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Delayed after NICS check

Discussion in 'Legal' started by duallydave, Feb 24, 2008.

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  1. duallydave

    duallydave Member

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    I finally received my CCW license after 29 days, and went to buy my first handgun. After filling out all the paperwork and paying, they called it in to NICS or whoever they call. They said that it was "delayed" and I would have to wait up to 10 days before I could take my gun home. I thought the CCW background check covered all of that, but I was told that there could be "federal restrictions". Where can I find out information about these restrictions? I'm well north of 50 now, but I made a few dumb choices when I was a youngster, and spent a few days in jail for a minor misdemeanor:eek:. Is this going to stop me from buying a handgun from a licensed dealer? I know that I can buy from a private party or gun show without a problem in this state, it seems ludicrous that the only restriction would be buying it from a licensed dealer, especially when I have already been approved for CCW.:(
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2008
  2. cedjunior

    cedjunior Member

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    Need more info then what you gave. What state do you live in and all of that. If your ccw permit required a background check, chances are you'll pass NICS. I've been delayed on all but one firearm purchase in my life. Its not that big of a deal.
     
  3. duallydave

    duallydave Member

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    I live in Washington State, King County. I bought the gun in Puyallup, which is Pierce County. I found http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=340454 after I posted this, I'm reading through it now. It does have some interesting info related to WA.
     
  4. Pat-inCO

    Pat-inCO Member

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    Why did you pay for the gun before the NICS clearance?

    My local legal distributor of guns runs the check before they even fill out the sales receipt. The gun sits next to the computer until the NICS transaction is accepted or rejected.

    I've seen a few delayed (more than an hour or so) but not many. With that said, I've also had to wait long enough that I would go get lunch while waiting, on several occasions. :D
     
  5. duallydave

    duallydave Member

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    The person doing the transaction said that I needed to pay before they called in. It seemed a little weird, what if I was refused, would they hit me with a re-stocking fee? I bought some ammo, eye and ear protection, and a cleaning kit also, that I took with me. I guess if I was turned down, I could buy a gun from a private party, but I really want this M&P9c, and I would hate to pay a 15% restocking fee for a gun that I only held in my hand for a few minutes.
     
  6. allank

    allank Member

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    Paying before NICS check seems odd, at least compared to my experience. I've been delayed every time for a few days, have always passed, but have never paid upfront before the check.
     
  7. mainebear

    mainebear Member

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    Here in Northern Maine the gunshops do the NICS check and if you are approved THEN they complete the sale. If not the gun is put aside (At least with me, I'm always delayed) until approval, then you pay and complete the transaction.
     
  8. duallydave

    duallydave Member

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    I did find this just now, good info, but it doesn't really answer my question

    http://opencarry.mywowbb.com/forum55/7874.html

    Two forms to fill out for a pistol transfer in WA state.

    A) Federal 4473 form (required for any firearms purchase from a dealer in the USA)

    B) Washington State Pistol Transfer Application (this is WA-specific AND handgun-specific, it doesn't get filled out for long gun transfers)

    When you fill out both forms, the 4473 is usually called in immediately and you get one of three answers from NICS:

    A) Proceed (Go ahead with the deal if state and local requirements are/will be met)

    B) Delay (This gives NICS 72hours to come up with an answer. If they do not call the FFL back within those 72 hours, the law states that the FFL may choose to transfer the firearm, although everyone that I know of will take the initiative and call NICS back to get an approval or a denial.)

    C) Denied (This person is ineligable to own a firearm according to NICS/FBI)

    With a proceed on the Federal form, the FFL will process the State form, either by faxing in the form to the applicable LE agency in the jurisdiction where the buyer lives, and that LEA has 5 business days to respond. If they do not, it works similar, that the FFL may opt to go ahead with the sale, or they may choose to try and check status before transferring.

    On a state form, filled out by a buyer with a valid WA CHL, the state is satisfied that they have performed a background check within the past 60 months (length of CHL in WA) and so long as the 4473 comes back a proceed, (or a delay, then a proceed) the pistol can be transferred immediately.

