Dealing W/ Anti-Gun Cops

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Low profile, law abiding citizens are almost never drawn into that situation in the first place.
Instead of debating responses, might want to take a hard objective look at WHY ARE YOU BEING ASKED?

Why was the contact made? Basically because I have a lead foot and get stopped for having one. But consider the proverb: two wrongs do not make a right, my friend.

I'll share an anecdote of a recent stop I had by the only anti cop I've ever run into in my home state of Georgia. I've had more than my share of stop by officers...always with firearms in the vehicle and often with stacks of firearms in the vehicle. This was the only Georgia officer that has ever batted an eye.

I was on my way to Knoxville, Tennessee to visit Tamara, hso, the folks at Coal Creek Armory and other denizens of this board. I got off of I-20 onto I-285 in Atlanta at 9:30PM. I got off of I-285 onto I-75 North at 11:30 PM. Major wreck, two hour bumper to bumper crawl, I was ragged out. At an Acworth exit I saw a sign for a Waffle House and took the offramp to get a bite to eat. I missed the sign directing me to turn left at the bottom of the off ramp and guessed wrong...I turned right. Virtually no traffic, the area looked to be almost semi rural. A few convenience stores interspersed with residences. After a mile or so, I figured I had made the wrong guess and began looking to turn around. Came to a five way intersection with no other vehicles in sight. Took a chance and made a U turn...just as a police car crested the hill behind me. I figured I'd be pulled over. Sure, enough, here comes the blue lights. I applied the brakes, turned on my turn signal and pulled over. Got my license out and put my hands in plain view at 10 o'clock and 2 o'clock on the steering wheel of my 4Runner.

The officer walked up to my window and asked for my license. I handed it to him. About that time he looked into the rear seat and freaked out.
"What in the world are you doing with an AR-15 on the rear seat?" he screeched.

I didn't know what to say to him. Somehow, I didn't think that telling him that having an AR-15 lying on the seat in Georgia in open view is completely in compliance with the law was something that he would accept with good grace. I also didn't think that telling him that I would be shooting the firearm in Knoxville and if it wasn't in the vehicle then it wouldn't be available when I got to Knoxville would go over well either.

Then he screeched,"And it's LOADED!"

Once again, I didn't feel that stating that the AR-15 being loaded in the vehicle was completely legal in the state of Georgia would have a calming effect on the gentleman. I also didn't feel that stating that an unloaded firearm is useless would go over very well with the man.

Then he asked me if I had any other weapons in the vehicle. Heh.

I replied,"There is a Kel-Tec P3AT in my right front pocket, a Springfield 1911 in a holster on my right hip, and a Glock 29 10mm in a holster under the seat." All legal in Georgia with a carry permit that was in my wallet. In the heat of the moment, I forgot to mention the Spyderco clipped to my left front pocket or the Kim Breed Damascus tanto in the crossdraw scabbard on my belt.

About this time, he called for backup...thank God.

Then he screeched again,"Do you always carry a gun on your right hip?"

Finally, a question I could answer! "Only when I leave my house, sir."

About that time, the backup officer arrived and I was directed to exit the vehicle. I did so, and the officer removed my 1911 from the holster and laid it on the roof of my 4Runner as well as the P3AT from my right front pocket. He also saw the Kim Breed tanto in the crossdraw scabbard and removed it. It was legal as I position the scabbard so it is in open view in line with my navel. No comment was made about the knife. He missed seeing the Spyderco in my left front pocket.

The backup officer asked my if I was from rural Georgia. When I told him I was he relaxed greatly. He asked if I had any outstanding warrants. I told him no and told him I am a registered nurse. He told me that while the area appeared to be a middle class neighborhood that it was a crack and meth area where the local businesses were robbed on a regular basis.

In the meantime, the officer who stopped me was running a check on the firearms' serial numbers. He got to the 1911 and noticed something he hadn't noticed before: it was cocked and locked.

He screeched again,"What do you mean carrying this gun like this???"

I'd had about enough of him at this point. "Officer that pistol was designed by John Moses Browning to be carried exactly like that. Anyone with the proper training and experience with that pistol will tell you that is the proper way to carry it."

The backup officer told him,"He's correct. I used to carry one and carried it like that."

That was the last word out of the officer who stopped me.

A couple of minutes later, the serial numbers had all been checked. None of them were listed as stolen. The check on me had not turned up any outstanding warrants. My weapons were placed on the passenger seat unloaded and I was requested to ride down to a parking lot before I loaded them and reholstered them. I complied. Nothing was ever said about the U-turn that initiated the stop and no citation was written.

Some people I've told this tale to have assumed the officer was ignorant of Georgia law. They are incorrect. They weren't there and did not observe the officer's tone of voice and demeanor. He was outraged at my armament. If he had been ignorant of the applicable laws, he would have arrested me. He knew the law. He didn't like the law he was sworn to uphold.
 
The best answer I've ever heard is "In case you ever need assistance", or something like that. (the original was worded a little better but I can't remember it.)
 
"What makes you think YOU need a gun?"

Officer, you DO understand that your chief will be informed by letter of this harassment?
May we kindly get on with the business at hand and your reason for stopping me?
 
I have never been asked that question by any AZ law enforcement officer. I have been asked by PD about my ammo preferance, and sidearm choice. The last time I was pulled over, (about 8 or 9 years ago, I think, haven't had a speeding ticket in 16 years.), I informed the two Pima County deputies I was armed, and where it was located. They didn't ask me to exit, or remove it, or anything but "Please keep your hands on the steering wheel." One watched me as the other took care of paperwork. I got a citation for expired registration, but called thier boss to compliment thier professionalism.
 
As ElTegon pointed out "Am I free to go?"

That was an article in the Wall Street Journal about 7-8 yrs ago.

