Boy punished for T-shirt with gun image

[PointOneSeven]

I'm for free speech, but there's also common sense and tact. Just because you can do something doesn't mean you should.


Side note: I'm all for teaching gun safety and shooting to the younger folks, but 14 is a little young to be gung-ho with fighting / combat / personal defense / etc... I was doing paintball and bb-guns at that age, taking it too much farther than that might be unhealthy. Defense of the castle is the responsibility of the parents.

 

[Caimlas]

To me, that part is propaganda to support a war started over oil rights.

We do not get any of our oil out of Iraq. We do not even get a majority of our oil from the whole of the Middle East - most comes from Mexico.

Using your reasoning, we'd have been more likely to invade Venezuela or Mexico.

NEXT.

As for this specific case, the kid (and family) has done well in slapping the school with a lawsuit. Shame on the school for their "magical thinking". (I wonder if they similarly ban images of mary jane, suspending violators? For some reason, I doubt it.)

 

[Mr White]

Although I agree in principle with part of what you say, bloodedsky:

We invaded Iraq. And when the people there fight back, they become terrorists?

this isn't the place.

 

[nplant]

If the stated reason they wanted his shirt turned inside out was that the message was promoting violence towards humans, and that was against stated policy of the school, I see very little issue.

But according to the article, this was an issue over the image of a military sidearm. And if that's the true reason behind the detentions, then I think it's way far-fetched. Agree with Justin - it's a perfect example of Magical Thinking, followed by a moronic defense by the district's lawyer. (Heightened sensitivity? Are you kidding me?)

 

[Grizzly Adams]

If that's true, how does the school district condone the pictures of firearms in the history books it supplies its students?

Haven't you heard the school board has the authority to edit the history books and edit (censor) those disgusting pictures out!

 

[Roccobro]

The gun on the shirt doesn't bother me.

I feel uncomfortable with the idea of sporting a shirt that has "United States Terrorist Hunting Permit" on the back.

To me, that part is propaganda to support a war started over oil rights.

The Romans thought the Druids were terrorists when they decided to fight back. In particular, they wanted Boudica, Queen of the Iceni, dead--because she defended her homeland.

We invaded Iraq. And when the people there fight back, they become terrorists?

We instigated a civil war that had been brewing for a long, long time.

Sometimes I wonder if we aren't the global terrorists. The number of people we've subjugated, or funded the subjugation of (think of Guatemala in the 1980s), is nauseating. It really is.

Where do YOU get your information from? Not even CNN is that far from reality.

Anything past your first line is off topic and completely unnecessary for this kids 1A violation discussion.

Justin

 

[DoubleTapDrew]

I hope he prevails. This p****-whipped version of our schools has gone too far. As far as I know, none of these school shootings were conducted with assault t-shirts.

Maybe we should install v-chips in the brains of kids so if they utter or even think of a gun they'll be zapped, or just give em all lobotomies as a proactive measure.

 

[Robert Hairless]

I don't remember who it was, but one of our members once pointed out that instances like this are a perfect example of Magical Thinking. Specifically, the claim that a representation of a thing is, in fact, that thing.; in this case a representation of a firearm is a firearm.

That would be me.

I'm also the troublemaker who points out the armed man on the Massachusetts quarter, the references to and photographs of armed Americans in history books, the sharp pointy objects used in schools, and all the other things that endanger the safety of our children.

About that T-shirt .... I seem to recall that there have been cases in which students wearing unpopular garments have been held to be within the protection of the First Amendment's guarantee of free speech.

 

[alaskanativeson]

A shirt with a picture of a gun on it is not a threat. A picture of a soldier with a gun fighting a war isn't a threat. A student should be able to wear something like this because it shows nothing that is against the law and it even shows support for the military.

If I understand correct though, the T-shirt also makes an implication that civilians hunting terrorists is a good thing. Even if it's meant as a joke it's inapproporiate. Suggesting that a student can take the law into their own hands to kill those they disagree with is clearly wrong. Like it or not it isn't right to allow students to advocate something illegal.

 

[Lightsped]

I bet they would sure hate me and this tshirt....

 

[spaceCADETzoom]

[...]

To me, that part is propaganda to support a war started over oil rights.

The Romans thought the Druids were terrorists when they decided to fight back. In particular, they wanted Boudica, Queen of the Iceni, dead--because she defended her homeland.

We invaded Iraq. And when the people there fight back, they become terrorists?

We instigated a civil war that had been brewing for a long, long time.

