CPL and Gun Free School Zone

[col_temp]

I don't think the following clarifications have been noted yet in the above thread.
Sorry ahead of time if I missed it.

1. Having the weapon concealed (out of sight inside a locked portion of the vehicle) is fine. (See F above!)
2. Inside the trunk is suggested or if a pickup under the seat. Either way it must not be able to be seen.
3. Thus a pizza box! would be just fine as long as it is locked up and not obviously a weapon.
4. You may have the concealed weapon in your possession when you are picking your child up on school grounds but you must remain in the vehicle.
5. Having worked at and for a school I made sure to use a butt pack and placed it int he trunk upon arrival. This is legal.
6.

Follow-up question:

What is the law about being on School Grounds, with a CPL? For example, going to the school's playground or football field after work, once school has been out for hours? Or even during school's summer vacation?

It's still school grounds just like the Post Office is still a federal office even when the main PO counter is closed.
You are not supposed to be armed in eitehr place. (I know kind of dumb, but that's the current law.)
7. Most of this info comes from reading the above law AND making sure you attend a legal class at your local range.
The one up here at Norpoint (Arlington WA) is called Self Defense Law and the lawyer who teaches it spends lots of time looking into the above law and teaches you how to read it! Well worth the cost and time.

 

[Red Wind]

3. Thus a pizza box! would be just fine as long as it is locked up and not obviously a weapon.

Papa John will be ecstatic!

 

[NavyLCDR]

7. Most of this info comes from reading the above law AND making sure you attend a legal class at your local range.
The one up here at Norpoint (Arlington WA) is called Self Defense Law and the lawyer who teaches it spends lots of time looking into the above law and teaches you how to read it! Well worth the cost and time.

Too bad they are teaching erroneous information...not worth the cost and time to me.

1. Having the weapon concealed (out of sight inside a locked portion of the vehicle) is fine. (See F above!)

The firearm only has to be concealed if it is left unattended. As you said, see F:

(f) Any nonstudent at least eighteen years of age legally in possession of a firearm or dangerous weapon that is secured within an attended vehicle or concealed from view within a locked unattended vehicle while conducting legitimate business at the school;

You do see that word "OR", right?

2. Inside the trunk is suggested or if a pickup under the seat. Either way it must not be able to be seen.

Only has to be concealed if left unattended.

4. You may have the concealed weapon in your possession when you are picking your child up on school grounds but you must remain in the vehicle.

Again, no requirement to conceal the firearm and no requirement to remain in the vehicle.

(e) Any person in possession of a pistol who has been issued a license under RCW 9.41.070, or is exempt from the licensing requirement by RCW 9.41.060, while picking up or dropping off a student

Where is the requirement to remain in the vehicle and conceal the firearm? The list of exceptions in (a) - (h) in the statute are joined at the end of (g) with "OR". That means that each exception stands alone, by itself. Thus, if you are exercising exception (e) for dropping off or picking up a student, there is no requirement to secure the firearm inside the vehicle, which is part of the SEPARATE and DISTINCT exception (f). What IS off limits is to go inside the building, that is further down in the same statue:

RCW 9.41.280
Possessing dangerous weapons on school facilities — Penalty — Exceptions.

(6) Except as provided in subsection (3)(b), (c), (f), and (h) of this section, firearms are not permitted in a public or private school building.

I have many times picked up or dropped off my daughter open carrying on school premises, and exited the vehicle to hug her good bye, get her books out of the back, and more recently to move from the passenger's seat to the driver's seat. Show me anything in the statute that makes that illegal. She has a prosthetic leg so most of the times these interactions have occurred in the handicapped parking area right in front of the main entrance to both middle and high schools.

 

[R.Greene]

What is "legitimate business at a school"? Is taking my son to the school's playground after school is out, or on the weekend, good enough?

I know nobody here can tell me exactly how this law will be interpreted in any specific case, and it would have some serious repercussions to find out that whatever you do is not "legitimate business"...

 

[NavyLCDR]

What is "legitimate business at a school"? Is taking my son to the school's playground after school is out, or on the weekend, good enough?

I know nobody here can tell me exactly how this law will be interpreted in any specific case, and it would have some serious repercussions to find out that whatever you do is not "legitimate business"...

I would say that if the gun remains locked in the vehicle and you have a WA CPL you have nothing to worry about as long as you are not committing a crime on school premises.

 

[GoWolfpack]

I will necro this thread because it has been weighing heavily on my mind recently. I believe it is more beneficial to tag my own discussion onto an existing thread than starting a new one.

In order to travel to my parent's property where I do the vast majority of my shooting I must leave my state of residence. In driving on state highways it is impossible to reach my destination without traveling through multiple school zones.

Since the state I am traveling through recognizes my concealed handgun permit, and the law in that state allows valid CHP holders to travel through school zones in that state (it simply states that anyone with a valid CHP may travel through a school zone), does the exception in (B)(ii) " if the individual possessing the firearm is licensed to do so by the State in which the school zone is located" apply?

Originally I read that exception to mean I would have to possess a permit issued by the state the school zone is located in, which I do not. However now I am re-evaluating my previous assumption, and I believe it may mean I need only have a permit recognized by the state the school zone is located in.

I wonder what the opinions and interpretations of the wise and powerful internet are on this matter?

This post is essentially an indirect appeal to Frank Ettin; while I may not agree with his opinions I deeply respect his knowledge and interpretation on legal matters.

 

[Sam1911]

The most usual and probably accurate answer here is that if you do not hold a permit issued by that state then you are not actually licensed by that state.

That's the technical, black letter, wording.

Now, a million (probably more, literally) Americans drive guns through school zones in just such a way (passing accidentally or unknowingly within 1,000' of a school) every single day without being charged for violating GFSZA. It would be a mighty fine point of law to hang you on. But the law does technically say licensed by...

 

[GoWolfpack]

The most usual and probably accurate answer here is that if you do not hold a permit issued by that state then you are not actually licensed by that state.

That's the technical, black letter, wording.

Now, a million (probably more, literally) Americans drive guns through school zones in just such a way (passing accidentally or unknowingly within 1,000' of a school) every single day without being charged for violating GFSZA. It would be a mighty fine point of law to hang you on. But the law does technically say licensed by...

So according to that interpretation it is essentially against federal law to travel anywhere outside your state of residence while armed. It would take some exceptional route planning to avoid school zones when many schools are located directly along state highways.

The fact that millions of americans have not been charged under this law doesn't change the fact that it is still a violation. According to one interpretation of the law, if I travel outside my state of residence I cannot traverse a school zone while armed without violating the GFSZA. This is, for me at least, a defacto ban on carrying a weapon to protect myself while traveling.

 

[Sam1911]

One could treat it that way. I don't know of anyone who does, but you could.