Business owner surprises me!

[rainbowbob]

...he has the forsight to know that she wouldnt be a good candidate for a gun or carry license.

Again, with due respect, that isn't foresight so much as an acknowledgement of her irresponsible CHOICE not get her hands dirty.

With few exceptions, anyone that chooses to take the responsibility and is willing to get the training will be a good candidate for CCW.

Minds can be changed, and this could be a good opportunity to change one.

 

[Larry Ashcraft]

Off topic, but it's illegal to carry in WalMart in New Mexico?

 

[stchman]

She should get her own CCW and protect herself. I guess she figures you are going to protect her.

 

[whalerman]

Rainbow, I'm totally confused. You say your wife "hates" guns, but makes a point of asking you if you have yours when you are in a "sketchy" part of town. That logic, or lack of, makes about as much sense as hating the car that brought you to that part of town. Or the people you knew that you were visiting that made you drive that way. Sit down with her and have a long talk.

And that boss of yours. Don't put yourself in jeapardy. Anyone with as inconsistant a mindset as her is not someone to defend in a violent situation. Tell her to just talk to whoever tries to rob her. That will be enough to scare anyone away.

 

[LibShooter]

I also can say, if someone came in here, brandishing a weapon, demanding we give them all our money, jewelry, and a 5K plasma monitor or two and I had to put them down. No cop or lawyer in their right mind is going to make themselves look stupid in a CCW OC legal state and try to take me to court over it.

This is getting a little scary. That sounds a little like you may be asked to shoot a guy over money, jewelry and electronics. That's not what a Concealed Carry permit is for. The CCW is to be used to protect your LIFE and that of others.

If your boss is looking for someone to protect the company's stuff, she needs to hire a trained and bonded security guard.

So I say carry your weapon, but don't get between a crack head and the plasma monitor he wants turn into drugs.

 

[Justin Holder]

Sounds like you need to enlighten her as to the legal issues of CCW. Just because you have a gun doesn't make you a security guard for the business.

There is a word for this kind of person: HYPOCRITE

Oh, how the sheeple bleat for the sheep dog when the wolves appear!

 

[rainbowbob]

Rainbow, I'm totally confused...That logic, or lack of, makes about as much sense as hating the car that brought you to that part of town. Or the people you knew that you were visiting that made you drive that way. Sit down with her and have a long talk.

You're confused? Have you ever been married? Where did you get the idea that logic has anything to do with it?

Trust me...we've had plenty of long talks on the subject. That's how I got her to the point where she at least recognizes the need for ME to carry a firearm.


By-the-way...the "sketchy part of town" I referred to is a district of high dollar condos downtown where we attended a classical concert - also infested with street dealers and muggers.

 

[Arkansas Paul]

Lawyers would have a major event with this if you ever got in a shoot out.

If you have a permit and are carrying legally, they're not going to have any more of a major event than normal.
I think most are missing the point. He won't be carrying to just protect her. He'll be protecting HIMSELF as well. That's probably even the reason he got a CCW in the first place. Imagine that.
She didn't say, "Stand here with your gun and shoot anybody who tries to steal something." That's what it's being made to sound like. I would welcome the opportunity to carry on the job. I would, as suggested, get it in writing that it is permitted though.
KodiakBeer, that's pretty funny.

 

[toycruiser71]

I agree with SniperX. There are some people out there that have no business with a CCW. It isn't about political opinion, it is about mindset. My sister is one I would have serious concerns about. Maybe one at home for self defense, but not in public. She would freak, brandish it, then they would take it from her and either beat her with it or shoot her. And sorry, I've known her for 45 years, no amount of training is going to change that. If he has known this person for 15 years, and he is ccw and knows what it is all about, he would know best if it is something she should go for.

 

[Bobarino]

No cop or lawyer in their right mind....

And therein lies the flaw in your logic.

 

[RhinoDefense]

Ask for a raise. Nevermind, DEMAND a raise.

Money = gun.

You want me to carry? Pay up.

