of 55,000, im guessing thats maxed out for the action? .308 winchester is considerably hotter...

so besides the large-ring mauser, m1903 springfield, and remington 700 actions, what other actions could i consider?

 

[.303]

http://ruger.com/products/gunsiteScoutRifle/models.html

I think you would be more satisfied with one of these in the long run. no clip guide, but the new mags can be loaded through the top, so you could use strippers to top it off. mauser action. 16'' bbl with flash suppressor. whats not to love?

 

[rcmodel]

The stripper-clip thing limits you pretty much to a military action.
They already have built-in clip guides

03 Springfield or 98 Mauser would be the best to start with.

A G33/40 small ring 98 would be most excellent from a weight & strength point.
But you can buy a ready to shoot Savage Scout rifle for what they bring now.

In the grand scheme of things anymore though?
If you don't have the necessary tools and skills to convert a military action to a sporter?
Gunsmith costs will eat you alive before you get it done.

rc

 

[jason41987]

i have the skills and much of the tools needed to do whatever i want, including putting stripper clip guys onto a non military bolt action... also buying something isnt nearly as fun

heres a question though.. most, if not all mauser 98s ive had experience with are large ring, how does a large ring 98 mauser differ from large ring 98, and a small ring 96?

 

[henschman]

For a rifle with a leaf sight, I would look at an Ishapore Enfield. They came chambered in .308. They have detachable 12 round mags, and also feed from stripper clips. They have a longer barrel than you require, and aren't exactly light weight in original trim, but if you replaced the wood with a synthetic stock, or just cut down the wood, and maybe chopped the barrel, you could make it pretty handy.

A Spanish Mauser in 7.62x51 would be a good choice as well.

An FR-8 in 7.62x51 is just about ideal for a Scout, since they come with a 17.75" barrel, but they have a rear aperture instead of a leaf (which most people think is better, but different strokes and whatnot).

 

[rcmodel]

how does a large ring 98 Mauser differ from large ring 98, and a small ring 96?

1.100" Lg ring vis .980" Sm ring barrel threads.

And enough weight to make a difference on a light rifle design.

Forget the 96 for a .308.
They are not as strong as a 98 of either size, lack the 3rd. safety lug, and don't handle escaping gas nearly as well if things do go south.

Yes, they will work.
But IMO, it's not worth the risk to your face & eyes if they don't!

BTW: Buy this book!
It covers about every bolt-action ever made in strengths & weaknesses detail.
http://www.amazon.com/Bolt-Action-Rifles-Expanded-Edition/dp/0873491688#_


rc

 

[Husker1911]

Might not be the "best," but it surely works well for me. Remington .308 Rem Mohawk 600. That's a Burris atop. Whitetails have nightmares about this medicine.

 

[Edarnold]

As an example of a small ring '98 action, the Mexican M1936 that I have for sale in the trading post area. Also a short action, built for the 7x57 cartridge and therefore more suitable for 7.62x51 than the longer Kar98 types.

 

[wlewisiii]

I'm in the process of doing one on a VZ-24 action. 19" barrel, 7x57, standard mil iron sights, Houge synthetic stock, Timney trigger, stock safety. Eventually I intend to get an S&K mount for the rear sight and a long eye relief red dot or, at most, 2x scope.

Edit: yes, it does have it's stripper guides. Much better carrying a couple of strippers rather than magazines.

The model 98 based mauser actions (licensed or clones) from between the wars are still probably the best actions for this kind of make over. Strong and easy to work with and still lots of them out there.

 

[35 Whelen]

You mean something like theez?:



Yes, it's a '96 (actually a 1916), but it hasn't blown up yet and I'm sure it'll outlive me as Ihave a long, long history of not blowing up rifles.

Or if you can find an FR-8, you can do something like this:



If you don't want a scope, leave it off.

Edarnald is spot on if you want a '98 Mauser; the 1936 or 1910. I built a 257 AI on a 1910 many years ago.

I'm with you on the stripper guide, very handy as opposed to carrying extra mags in the case of a Ruger or Savage.

I know not everyone has the skills or desire to build their own rifles, but I'm with you 100% on building your own. I've built two and wouldn't trade them for a truck load of Steyr's, Ruger's or Savages. I think in our microwave, "I want it now" society, people have lost touch with the immense satisfaction of doing something themselves and thereby owning a very unique firearm rather than buying some mass produced, cookie cutter type.