    With a CPL and quick penmanship, one can be in and out of a dealer with a new pistol in about 10-15 minutes, provided that the dealer gets an immediate "proceed" from NICS. My personal record is about 20 minutes, because I always have to BS a little with the guys there.

    I hope this helps.
     
  9. pharmer

    pharmer Member

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    If your last name is Smith, Jones, Brown, Green, expect a delay. Lots of those in every state to sort through. Joe
     
  10. misANTHrope

    misANTHrope Member

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    Basically, here's what happens when someone calls in a NICS check: (at least as of my last FFL employment, about two years ago)

    The first operator you get prompt you for all the info on the 4473. They proceed to run a sort of "quick check". If nothing possibly untoward pops up, they come back with a "proceed". If there is something possibly of concern, you get transferred to another operator, who will spend up to a few minutes doing research. If they conclude in this time frame that whatever popped up doesn't apply to you, then they will give a "proceed". Otherwise, it becomes a "delay".

    The reason this happens is that there are a lot of people with similar or identical names across our great nation. Sometimes NICS needs an hour or two or maybe a day to verify that a record doesn't belong to the person they're checking. Only twice in about four years of gun selling have I had a buyer end up being denied. Generally, a delay is resolved the next business day at the latest. If it's not resolved within three business days, the FFL is allowed to transfer the firearm at their discretion.

    On that last point- from what I've heard about the place you're buying from, I'm not forming a high opinion of them. They told you it could be up to 10 days to resolve a delay? That means that even if the three business days go by, they're going to hold it for another five or so, just for the heck of it? And making you pay before the NICS check is a little odd, too. Why would you have someone pay for something before you've determined if the sale can happen?
     
  11. AirForceShooter

    AirForceShooter Member

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    Did you give your SS# on the 4473?
    That usually avoids problems of duplication.

    10 days? tell him to cancel the sale

    AFS
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2008
  12. duallydave

    duallydave Member

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    I'm not too happy about the paying and not taking it home either... They said that they it should be resolved within 5 days, and if I did not hear anything within 10 days, to just come pick it up. They were the only store in the area with the M&P9c, another store said they could get one, but I would have to pay for their costs to ship it from the distributor, the total cost there would have been close to $600 after taxes. It was a lot easier when I bought my Model 94 Winchester 30-30.
     
  13. duallydave

    duallydave Member

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    Thanks for the very informative explanation, misanthrope, that sounds encouraging that only a few get denied in the end.
     
  14. CUE7467

    CUE7467 member

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    i thought if there was no response from NICS with 3 days it is yours to pick up anyway???
     
  15. DENALI

    DENALI member

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    Never give your SSN, it's not gonna help resolve anything! I've never heard of anyone getting hit up with a re-stocking fee for a nics delay, and if you're denied thats an entirely different problem, as you shouldent have been trying to buy what you know you can't have, or why didn't you know in advance you'd be denied? Mind you, I'm not saying yea or nea, I'm just pointing too the obvious. You can only be denied if your a convicted felon, or you've been convicted of the predicate gross misdemeanor's specified.....
     
  16. Magnuumpwr

    Magnuumpwr Member

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    Not all delays have to do with failed back ground checks. I have only been delayed one time, that was due to purchasing 8 guns in one day. Only the last was delayed and only for 3 days. As far as back grounds go, I have had two run ins with the law. 1st was a warrant for wreckless misconduct with a firearm. 2nd was unlawfully carrying a weapon. These occurred around my early 20's and have not hendered my gun purchases. The state for both offenses is Texas, which is where I reside.
     
  17. Clipper

    Clipper Member

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    Your tax dollars at work...Relax, I get delayed every purchase. However, unless there's some state statute extending the delay time, that store is adding to it on their own hook, and I'd tell 'em to stick it, and buy elsewhere. Federal regs only provide a 3-day delay before they can sell to you without the approval.
     
