Black MZ

[Lunie]

At the end of the article excerpt it is clearly stated:



If folks chose not to buy the magazine then why complain about not believing what others have claimed that it says?

Yes it does, and I would rather not do the signing up.

Unfortunately, that is the only "Petersen's Hunting" anything I've been able to find online regarding Black MZ. And with the way it begins, I have my doubts it delivers the words "This powder is made by APP company and is in fact just re-banded American Pioneer".

At the end of that post, I added:

Regardless, I'm still waiting for some proof about it being made at the APP facilities, or any proof that this is a re-branded APP product. I'd be more than happy to be proven wrong.

 

[arcticap]

No one claimed that the article was available for free online (except maybe the publisher). Petersen's Hunting is a magazine that's for sale. Someone read the article and reported what it said. I'm not calling that person a liar because I have no reason to not believe him, or the opinion of other people who have experience with the powder and reported about it.
Time will tell if the eyewitness who read the article was telling the truth or not.
Why so much of a rush to make a judgement?
The Petersen's Hunting article isn't going anywhere, and the facts that it contains won't change.

 

[Lunie]

Why bring up that Petersen's article excerpt?
In hopes of getting to the truth sooner, rather than later.

Rumors are childish. I even despised them when I was a child. My apologies for being skeptical, but sometimes someone needs to stand up and do it.



To the OP, I'm sorry for my part in dragging this thread away from "Where can I buy it?" to "What is it, really?". I'm a long way from CT, but my best bet would have been Cabela's, either in-store or online. (And thanks arcticap, for so ably pointing Cabela's out earlier. ) Then again, I haven't tried shopping for it. There may be other and better sources. Best of luck.

 

[frontiergander]

I think someone has a hard time accepting it and just would rather moan and groan and whine.

Go buy some and shoot it.

 

[Lunie]

I think someone has a hard time accepting it and just would rather moan and groan and whine.

Go buy some and shoot it.

So you can't or won't prove your claims, and you'd rather attempt to insult me? I'm disappointed, I was hoping this discussion could remain at a higher caliber than that.

You are obviously convinced you are right, no problem. All I have been asking for is verification of what you claim. If you've got it, great. Share it with the whole community of folks who would be interested to see it. If you don't have any proof (other than your own hidebound opinion), then I can't help you with that. I wish you the best.

It's a simple concept: "Trust, but verify." I have no idea why anyone would have a problem with that.

 

[mustanger]

I don't know if this counts as part of this thread or not. But last year I read in "Gun Digest" that Alliant was coming out with a black powder substitute. It was to be called "Black Dot". Suposed to be out last spring. So far, no one knows about it. I am still looking for it, and information about it. Maybe I am way behind the times. Don't know.

 

[mustanger]

OK, the question was, "Where do I find ". I just googled alliant powder, and found a link to thier "Black MZ" page.http://www.alliantpowder.com/products/powder/blackmz.aspx#east
This page has a store locater on the right side. Type in the zip code, then on the next page your town and state. It will tell you the closest, then at the bottom of that page. Hope this helps. ooops, don't have my watch on, that's left side of the page.

 

[alsaqr]

It was to be called "Black Dot". Suposed to be out last spring. So far, no one knows about it. I am still looking for it, and information about it. Maybe I am way behind the times. Don't know.

Black Dot was made by MDM, the owner of Black Mag3 powder. The so called factory was
a wreck waiting to happen. After an earlier wreck where a worker was badly burned when about three pounds of powder flashed; MDM refused to clean up its act. The place blew up in the spring of 2010. Two workers died in that explosion and fire. OSHA fined the company 1.2 million dollars.

http://www.osha.gov/dep/citations/blackmag.pdf

Black Mag3 surrendered its license to manufacture explosives:

http://www.safetynewsalert.com/business-closes-to-settle-1-2m-osha-fine/#more-11191

 

[beag_nut]

found it

Hi, just wanted to say that I finally found and bought the Black MZ black powder substitute from Alliant. Tried ten shots in my .44 New Army repro, and it worked fine. I used the same volume as a regular charge of 20 grains FFFG black powder. If anything, the recoil was a bit less, and the shots hit the paper a little higher. Cleaning up later was a litttle easier and not as messy. I have to ask Alliant why they advise the use of NO bullet lube, which I used anyway. The Black MZ is formulated in FFG grade, which worked fine in my revolver, in spite of it supposing to need FFFG (have tried regular FFG black powder in the past with no problems). Also, the grains of Black MZ are less uniform in size than FFG Goex black powder.
Cabela's had it in stock at their East Hartford store (what a zoo at this time of year). Regarding of what the Black MZ really is, the patent number on the jar is: 5,557,151, and made in Radford, VA.

