Best Optic for an AK?

[DBR]

The AK gas tube mount gets very hot. Aimpoints seem to survive quite well. I wouldn't be so sure about lesser RDSs.

 

[AK103K]

Why put a $500 sight on a gun that cant shoot MOA anyway? Save the fancy stuff for an AR.

A good red dot brings the AK into the 21st century, and right in line with the AR's. Cost of the gun or the optic is really meaningless, as long both work and the sum of the two make the package the deal.

Most of my AK's and AR's are set up very similarly, basically, a stock gun with an Aimpoint on them. All set up this way have BUIS's of some sort, that cowitness. Other than that, and a good sling, what more do you need?

Oh, and believe it or dont, "most" AR's arent MOA either, especially when using commercial or GI ammo.

The inaccuracy of AKs is vastly overstated.

Vastly. And usually by those who have no real experience with them, and I'd hazard to say, most of the others either.

The factory AK iron sights are a godawful travesty. Those who want to stick with iron sights really ought to get a set of Tech Sights for them.

They really are not all that bad, and very usable to the realistic range the gun is used. They are not "target" sights, or are they trying to be, and they actually work better for fast, close in shooting than the peeps. If you shoulder and shoot an AK properly (head down and forward, nose to, or along side the top cover), I'd recommend against the Tech type sights, as they are in the wrong place and will interfere with natural shouldering/shooting of the gun.

I've used an ML2 Aimpoint in the factory ring on two of my Hungarian amd63's for 7 years in countless training sessions and classes. ZERO FAILURES! This combo is the only one that seems to dead co witness, I used the irons without removing the Aimpoint more than once when the battery went dead (rarely) as I don't turn them off for classes/outings only when returned to safe.

Ditto on all but the dead battery part. I've yet to find one dead, and I leave them on all the time. I just swap them out in the spring with the smoke detectors.

Its been awhile since I've had anything on my guns that wasnt Aimpoint, AK's or AR's, and a couple of others. The reason why they are still on them, they actually work under real use. I've had Tasco, Burris, BSA, Hakko, an and a couple of other "cheaper" (most werent "cheap") dots on them, and all failed in short order. If I had back what I wasted on them, Id probably have a couple more Aimpoints.

The AK gas tube mount gets very hot.

It gets warm, but nothing like the steel mounts. Aluminum dissipates heat quickly, and the mount, while warm, usually isnt usually hot to the touch.

 

[kwelz]

Its been awhile since I've had anything on my guns that wasnt Aimpoint, AK's or AR's, and a couple of others. The reason why they are still on them, they actually work under real use. I've had Tasco, Burris, BSA, Hakko, an and a couple of other "cheaper" (most werent "cheap") dots on them, and all failed in short order. If I had back what I wasted on them, Id probably have a couple more Aimpoints.

This pretty much sums up every Optics thread I ever see.

Take a look at this post over on M4C

This photo was from a class earlier this year. Everyone there was an advanced shooter with more Trigger time yearly than I had in my first 10 years of shooting.
Notice anything similar with almost every one of those guns?

All by 2 have Aimpoints of some type on them. The other two have Eotech XPS sights on them. I know for a fact one of them was a guys Duty gun so he had to use it, not sure about the other.

People pay the extra money for quality optics because they work better and are more durable. I have seen rifles run over and the Aimpoint still worked. I have seen them thrown around into things and still work.

If you are not doing anything that requires this type of durability then that is fine. But if the gun is going to be in any way used for Self defense then you need to consider how reliable every component is. Especially something as important as the Primary sighting device.

 

[AKElroy]

I stated in post 6 that this AK will not see an HD need; most likely pigs and plinking. I have progressing astigmatism, so iron sites are a fuzzy mess for me now. The RDS for this type of gun is really the only way it will see any use. The forward mount is a must because their really is no other way to get a solid mount on an AK other than the Ultimak. Please don't flame over the side mounts; First, my polish milled does not have them, and second, mounting some cheap ulgy russian tube that high above the bore just ain't gonna happen.

 

[AKElroy]

People pay the extra money for quality optics because they work better and are more durable. I have seen rifles run over and the Aimpoint still worked. I have seen them thrown around into things and still work.

I don't plan on running it, or any of my other guns over. I do not expect any of my optics to survive that abuse. I would like to have a co-witnessed site just in case the RDS fails to work, whether it is an aimpoint or other. The lack of co-witness ability rules out EoTech.

As mentioned, I am still looking for the best extremely low mount co-witnessing RDS I can buy for $250. there simply has to be something between a cheap $69 RDS and a $500 Aimpoint.

 

[kwelz]

I missed that in Post 6. Sorry.

Vortex or Primary Arms then should be fine then.

 

[benEzra]

Aimpoint Micro or Primary Arms Micro (depending on budget) on an Ultimak rail would definitely be the way to go, IMO. I like my Kobra, but if I had it to do over again, I'd have gone the Ultimak route. Who knows, I may still do so someday.

AK's were never meant for optics.

If that were true, AK's wouldn't have an optics rail on the left side of the receiver, and the Russians wouldn't have made optics for them (PK, Kobra, etc.).

What options do you have that secures the optics tight enough that they don't work loose or the jarring of the receiver from shell ejections doesn't eventually do some harm to scope/optics itself.

Either the factory siderail (which the OP's AK doesn't have) or an Ultimak rail will hold zero.

I just don't think, unless you are an expert marksman, you're going to get much accuracy, past 100 yards IMO. Good topic though!

In my experience, the #1 thing one can do to improve practical AK accuracy is to put a red dot on it. Also, use good ammo; replace the slant brake with an A2-style flash suppressor, a muzzle nut, or an AK-74 style brake (the slant brake has been shown to open up groups, presumably by inducing nutation as the bullet flies through the asymmetic gas flow); and don't rest the barrel or forend on anything firm when shooting.

 

[wriggly]

Ok is an "optimak" actually a product or are you just calling an ultimak by the wrong name?

I am getting old, annnnd Dyslexic. I think Optimak is a better name, they should change it.

 

[GunTech]

The big advantage of an optical sight on any rifle, precision or not, is that it places the target on the same focal plane as the reticule. This is a huge advantage in speed and make aiming much easier. With iron sights, you have to pick what you want in focus - the front sight, rear sight or target.

Anyone with iron sight experience knows the front sight is the important on, but it also makes the target fuzzy and identification hard, so most field shooters alternate focus between the target (to identify and categorize) and the front sight (to shoot with the highest probability of a hit).

The optical sight removes this whole problem. So yes, even on a cheap 5 MOA rifle, and optical sight offers an advantage. In fact the large scale deployment of optical sight on military rifles is arguably the most important upgrade to small arms in the last 50 years.

 

[Girodin]

I am getting old, annnnd Dyslexic. I think Optimak is a better name, they should change it.

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It sounded cool, I thought maybe there was a new product I hadn't yet seen.

 

[AKElroy]

OK, I made a decision & ordered an Aimpoint 9000L w/ a 2 MOA dot. It is more than I wanted to spend, but after buying so many "budget" RDS's, I am done replacing them. It won't co-witness, but with 5 year battery life I shouldn't need to. I went w/ Weaver Top Mount 30mm rings over the less expensive Aimpoint rings.

It is not a compact RDS, but with the near 6" Ultimak rail, that really does not matter to me. I will post pics once I have it all together.

I decided on the Aimpoint after realizing there really isn't a low cost alternative that is parallax free.