Blackpowder cartridges in modern revolver

[Foto Joe]

Since my wife got me hooked on this Christmas day by giving me a '51 Conf. Navy from Cabelas I've started to rethink my priorities in life. One of which is why other than cleanliness would a person wish to shoot smokeless out of a BP cartridge, i.e. 45LC.

30 years ago I bought a Dakota Colt Buntline Special with a 12" barrel for coyote hunting. Pretty gun, shoots well enough but haven't put more than 200 rounds through it after giving up on dog hunting 25 years ago. But now that I've gotten bit by the black, I'm given' serious thought to loading 45LC in black powder when I get back to Wyoming in a month or so.

My reasoning is that Colt didn't have smokeless when the 45LC was put into production and that cartridge just wouldn't be happy unless it spits a few feet of flame and smoke out the barrel.

My question is: 2f or 3f and what really was the powder charge in a 45LC? Can somebody point me to the load data? I'm sure it's posted here somewhere but when it comes to reloading black powder it seems like the manufacturers have basically written us off.

 

[ClemBert]

Blackpowder cartridge reloading generally depends on the caliber with which you plan to load. Smaller than .45 then 2Fg. Larger than .45 then 3Fg. Basically, you are on the fence. You could use either one and I've read some folks use 2Fg and some 3Fg. Personally, I use 3Fg since that is what I had on hand anyways for cap-n-ball shooting. Something tells me that most folk lean 3Fg but I'm not 100% positive on that. Anyhow, me likes both 35 grains and 40 grains of 3Fg BP, then a 0.30 fiber wad, then a 250 grain RNFP bullet with Crisco/Beeswas lube in the groove. Use a compression plug for sure with 40 grain loads but the plug is handy for 35 grains too but not mandatory.

p.s. With that longer 12" barrel you are probably gonna want to go with 3Fg. I shoot my .45 Colts out of a 7 1/2" barreled ROA.

 

[RyanM]

One of which is why other than cleanliness would a person wish to shoot smokeless out of a BP cartridge, i.e. 45LC.

If you're sticking to the same "power" as BP ammo, cleanliness is the only reason.

If you read up on Dick Casull, though, looks like "insanity" is another reason.

Goex has load data. They seem to recommend their "cartridge FFg" for all cartridges. Not sure what makes that any different from regular FFg.

http://www.goexpowder.com/load-chart.html

In .45 Colt, a 247 gr bullet with 42 gr powder, or 255 gr bullet with 40 gr. From the velocities, it looks like they chronoed with a 4-5/8" barrel.

 

[EnsignJimmy]

If you're sticking to the same "power" as BP ammo, cleanliness is the only reason.

If you read up on Dick Casull, though, looks like "insanity" is another reason.

Goex has load data. They seem to recommend their "cartridge FFg" for all cartridges. Not sure what makes that any different from regular FFg.

http://www.goexpowder.com/load-chart.html

In .45 Colt, a 247 gr bullet with 42 gr powder, or 255 gr bullet with 40 gr. From the velocities, it looks like they chronoed with a 4-5/8" barrel.

They're also using 2F powder, which uses larger (slower-burning) grains. Forty grains of 2F (measured by volume) has a lot of airspace between those grains. Their load data will give you a pleasant, low-recoil "Cowboy Action" style load. To get the thunder and lightning the .45 Colt is capable of, you need to use 3F powder, which has smaller grains. However, the full-house BP .45 Colt does have surprisingly brisk recoil, especially in a relatively (compared to, say, a Ruger) lightweight gun like a Colt SAA.

 

[TheRodDoc]

ClemBert,

You have that backwards.
45 and smaller use 3fg. 45 and larger use 2fg.

 

[ClemBert]

TheRodDoc...I always was kind of backwards....I suspect I'm dislectic when writing rather than reading.

 

[RyanM]

They're also using 2F powder, which uses larger (slower-burning) grains. Forty grains of 2F (measured by volume) has a lot of airspace between those grains.

Not necessarily. Actually, fancy schmancy scientists have determined that spheres of any size will pack about 62.5%. Meaning if you dump a bunch of BBs or something in a container and pack it down as best as you can, you'll end up with a container of about 62.5% bbs and 37.5% air, no matter what the size of the BB is. The only place where size comes into play is at the edges, where the BBs touch the sides and bottom and top of the container.

BP grains aren't even close to spherical, of course. But even so, the difference in weight of a given volume charge of BP is very small, especially if you use a very tall powder trickler. And that difference all occurs at the edges of the container, not in the middle where 99% of the powder is.

The main difference between grain sizes is the area-to-volume ratio. Smaller grains have a higher ratio, and thus burn faster. The square-cube law is a big pain, but at least it's the reason why we don't have 2 foot long cockroaches!

 

[goon]

Button - I don't know about cleaning with vinegar but just to be clear, it is weak acid. If you clean a gun with it make sure you get all the vinegar off really well.
I've used it to put an artificial patina on things before and it WILL cause rust, no question about it.

 

[Savvy Jack]

Cleaning is easy with BP once you get set. Clean a smokeless gun to completely remove any petroleum based oils. Then use Ballistal full or mixed with water. I use 50/50 with initial cleaning then full for last coat. After a shoot I rinse in the sink, when the wife ain't home, or with a water hose if she is home. The I clean the bore with 50/50 or even submerge in a container filled with 50/50 mix. Blow off with air hose, swab barrel and wipe clean. Spray on light coat of full mixture Ballitol...DONE. After a shoot I place empty shells in a container with water. When I get home I pure in dish washing soap, let sit for 10 minutes, rinse, dry, tumble and reload.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gx-biisbdIg