35W

 

[Craigman]

NICE^^^

 

[Haxby]

I don't know what would be best, but I would like to know if there is any downside to the Remington Model 7 for this application.

 

[303tom]

The Type 38 Arisaka, they are plentiful & the action is super strong................

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=283598432

 

[wlewisiii]

35 Whelen, that is a beautiful rifle. Thank you for sharing it.

I'm doing everything on mine except spinning on the new barrel. I don't have the workshop to ensure it's done right and headspaced correctly. That detail aside, I'm in full agreement on the merits of doing it yourself. I also have a badly bubba'd Spanish M93 that I keep wondering about rebuilding in .257 Roberts but I think I may just keep it as it is (it shoots 7x57 just fine) as an example of what not to do.

 

[35 Whelen]

35 Whelen, that is a beautiful rifle. Thank you for sharing it.

Thank you, and my pleasure. The neatest thing (to me) about the "beauty" of the stock in the top rifle is that it's the original stock. I always marvel at what beauty can come from a little TLC and a lot of hand rubbing with boiled linseed oil.

I really like Huskers little Mohawk 600.

35W

 

[splithoof]

My bet is that Ruger will soon offer a GSR version in .223 or similar, likely in stainless steel. That short rifle is so popular, the marketing folks there must chomping at the bit to release a version.

 

[Ignition Override]

Various people have pointed out on different websites how the Ruger "Scout" copied the idea of the Spanish FR8. Along with apertures for 200, 300 and 400 yards, the single open sight setting can work for 50-100 yards by fully elevating the post with the sight tool.

Both were preceded in 1945 by the Enfield "Jungle Carbine" for carrying through the nasty Burmese jungle, and also used in '56 against the Communist Insurrection in Malaysia.

 

[Sheepdog1968]

Lew Bonitz of Grizzly custom can modify a number of actions so you can use stripper clips. I called him and had a specific conversation about this topic. As for actions, I am fond of the light weight Kimbers as a starting point. My second choice would be the light weight Ruger action.

 

[greenlion]

Maybe someone asked and I missed it, but why would the magazine-fed Ruger Gunsite Scout rifle not be what you are looking for? The older military rifles had stripper clip cutouts because they also had fixed magazines usually holding 5 rounds. The Ruger rifle can hold 4 times that easily.

 

[Moose458]

German K98k with a Burris scout scope, turned out to be a tack driver.

 

[ApacheCoTodd]

You mean something like theez?:



Yes, it's a '96 (actually a 1916), but it hasn't blown up yet and I'm sure it'll outlive me as Ihave a long, long history of not blowing up rifles.

Or if you can find an FR-8, you can do something like this:



If you don't want a scope, leave it off.

Edarnald is spot on if you want a '98 Mauser; the 1936 or 1910. I built a 257 AI on a 1910 many years ago.

I'm with you on the stripper guide, very handy as opposed to carrying extra mags in the case of a Ruger or Savage.

I know not everyone has the skills or desire to build their own rifles, but I'm with you 100% on building your own. I've built two and wouldn't trade them for a truck load of Steyr's, Ruger's or Savages. I think in our microwave, "I want it now" society, people have lost touch with the immense satisfaction of doing something themselves and thereby owning a very unique firearm rather than buying some mass produced, cookie cutter type.

35W

Whelen - is that an M1 Carbine front sight on the 1916? Super cool, that.

This thread kicks ass. The input here has done so much more to get me on board the "Scout Rifle" concept than everything I've read to date - put together!

I'm gettin' jazzed about finally having a direction for 2 project grade rifles I have. On is a VZ-24 action and the other s a Carcano carbine in horrendous shape after their usual Arisaka-grade build.

I think the notion of a stripper in my pocket (not Krystal down at the Bottoms Up) rather than loose rounds or worse yet, a magazine is what has really tipped me in favor of the style of rifle. The Carcano style of clip makes an even stronger argument still.

 

[hang fire]

FN 98, Israeli rebarreled to 7.62x51.

 

[Art Eatman]

Back when Cooper first started writing about the Scout concept, he spoke favorably of the 600s. Availability was the issue...