Sometimes I wonder if we aren't the global terrorists. The number of people we've subjugated, or funded the subjugation of (think of Guatemala in the 1980s), is nauseating. It really is.

Having said this, I'd not have suspended him on the basis of his shirt. But that particular portion of his shirt disgusts me deeply.

Please take your... views.... over to APS.com. I have no desire to begin a... pointless... argument over here.

Well, I, for one, welcome his thoughts. AS much as I disagree, it's fairly closeminded to just shoo him away.

That said, I think the argument is a little knee-jerk. THink the war was wrong, disagree with US foreign policy? FIne. I might agree. But let's not throw away the meaning of "terrorist." THe US can't be "global terrorists," it CAN be oppressors, or some other similar pejorative. Terrorists target civilians, often indiscriminately, for the specific purpose of using terror for political reasons. It is asymmetric in nature, and not focused on attrition of forces as much as pushing agenda. Granted, war, by definition pushes political agenda, but soldiers, by definition, are used against other military threats. The US cannot, with all honesty, be labeled "terrorist," unless you are some deluded fool who simply wants to throw a pejorative around. Stick to globocop, jack booted thugs, et al. Can't call the US "global terrorist," that's silly.

As for the insurgents in Iraq. Notice, they're insurgents, not terrorists. Actual Iraqis that are targeting coalition (occupation) forces are insurgent by defintion, and if you notice they are NOT called "terrorists." Earlier in the occupation, and in some cases now, foreigners (i.e. Syrians) and Al Quaeda in IRaq, are indeed called "terrorists" by definition...often targeting Iraqi civilians. We never called Germans still fighting in occupied Berlin "terrorists," or on the other side of the coin, French partisans weren't either. The IRA is terrorist. Hamas...etc...It's all about who's the target and what's the tool (i.e. is it "terror" itself, or guns and bombs?). Hijack a plane to free prisoners? terrorist. Blow up a convoy of occupation troops in your backyard? Insurgent. Invade a country and set up shop? Invader, aggressor, occupier, whatever....it's not terrorist.

 

[spaceCADETzoom]

I feel uncomfortable with the idea of sporting a shirt that has "United States Terrorist Hunting Permit" on the back.

Isn't that the issue here? WHo cares if you're uncomfortable.? Soccer moms and school admins are "uncomfortable" with the picture of the gun. SOme on this thread are "uncomfortable" with anything remotely critical of American foreign policy. Both are wrong to try and stifle...

 

[Stinger]

Courts have ruled that schools have the right to set dress codes. They don't touch what is and is not allowed under the dress codes. This is a no-win situation for the family that will cost them thousands of dollars, and it will cost the tax payers thousands of dollars as well. If you don't like the dress code you have options: change it, move, home school, etc.

 

[Magnum.35744]

The school board can stick that shirt up there for all I care.

It's just a shirt... a Harmless shirt....

 

[jaholder1971]

The gun on the shirt doesn't bother me.

I feel uncomfortable with the idea of sporting a shirt that has "United States Terrorist Hunting Permit" on the back.

To me, that part is propaganda to support a war started over oil rights.

The Romans thought the Druids were terrorists when they decided to fight back. In particular, they wanted Boudica, Queen of the Iceni, dead--because she defended her homeland.

We invaded Iraq. And when the people there fight back, they become terrorists?

We instigated a civil war that had been brewing for a long, long time.

Sometimes I wonder if we aren't the global terrorists. The number of people we've subjugated, or funded the subjugation of (think of Guatemala in the 1980s), is nauseating. It really is.

Having said this, I'd not have suspended him on the basis of his shirt. But that particular portion of his shirt disgusts me deeply.

This Bovine Scatology needs to go to moveon.org, seriously.

 

[Robert Hairless]

bloodedsky:

I feel uncomfortable with the idea of sporting a shirt that has "United States Terrorist Hunting Permit" on the back.

To me, that part is propaganda to support a war started over oil rights.

The Romans thought the Druids were terrorists when they decided to fight back. In particular, they wanted Boudica, Queen of the Iceni, dead--because she defended her homeland.

We invaded Iraq. And when the people there fight back, they become terrorists?

We instigated a civil war that had been brewing for a long, long time.

Sometimes I wonder if we aren't the global terrorists. The number of people we've subjugated, or funded the subjugation of (think of Guatemala in the 1980s), is nauseating. It really is.

Having said this, I'd not have suspended him on the basis of his shirt. But that particular portion of his shirt disgusts me deeply.

