Convince me that a .380 is in the arena with a 38 spl

[Gun Master]

What .38 was used against the Moros?

The .38 Long Colt was inadequate against the Moros, and lead to the development of the .38 Special in 1898, and ultimately the Colt 1911 .45 ACP. The first S&W Military & Police (M&P), AKA Model 10, was introduced in 1899.

 

[R.W.Dale]

It doesn't matter how deep it penetrates, it is where you place it.

Sure it does.

Penetration is simply another plane of shot placement.

If your bullet misses from lack of penetration it's STILL a miss

 

[huntsman]

If I'm walking out the door and my .380 Auto (dbl stack Browning BDA 380) is sitting there right next to my 2" S&W Model 60 .38 Special (5 shots)... which one do I grab to put in a coat pocket?

The 2" Smith. It will never, ever fail and there is less doubt about the bullet doing what it's supposed to do.

14 vs 5 ? come on it's not like you're choosing a bigbore or mag over the .380 or is that little snub full of magic bullets

 

[Gun Master]

9x17mm Facts & Question

The 9 mm short has filled many a grave in this world. Who would be willing to stand in the path of one? That about says it all in my book!

1st sentence: Name a couple or more. The 2nd sentence: Is this an IQ test, or a trick question? Short book, IMHO.

Also, please see post #99.

 

[xXxplosive]

I find it amazing that Cirillo states in his books the 9mm is the bare minimum anyone would want to carry and to him that was being under-gunned. He didn't like the 9mm standard round at all and that's coming from the "Boss" himself..IMO....and you fellas are talking about the .380.
Well, I own one also but only carry it in the summer when nothing else is applicable and only as a last resort.

 

[RetiredUSNChief]

Oh, the ceaseless bickering and endless debates over caliber wars!

Let's either:

A. Pick two totally different calibers and pit them against each other over which is "better".

OR

B. Pick two similar calibers but radically different cartridges and pit them against each other over which is "better".


If there were ever a crowd of people who would make arguing apples and oranges such a passionate pastime, it would be gun owners. It's almost as endless as comic book geeks and SciFi geeks arguing with their incessant "Who would win?" scenarios.


Just for giggles, I think I should develop a new round called the "9 mm Ultra-Magnum God Slayer" using a necked down 20 X 102 mm round casing. Then I'll pit it against against the ".380 Hyper-Shock Fusion Impactor Round", made using a necked down 30 X 173 mm round casing. Both will be fired from the new autonomous, recoilless Quantum AI guided personal defense weapon system with superconducting thin-film active cloaking technology and endless repeater magazines.

The winner gets to go against the handgun round of your choice.

 

[Vodoun da Vinci]

Oh, the ceaseless bickering and endless debates over caliber wars!

Exactly. Why does it always degrade into "My dog is bigger than your dog!!" :banghead:

There is no such thing as a magic bullet...no, I wouldn't wanna get shot with one....yes, penetration does matter...yes a bigger caliber bullet is better....yes expansion and hollow points can be better....yes it's all about placement...yes it is about energy....yes the barrel is short....yes, it has more rounds.....yes it can jam or malfunction.

No. Bigger and bigger and bigger and more and more and more is not the answer to every question about guns.

Shoot the biggest caliber you can master and have with you when you need a gun. No matter what, the .38 Special is an awessome choice. No matter what the .380 is an awesome choice. Are there better choices? Maybe - it depends. Are there worse choices? Maybe - it depends. Shoot 'em if ya got 'em.

VooDoo

 

[RetiredUSNChief]

At least the OP started it off right with "This is a light-hearted thread." Too many people too serious about it!

As for me...I'm working up a det cord loading for my new 9 mm Ultra-Magnum God Slayer Round and the .380 Hyper-Shock Fusion Impactor Round. My calculations show that the terminal ballistics on these bullets ought to have them reaching escape velocities with the proper loading.

No worries about excessive chamber pressures with this loading. The autonomous, recoilless Quantum AI guided personal defense weapon system with superconducting thin-film active cloaking technology and endless repeater magazines is constructed using Adamantium and can weather out the full fury of a thermonuclear explosion.

Which will be my next experimental loading...multi-megaton fusion charges. I should be able to push the bullets right up to the light speed barrier on that one.

 

[JRWhit]

I'm working up a det cord loading for my new 9 mm Ultra-Magnum God Slayer Round and the .380 Hyper-Shock Fusion Impactor Round. My calculations show that the terminal ballistics on these bullets ought to have them reaching escape velocities with the proper loading.

Yeah but what will they do out of a 2" barrel?



Hey, all in all this is just "board" people talking.

