Bushmaster vs DPMS Carbon 15

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rugerman07

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Are these 2 AR's a good, quality, weapon? Would you consider them to be an entry level AR? Is the Bushmaster better than the DPMS or vice versa?

One thing I don't like about either is they don't have iron sights so you have to add optics. The Bushmaster comes with a small battery powered optic, the DPMS doesn't. I don't like battery powered optics, especially on a rifle with no iron sights.

I'm looking to buy a new AR and would like to keep the cost in $800 to under range. Any suggestions?

Another option I'm considering is, I have a Saiga Sporter AK, 223, with a 20 inch barrel I might trade in on a new AR. What would you consider a fair trade price for the Saiga?
 
I wouldn't buy a Carbon 15...ever. No issue with polymer lowers here but not a Carbon 15.

I do have a DPMS in the safe. Their bottom end SportiCal. It runs quite well. Not bad at all for a $590 rifle.
 
For a quality, budget rifle I don't think you can beat Palmetto State Armory right now. I just bought a complete mid-length upper with F post sight for $400, a complete lower with MOE grip and STR stock for $200 and then finished it off with Vortex Strikefire red dot and PSA rear flip sight for $125. Great rifle for $724. You can actually build them cheaper too if you want. Not really a fan of Bushmaster or DPMS.
 
PSA has complete rifles for sale right now for 550 bucks. I'd buy that over a Bushmaster carbon 15 or just about any DPMS.
 
Avoid the Carbon series rifles from most any company. They are plain and simply known for breaking under any significant or accidental use (drop one and it will likely break at the buffer tube or the barrel extension). You can get a decent AR from places like PSA for around $650 that weigh in at about 6lbs.
 
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I have had, and still have several Bushmasters, spanning almost 2 decades. Quality control and consistency has been pretty inconsistent. I've replaced two of four uppers outright after multiple issues.

I've not had a PSA, but folks are saying good things, and the price is right. You might also want to look at Windham ... the former (original) Bushmaster team in Maine, before BM was bought out and relocated.

Also, if you hunt around, you might be able to find some good deals. For just $100-$150 more than a Bushmaster, CDNN has a Colt 6720 Lightweight.
 
I bought the Bushmaster Carbon 15 for my 13 year old daughter. It could also be a self defense home weapon. I did not buy it for abuse or for the "apocolypse". For what its worth, its good enough for fun and nothing else. It's very light and looks like at toy until you shoot it. The recoil is remarkbly light compared to a regular AR15 - must be the plastic lower. I like it and so does my daughter.
 
BP Hunter said:
I bought the Bushmaster Carbon 15 for my 13 year old daughter. It could also be a self defense home weapon. I did not buy it for abuse or for the "apocolypse". For what its worth, its good enough for fun and nothing else. It's very light and looks like at toy until you shoot it. The recoil is remarkbly light compared to a regular AR15 - must be the plastic lower. I like it and so does my daughter.
Click to expand...

Interesting observation about recoil but I can't buy it. I don't see how the composite lower could reduce recoil enough that you would feel any difference. In fact if you think about it the lower mainly holds things in place so the hammer can strike the firing pin and the bolt carrier can recoil back into the receiver extension. Recoil is mostly felt as the carrier slams back into the receiver extension and drives the attached stock into your shoulder.

The lighter lower just plays in to the fact that, given the same ammo, a lighter rifle will recoil harder than a heavier rifle. Polymer frames on a pistol can soak up recoil though, since the frame recoils directly into the hand. Maybe she's feeling the shove of the pistol grip against her hand?

ETA:
Anyway, I go along with the recommendations of PSA over Bushmaster and DPMS. (However, their cheaper PTAC line is probably about the same as DPMS, etc.)
 
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In your price range I would go PSA, or Aim Surplus has a nice Spikes Tactical midlength for 799. In my opinion Spikes is a better quality rifle then the DPMS or Bushmaster.
 
I have a low end DPMS that I have had for a few years. It was naked on top like the one you mentioned but you can always buy a carry handle or optic. I probably have 5-6k rounds of any ammo I happened to have at the time that have gone through the barrel and it has been nearly flawless. The only issue I have seen is that it does not like to run a fully loaded mag but works fine if I download by 1 round. Rather than spend a lot of time trying to figure out the problem I simply don't fully load the mags. I think it was $579 or so when I bought it in Birmingham.