 

[DustyVermonter]

Quote: "Money = gun. You want me to carry? pay up". I'd tell her that I'm gonna need a Kimber Ultra Covert II ($1300) for optimum effectiveness in a Business owner defense situation

 

[Sam1911]

Being allowed to carry as you choose is wonderful!

It would be very good to have this in writing somewhere, especially if your company has some kind of a written guide or handbook. If it's a very small firm and everything is just word of mouth, well, that will have to do.

It is also VERY important that she does not expect you to be armed security for the company in general -- and especially not for "goods."

This sounds good:

She said it was because she is kinda freaked out about all the shootings of late and is a little worried that in this eco we are due for a armed robbery, instead of just a burglary.

Being concerned for your life (and hers) is a valid reason to consider carrying, and being prepared to use violence if absolutely necessary.

This does NOT sound quite so good:

I also can say, if someone came in here, brandishing a weapon, demanding we give them all our money, jewelry, and a 5K plasma monitor or two and I had to put them down.

Yes, if they are brandishing a gun you should have plenty of legal justification for shooting, but if they're going to take some (insured, company-owned) stuff and leave, you probably don't have to. NOT shooting someone is better than shooting someone -- unless you (or maybe she) will DIE or suffer grievous injury if you don't.

Further, your scenario involves drawing "to a drawn gun." That is almost always a losing proposition. (Not to get too deep into the tactics of a completely hypothetical situation.)

This is a good thing, on the face of it, but you need to first sit down and consider exactly WHY and WHEN you would draw your gun, and second you need to talk that over with her. If she knows you are armed then she needs to understand and be on-board with your well-thought-out defensive mindset.

If armed criminals are walking out the door with your nifty monitor, the last thing in the world you need is her yelling, "SHOOT THEM! SHOOT THEM!"

 

[CZ223]

I think it is great

that she has that kind of confidence in you. I really don't get all the concern over this though. You are licenced to carry in your state and the owner has never prohibited you from carrying at work. You are pretty much good to go. As far as asking for money to carry at work I think you might be setting yourself up. Right now you are being paid to do whatever it is that you do and, despite your conversation, you are not "required" to protect anyone but yourself, should an armed robbery or worse occur. If you accept payment for carrying at work, I think it could be implied that you are required to protect others.

Since you seem to be on good terms with her, I think a friendly conversation might be in order. I might start by saying something like " I appreciate your confidence in me but, please understand, I am not a Security guard." If something were to occur I would do everything possible to protect myself and those around me but, that is an obligation that I place on myself. After that you could casualy mention that training and shooting are expensive and while you wish you could afford more of both, money is tight. You might even mention that "Name Brand Gun course" that you have been wanting to take for years. If she offers to pay for anyting or give you a raise, great. If not, oh well. If she does pay for a course just gently remind her that this still doesn't make you her personal security guard but it might make you better prepared.

 

[danprkr]

I had another thought on this one. I have friend that I've known for 30+ years. We met during high school. All during high school and well after college he was anti gun. He thought no guns = safety. Well then he had his first child. A beautiful girl who is now about to turn 16 giving him a whole new set of worries.

But that's off topic so back to the topic. She was about 3 months old when he heard something go bump in the night. Turned out it was the neighbors coming home late for some reason, but it scared him. They lived just far enough out that response times would have been long. So, I get the call, I teach him to shoot, and even give him a .357 I had. Fast forward 20 years, and he's got nicer toys than I do. Maybe not as many, but much nicer - the jerk.

My point is that fear is a great motivator, and in this case I used it to make a convert. I know others have made this point, but I thought I'd throw in on that one also.

Also, keep in mind that most states license security guards. If they find you acting in that capacity without a license you may both wind up in trouble.

PS - he still has that original .357 which for some reason makes me feel good.

 

[uspJ]

I'd happily agree to carry at work, but make it perfectly clear to her that if she expects me to act in any way as a security guard, body guard etc. a substantial pay raise would be in order.

 

[Sam1911]

she expects me to act in any way as a security guard, body guard etc. a substantial pay raise would be in order.