  18. Macmac

    Macmac Member

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    duallydave, Relax you will get the gun. In NH where I live you must pay before the NICS can be done. The idea is if you are prohibited there is the contract. it is a felony offence and bound by the contract if you should be a prohibited person.

    I am sure you are not.

    The CCW permit is by town, county and state, and has not a thing to do with NICS.

    Any state in your life where you have ever purchased any gun will be a part of the NICS check. If you ever bought a gun in Cal, Mass, NY, and a heck of a lot of other anti states then those states tend to drag about and create problems because they can.

    If you ever lived in any of those states and others, like them you can cut them right out of the picture if you please.

    You ask your state where you reside now for a waiver. The waiver allows your state to keep transactions on record. That will speed the process up alot.

    I lived in Mass once and they dragged their feet, not ever doing the check ever. I still got the gun, after a pointless wait.

    Another reason it might be is if your name is Joe Smith, Jim Brown, Tim White, and any number of really common names.

    If this is true and you didn't add the social securtiy number to the form then it takes time to go thru all these names.

    There is a time limit for the check, and if that time runs past the limit you get the gun. I know that sucks, but it still isn't all that bad, unless you are in a hurry for a reason.

    FFL Dealers don't like it as it gets them a bad name.

    The people who do the NICS checks don't tell the FFL Dealer anything either.

    The dealers hears Passed/Denied.. he can't ask why, and NICS can't tell.

    The dealer is talking to people who talk like robots in military lingo.

    I know all this because I have worked behind the counter.

    I also know about the waiver because I did it when Mass stumbled around and I picked up that gun when the time ran out.

    Since the waiver I pass in seconds..
     
  19. chris in va

    chris in va Member

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    Visited my local shop here in VA last week, browsing for some grips. Overheard the owner mentioning how many delays he's had the past year. He said more often than not people have to wait now.
     
  20. Phil DeGraves

    Phil DeGraves Member

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    "The person doing the transaction said that I needed to pay before they called in. It seemed a little weird, what if I was refused, would they hit me with a re-stocking fee?'

    This is normal procedure for many gunshops. A customer gets delayed, oftentimes they cancel the sale, thinking they can go somewhere else and pick it up. So all the paperwork that was done is for naught. Some places will even have a paperwork charge if the customer changes his mind after he is DELAYED (NOT DENIED). If it is denied (which is very rare), the customer is refunded his money in full.
    Sometimes delays have nothing to do with the customer's background; occasionally it has to do with computers on the other end being down.
    That being said, if you have "flags" from the past, expect to get delayed everytime you buy.
     
  21. misANTHrope

    misANTHrope Member

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    When I first started, it took about 3-4 NICS calls before I convinced myself that I really was talking to human beings, and not some advanced answering system. :p
     
  22. FieroCDSP

    FieroCDSP Member

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    It's really fun to get a trainee on the other end. You can always tell, as they'll ask you to repeat info several times and will hesitate when you use radio-speak for letters. I once called in when they were having a building-wide fire drill. The whole time the alarm was going off (I could hear it) and the poor guy on the other end could barely hear me.
     
  23. Wes Janson

    Wes Janson Member

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    I feel sorry for the NICS people on occasion...there was one weekend where it took at least half an hour to get through. Apparently there were two or three gun shows going on all at the same time, plus it was the busy season, and to top it off almost the entire NICS staff had apparently called in sick. Poor lady sounded seriously frazzled.

    The trainees are funny though. I can usually tell them all of the information in the proper order before they can ask for it. On the other hand, some of the old hands like to screw with you by asking for information out of order.
     
  24. EOD Guy

    EOD Guy Member

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    The dealer MAY release the firearm after 3 business days but does not have to. Some dealers will not release without a proceed.
     
  25. NGIB

    NGIB Member

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    Now that I have my CCW, I can bypass the NICS here in GA. Never got delayed anyway but now I won't ever be...
     
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