That is the response they recommend to give when the LEO hands back your license/papers and asks "may I look around", referring of course to your vehicle.

That is when you ask "am I free to leave" and at other times when you feel appropriate. That cuts off the 'tree shaking' and 'fishing expeditions'. We all should discuss This with other drivers esp younger ones in our circle of friends/families.
 
El Tejon said:
Remember this phrase, "Officer, am I free to go?"

Good advice! I don't know why you would intentionally choose to debate with anyone who is obviously closed minded, even more so a cop. You are not under any obligation to answer questions like:
“Where are you coming from tonight?”
“Where are you going?”
“Why do you need a gun?”

As far as I can tell, open carry is legal in Colorado. If some ‘officer of the law’ spots your concealed firearm and starts giving you grief over it, just say, “Fine, I’ll carry openly then.” and then tuck your covering garment behind the grip and go on your way.
 
Telling a cop that you intend to file ANY type of complaint against them, is one of the WORST possible options you could come up W/ definetely a time to be a good witness
 
Listen to El T.

On the other hand, I've never dealt with a cop that wasn't relieved to be dealing with a CHL holder.
 
In Colorado Springs the cop is required to give you a business card if he doesn't cite you. If he does cite you , have his ID information any way
 
Bit of advice given to a younger cousin on dealing with a LEO
" Don't argue with a man who has a badge,night stick and a gun,because you'll lose the argument every time."
 
What makes me think I need a gun?

Because 100,000,000 people were murdered by their own governments in the 20th century... That and criminals, but mostly the first reason...
 
The last time I got a speeding ticket, and was carrying, the reaction was different. The Deputy wrote me the ticket, I signed it, and he asked me to please slow down going through his town. Because it was 0130 on a Sunday morning, by the time he came up to the car I had my Makarov out on the passenger seat, mag out / chamber clear / slide locked open. I had license, registration, and CHP fanned out in my hand like playing cards.

After he'd handed me my copy of the ticket, pointed to the Mak, and asked,

"What IS that thing? can I see it?"

Ticket, 4-5 minutes. Discussion of gun juju and exotic (to him) firearms, 15 minutes.
 
Wonderful Experiences W/ Pro-Gun Cops

I'm happy to hear that there ARE some pro-gun cops ( more corecctly pro-2A cops). But those responses don't really fit the scenario I'm asking questions about. In Colorado I'm NOT REQUIRED to disclose my CHP to a cop UNLESS HE ASKS ME. also the cops in my Colorado don't have access to a CHP database, (IOW) unless I open my mouth OR THE COP ASKS ME they aren't going to know I'm carrying. I'm not trying to revisit that debate , my mind is made up I don't disclose. What I'm looking for are some viable options & strategies for politely ( one should always be courteous to a cop) refusing to engage in the debate W/ him.
 
I'm with ZeSpectre, shut up and save your arguments for the right venue. On the street dealing with what may be an underinformed officer with the authority to whomp your smart azz should you decide to formulate a heated debate is not wise and will only hurt any case you wish to bring forward to his superiors.

In my CHL class, which a retired officer taught, he suggested showing it to the officer to relax them a bit. They know you've been through a big background check and wouldn't have one if you had a history crime.

Sure, it's a risk, but my reception has been good thus far in the one time I was pulled over speeding on the freeway. I think it actually got me out of the ticket to be honest. That said, the state cops in Oregon, particularly rural Oregon, are pretty decent folk in my experience.
 
Y'all can flame me or accuse me of being holier than thou, but I just don't quite see the problem the same as some of you. El T and a couple others gave good advice.
In 35 years of driving, I have never had to have a gun discussion with an anti cop. Gee lets see, I've had 2 traffic tickets (most recent one was over 26 years ago!) and I've had maybe 6 total encounters with on-duty LEOs. ONE time, and ONE time only, was I involved in an incident with a trooper with an attitude (Illinois state police). I had been run off the road and was the only vehicle in the median when the trooper happened by. After some of what I consider moderate harrasment, questions, etc, I informed the trooper that I would not be answering any questions and asked if I was free to go. I was, and that was the end of that story.
I've had more encounters with game/conservation officers. (No citations but one warning on a boat registration tag.) They stopped or checked me because I was hunting or fishing, not because I was doing anything wrong. I have never been stopped by a LEO just because I was driving.
 
I'm not sure the cops are as anti-gun as you think. I was buying a (real) H&K model 91 from the Gander Mountain in Joliet, IL a few days ago. A person who identified himself as a cop talked to me and the salesman for a bit. He didn't have a problem with my buying the H&K 91, he praised it for a bit. He talked about his personal guns, introduced his wife who was also a shooter, and even said something positive about concealed carry in other states. Joliet's politicians are anti-gun, the rank and file officers aren't necessarily anti gun.
 
Being in NJ, by default most LEOs would be considered anti-2A.

I'm terrified of being detained for no good reason (e.g. that guy from SLC, UT that spent 5 days in prison for obeying the law).

I'm always confused about when to say "Am I free to go?"

In one of the examples provided in this thread, it was mentioned to ask, "Am I free to go?" after you have had your paperwork returned to you and the LEO starts fishing. But what happens if the LEO engages you in a probing dialog prior to returning your paper work.

For instance, if a LEO asks, "Where are you going? Where are you coming from?" while still holding that paper work in his hand. Do you stare at him blankly and remain silent? Or is this the perfect time for the response, "Am I free to go?".
 
Speaking as a cop, I think most of the answers are too lengthy and convoluted. If you want to say something a cop would understand and sympathize with, the simplest answer is something like,

"Because, Officer, some people out there a god-damn crazy."

You'll NEVER meet one who would answer back, "No they're not! They're all sane!"
 
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