Don't let other opinions here get you down, Bloodedsky. I think that it's important for everyone to know what offends and disgusts you and to respect your feelings. I can see that you respect other people's feelings too.

We can't do anything to get that young fellow to change his T-shirt but we certainly can respect each other's feelings here.

So I know you'll respect my dislike for that quotation from "Song of Myself" in your signature. It offends me deeply to see it cheapened that way. I'm also greatly disturbed by the use of signatures in general. I find them irritating and a waste of my time as well as of Internet bandwidth.

Be a good lad and remove it immediately. Don't argue with me: it upsets me when people don't agree with me. Thank you for respecting my feelings. Freedom of speech is a collective right, not an individual right.

 

[Rachen]

sad thing is if he wore a t shirt with a picture of a revoloutionary soldier holding a musket this probably wouldnt have happened.

they were just scared of the evil looking rifle.

No. Don't be mistaken. Any kind of firearm is the target of the antis. It doesn't matter if it's made whenever.

Now what the antis are mistaken is that there are a lot more things that are more dangerous, and effective than guns. For example, my Wushu Lao Shi taught me how a simple bamboo staff that a peasant uses to carry rice to the market can be used to absolutely break someone's spine so thoroughly he/she wouldn't even be able to utter a sound. A simple bamboo staff, the same one that I stick outside my window so laundry can be hanged out to dry.

Get the picture?

Now, that boy should be given a real applause for having the courage to stand up to administrative bullying. If someone had told me to turn my shirt inside out, any school, any school staff, I would have told them FU right to their faces.
The shirt he was wearing was pretty funny, I see them for sale many places around NYC. The Iraq and "terrorist hunting" thing I don't care much about. I am not for the war, and the war was for oil anyway. But still, kudos to that kid and a future Patriot.

 

[denfoote]

I hope they sue for at least a billion dollars. The only way to stop these liberals is to use their tactics right back at them. Hit 'em in the wallet...hard!!

 

[Nimitz]

im young...just turned 20. and I got some hastle at my high school for bringing guns&ammo magazine to class, the "security guards" escorted me down to the office and started questioning me as if I had just committed a heinous crime.

this was post sept. 11th and post columbine

I was threatened with a suspension but they didn't follow thru, I continued to bring the magazines to school to read at lunch or in the library.

Chad

 

[jackdanson]

Wow, people really get their panties in a knot if you don't tow the conservative line here.

I know our guys work hard and risk their lives over there, but not everyone agrees with the course of action taken by the leaders in government. The inherent "evilness" of war (on both sides) is not something to be taken lightly. If I was an Iraqi and had family members killed by accidental fire, there is no doubt that I could become an insurgent or "T". Of course I would be happy that saddam was gone.. ahhhhahhh very complex issue.

 

[Zundfolge]

Well, I, for one, welcome his thoughts. AS much as I disagree, it's fairly closeminded to just shoo him away.

No its not closeminded to keep a firearms forum on the subject of firearms ... OT stuff like expounding on the evils of bush-hitler and such BELONG on APS (the sister forum to this site ... well maybe more of the red headed stepchild of this site, not the sister).

Wow, people really get their panties in a knot if you don't tow the conservative line here.

No, people get their panties in a knot if you try to go off topic here ... this is a FIREARMS forum, not a political one ... again take it to APS. Thats what its there for.

Anyway, someone needs to get this kid a shirt that says something like "The Second insures the First" or something equally "dangerous".

 

[keeleon]

I have been trying to get the librarian at my elementary school to carry Guns and Ammo for a while, and she just doesn't seem to want to. I also asked one of the administrators, smartassedly, when the last gun safety assembly was. Of course the answer was never, because it would "encourage the children to get into and play with their parent's guns." I then asked when the last drug awareness assembly was, "3 Months ago". I don't see a double standard there, do you?

 

[Crunker1337]

The poor terrorists... come on guys, show some sympathy!

 

[JColdIron]

I also asked one of the administrators, smartassedly, when the last gun safety assembly was. Of course the answer was never, because it would "encourage the children to get into and play with their parent's guns." I then asked when the last drug awareness assembly was, "3 Months ago". I don't see a double standard there, do you?

I like the way you think!

 

[highfive]

this sounds so familiar for me... I had a problem with a teacher at my daughter's school, for a shirt i was wearing, which says, "Guns don't kill people, Dad's with pretty daughters do" And that lady went all nuts because of my shirt. i know I talked to everybody because of that teacher's behavior. it brings back memories