 

[SharpsDressedMan]

They appear to both be in the arena, and can run in the race, but are slightly different breeds of horses.

 

[Gun Master]

Maybe Slightly Off Course ?

I think we all could benefit re-reading the original question in post # 1.

 

[charlie echo]

38 Special will win that comparison

"....38 Special will win that comparison every time," well said by VooDoo. And if my non-athletic wife can shoot 158 grain +Ps fine than it's hard to imagine all but the most elderly or frail that can not enjoy it with proper attitude, instruction, and practice.

Maybe it's because my wife's dad was a cop had helped her with forming positive attitude about enjoying shooting 38S and 44RM.

IMO, a 380 is a strong man's handy pistol who can continue to physically "persuade" after the clip's empty even after making hits on target.

 

[LCPor9mm]

I feel naked without my 12 gauge

"Convince me that the 380 auto is in the same arena as the 38 special."

Using modern ammunition, both calibers penetrate sufficiently to hit vitals and stop a threat.
Convinced???

 

[Vodoun da Vinci]

"....38 Special will win that comparison every time," well said by VooDoo. And if my non-athletic wife can shoot 158 grain +Ps fine than it's hard to imagine all but the most elderly or frail that can not enjoy it with proper attitude, instruction, and practice.

Please read post #24 entirely for my views on this - I do not agree. Even I struggle to get accurate and fast hits with a .38 Special out of a 2" barrel revolver in .38 Special. My Wife cannot shoot a .38 revolver unless it is a full size all steel S&W model 19 (which is a .357 mag!!) or bigger. It beats the snot out of her.

My point is that by the time I dumbed the .38 down to the point she could get rapid and accurate hits with it, it was a pale comparison to using a .380.

If you take recoil and controllability out of the equation the .38 wins a brute force comparison over a .380. If we take practicality into account in the group that I train with and compare notes with no one chooses a .38 over a .380 for CCL. They can't manage the recoil until the guns get too big to carry. Some of us larger and more experienced males can choose a .38 special with full house +P's but the majority (in the group I hang with) are far better off with a .380 because they give up a little in brute force but gain 2 -3 extra rounds and the ability to place rapid and accurate follow ups and train for a sufficient length of time without shooting fatigue like numb hands from the recoil.

VooDoo

 

[camsdaddy]

I think we can justify anything we set our mind to. Any round will be almost as good as the next and a little better than the past.

 

[jimbo555]

Either caliber can work. Recoil depends on platform, a 9 ounce 3pat might feel more recoil than a more powerful detective special than weighs 3x as much.

 

[Gun Master]

.380 & .38 Special Arena

"Convince me that the 380 auto is in the same arena as the 38 special."

Using modern ammunition, both calibers penetrate sufficiently to hit vitals and stop a threat.
Convinced???

The .380 and the .38 Special are in the same arena. Trouble is, the .380 is in the grandstands, while the .38 Special is on the floor performing. Please see chart at post # 81. Both are powerful protectors .

The Remington R51 appears to be a new contender for both, including varying power, but excluding slightly larger size and a small amount of added weight. We shall see.

PS: I've got my 12 ga. pump and SKS close by, and the Model 10 by the nightstand.

 

[Gun Master]

.380 vs .38 Special

Please read post #24 entirely for my views on this - I do not agree. Even I struggle to get accurate and fast hits with a .38 Special out of a 2" barrel revolver in .38 Special. My Wife cannot shoot a .38 revolver unless it is a full size all steel S&W model 19 (which is a .357 mag!!) or bigger. It beats the snot out of her.

My point is that by the time I dumbed the .38 down to the point she could get rapid and accurate hits with it, it was a pale comparison to using a .380.

If you take recoil and controllability out of the equation the .38 wins a brute force comparison over a .380. If we take practicality into account in the group that I train with and compare notes with no one chooses a .38 over a .380 for CCL. They can't manage the recoil until the guns get too big to carry. Some of us larger and more experienced males can choose a .38 special with full house +P's but the majority (in the group I hang with) are far better off with a .380 because they give up a little in brute force but gain 2 -3 extra rounds and the ability to place rapid and accurate follow ups and train for a sufficient length of time without shooting fatigue like numb hands from the recoil.

VooDoo

Voo, what you say has a lot of truth in it. When push comes to shoot, we must each choose what best suits us.

I own six .38 Specials and one .380. For whatever it is worth, I also have one .32 ACP (Kel-Tec), which I occasionally carry instead of, or in conjunction with, my S&W Model 38.

This is strange, and I cannot explain it, but my wife chose her own .38 Special, a 5" Model 10. This lady is somewhat petite. She looks like Scarlet O'Hara on the staircase.