 

[frontiergander]

Because lubes have moisture and American Pioneer powder sucks up moisture and weakens the powder.

 

[beag_nut]

"Because lubes have moisture and American Pioneer powder sucks up moisture and weakens the powder"

I don't think that is true, because Alliant makes a big deal about the Black MZ being extremely resistant to moisture, more than any other black powder or substitute. Anyway, I will ask them, and post their reply, if any.

When did American Pioneer become part of Alliant? Just wondering.

 

[Lunie]

"Because lubes have moisture and American Pioneer powder sucks up moisture and weakens the powder"

I don't think that is true, because Alliant makes a big deal about the Black MZ being extremely resistant to moisture, more than any other black powder or substitute. Anyway, I will ask them, and post their reply, if any.

When did American Pioneer become part of Alliant? Just wondering.

APP isn't part of Alliant, and it sounds like you are on the ball.

 

[frontiergander]

Alliant used APP to fill the cans. Its nothing special to be honest. I think if you shot it over a chronograph you'd find out how bad it really is. That stuff will suck up moisture, especially in places like Michigan.

 

[Lunie]

Alliant used APP to fill the cans. Its nothing special to be honest. I think if you shot it over a chronograph you'd find out how bad it really is. That stuff will suck up moisture, especially in places like Michigan.

If you want us to believe the world is flat, come forth with some proof. And I have no idea what the humidity is like in Michigan, or why that matters to anyone here?

Alliant has data on their website that shows that their powder is LESS moisture sensitive than 777 or Pyrodex. Doesn't sound like APP to me.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/products/powder/blackmz.aspx

 

[frontiergander]

well duh companies gotta make up stories in order to sell something. Sorta like powerbelt saying they are the hardest hitting bullets on the market.

Put some of that american....errr... Alliant black mz in a little bowl of water. It turns to mush. Do the same with Blackhorn209 and after a couple days, drain the water, put the granules on a paper towel to dry and go shoot it. Its the only real moisture proof powder out there.

 

[Lunie]

well duh companies gotta make up stories in order to sell something. Sorta like powerbelt saying they are the hardest hitting bullets on the market.

Put some of that american....errr... Alliant black mz in a little bowl of water. It turns to mush. Do the same with Blackhorn209 and after a couple days, drain the water, put the granules on a paper towel to dry and go shoot it. Its the only real moisture proof powder out there.

At first I just thought you were incredible, although now I'm beginning to wonder if that should be "un" or "non" credible instead.

At some point, you posted a link to your videos on Youtube. While almost no one seems to be watching them, I looked at a couple. Ok, so you want to be some sort of "hunting expert". That's fine, good luck with that.

But I noticed you have a lot of "sponsor" looking graphics at the beginning of your vids. Lo and behold, Blackhorn 209 is represented. But I'm sure your opinion is absolutely unbiased and your unflinching and unfounded accusations against competing products is just your "honest opinion."

Haha, what a joke. I'm not going to bother asking you again to prove what you claim, because you haven't in spite of my numerous requests.

I should've asked before... "What are you trying to sell?"

Sorry man, I think we are done here. Happily, the OP was able to find what he was looking for and in spite of all the circus, and even braving the crowds at Cabela's this time of year! I hope the stuff works great for you.

Happy shooting and Merry Christmas to all you folks!

 

[frontiergander]

If'n you knew what you were talking about you'd know for a fact that Blackhorn209 IS the best sub black powder on the market PERIOD.

Good luck getting 70 shots out of black mz without ever having to swab the bore!

Did you happen to see my American Pioneer video? Watch the velocity.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbEmDb8Oc-g&feature=related

I'll have to pick up some black mz and make a video of this repackaged, inconsistent granulation american pioneer powder.