... and company insurance for me as such, survivor benefits, practical training as to how to do that job correctly, legal training as to how to do that job LEGALLY, an official job description explaining what you're supposed to do, when, and how, whatever credentials your state requires for such work, etc...

If you are acting as a private individual using force to defend your own life in the "gravest extreme," fine.

If you are an employee, PAID to secure company personnel and/or property with a lethal weapon, you need a lot more than just her request or you put yourself at grave risk.

 

[shockwave]

<Deleted -- Sam>

If you CCW, then you probably want to carry at work. Now you have formal permission to do so without risking your employment. So go ahead. Carry at work for the reasons you normally carry. There is nothing whatsoever in this situation that requires you to be "office security." In fact, all of this seems to be a total non-issue.

 

[happycamper374]

<Deleted -- Sam>

I'm surprised at the negative responses to this woman's statement. We seem to be assuming the worst here. <Deleted -- Sam> anti gunner who just wants someone else to do the work for her and not get her hands dirty. I think we're getting too wrapped up in politics. We know how many resources, both time and money, it takes to become a responsible CCW'er and that it shouldn't be taken lightly. Now, OP should probably have another conversation with the owner about how CCW'ing and being a security guard are different, but she seems to just find it comforting that someone is carrying. The OP seems to be ok with this and has know the woman for years. I think everyone can be happy here without demonizing any participant.

 

[Sam1911]

I'm surprised at the negative responses to this woman's statement.

I can't say I'm surprised, but I don't think her motives are necessarily improper or preadtory. There are many people who are neither physically nor mentally prepared to carry or use a defensive weapon. It may be a sign of some self-awareness and intelligence if she realizes and accepts that she's in that position. If she's also honest and logical enough to accept that the dangers are real and that she could benefit from assistance, kudos to her. Much better than the "I can't do anything about it so it doesn't exist" mindset many people work with.

I do think the situation is fraught with more danger/risk that she, and perhaps Sniper X, considered at the outset.

 

[tkopp]

I'd go ahead and carry. What concerns her with respect to the neighborhood ought also concern you. Just make it very clear up front that you're carrying to preserve life, not property. You are not security, you are not police, and generally it's cheaper and safer to give up some small amount of cash or an item from the showroom than to incur the liability by pulling a firearm.

 

[e2cTrainer]

It dosn't surprise me at all. Lay offs are taken extra hard in this economy and some people can't mentally handle that. I got laid off a long time ago and was going through knee surgery recovery and it was rough for almost a year

It does make you wonder after these events if someone was packing, would they have made the right moves? or moved at all?

 

[SWDoc]

What tkopp said. Additionally, I'd have a discussion w/ her about not "outing" xsniper if some Does GO down. Seriously, turning to him and saying something like "DO SOMETHING!" could make it more difficult for everyone to get out unhurt.

Steve

 

[SSN Vet]

Though not surprised, I am dissappointed that so many cop the "let the liberal rot" attitude. Perhaps a reading of the parable of the good Samaritan might be in order.

Also, as usual, many who live in a restrictive state are very quick to point out the legal ramifications about using deadly force in another state that is more free than their own. I don't know what the deal is in NM, but several states DO allow the use of deadly force to protect ones property.... even outside the confines of their house. There are certainly points of morality worthy of debate when it comes to using deadly force to protect ones property, but over and over again, unimformed folks on this board attack the legality of doing such in far away states.

I say BZ for Sniper-X stepping up to the plate and being "willing" to carry at work. I suspect that he understands when deadly force is justified. To many times, armed robbers decide to kill the witnesses (or worse) b4 they depart.

I would just look for an opportunity to "instruct" your boss about what YOU are willing to do and not to do.

I wouldn't ask for a raise, but rather, let this one little detail be a job security factor.

 

[jbrown50]

I get to work yesterday and the owner of the business I work for asks me if it would be too much trouble to bring my CCW gun in to work everyday!

I don't see what the big deal is here. She didn't order him to carry or insist that he do anything out of the ordinary. He has a permit and the boss has asked that he carry at work. Making it clear that he's not a security guard is all that he should do.

<Deleted -- Sam>