I also have a Colt and a PSA build. Both are better but both cost more. For MY purposes it wasn't worth the extra money since I just use them for plinking.
 
The PSA isn't going to cost more than a DPMS and is better quality. You could put together a complete blem classic lower for $150 and complete chrome moly/chrome lined barrel upper for $360. Total cost With shipping and ffl about $560. That's what I'd do.
 
I knid of thought so

Not trying to overplug the S&W but it really has it all...you don't have to mix, match anything, it is very very well made and has the longevity reputation. And for that price, you get a complete AR, the lock, the G2 Mag ..no fuss no muss..lol
 
I'll add my experience and opinion as a long term S&W M&P Sport owner who's also owned Colt, DPMS, Olympic, CMMG, Daniel Defense, Noveske, and LMT. I also have experience in a local gun shop service department (essentially armorer level assisting the gunsmith as needed) with Bushmaster, Rock River, Stag, Del-Ton, and probably a few others.

The sum of that experience is this: For a roughly $600 factory built rifle with a warranty the M&P Sport is the best buy on the market. S&W ditched the dust cover and forward assist, but still does individual HPT/MPI on their bolts, and uses a nitride barrel treatment. Nitrided barrels have the durability of hard chrome lining, but they don't lose accuracy from minute thickness variations in the chrome lining. My experience is that S&W also builds the M&P rifles better than Bushmaster and DPMS build their .223/5.56 size rifles. If I were buying for myself I'd order parts from PSA and BCM and assemble exactly what I want. However, I also bought the Sport when I wanted a low priced yet quality, factory built, warranted, basic rifle. So I definitely understand the appeal of a ready to go out of the box factory built rifle.


(I've also said it before, but the DPMS .308/7.62 NATO size rifles are quite well built, and completely better quality than their .223 / 5.56 size rifles. But that's for another thread.)
 
Ugararguy....

And you will be the guy I reach out to when I am ready to move to the .308 :D

The advice I got here on the Sport was SPOT ON...could not be happier.
 
I'd avoid the Bushmaster and DPMS if you can. At that price point you can do better.

My recommendations for the $600 price range:

1. PSA AR15. They have the Freedom complete rifle for $599. Or you can buy a complete lower + complete upper of your choice.

2. Smith and Wesson M&P15 Sport.

I've owned AR's from both companies and highly recommend them over Bushmaster or DPMS.

If you can add a little more, say $200-400 to get into the $800-1000 range, get a Spikes Tactical ($800) or Colt6920 ($1000).
 
I bought the Bushmaster Carbon 15 for my 13 year old daughter. It could also be a self defense home weapon. I did not buy it for abuse or for the "apocolypse". For what its worth, its good enough for fun and nothing else. It's very light and looks like at toy until you shoot it. The recoil is remarkbly light compared to a regular AR15 - must be the plastic lower. I like it and so does my daughter.
Click to expand...

No, the recoil will not be lighter on the Carbon15.

That might be a subjective view, but there's no way a lighter rifle like the Bushmaster C15 will have less recoil than an AR15 with aluminum receivers. You are probably referring to how light the rifle feels overall.

Yes, I've shot a friend's Bushmaster Carbon15. The recoil felt about the same as my aluminum AR's (Spikes, Colt, etc).
 
I purchased a Bushmaster carbine several years ago, before they got bought out from whoever and moved out. I've got several thousand rounds thru it with out any problems whatever, no ftf, fte, etc in all those rounds. Further it is one of the most accurate .223/556 out there. I don't understand why everyone is bashing the Bushmaster.

Granted I don't own a new BM but how could a new company screw up a really fine rifle.

A couple of years ago I built a AR-15 using A-1 upper and a CMG lower with a 20" SS Bull barrel now that is one accurate rifle and the cost at the time was under $800. In fact the Timney trigger cost right at a quarter of the total cost.
 
I think the issues mentioned

Are the new company. From what I read, it is QC type issues. Slapped together, not staked, FTF, etc.

everyone with the older ones have had no issues with 1000's of rounds...

Sometimes when a company sells out, its just not the same..

I also read some of the new ones are perfect...some not...and therein lies the risk...
 
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