Do you call the cops?

[LightningJoe]

You're in a deserted parking lot one night and you're attacked by a lone individual. You're sure the guy is armed and intends to harm you.

1] You reach for your gun. He sees you reach and runs away. Do you call the cops?

2] You draw your weapon. He sees your weapon and runs away. Do you call the cops?

3] You draw your weapon and fire it, but you don't get a good grip on it and you're sure you missed. The guy runs away. Do you call the cops?

4] You fire your weapon and you're confident you hit the guy. The guy runs away. Do you call the cops?

5] You fire your weapon and hit the guy. He falls down and you're absolutely certain he's dead as a doornail. Do you call the cops?

6] You fire your weapon and hit the guy. He's incapacitated, but you can tell he's alive and may be saved by prompt medical attention. Do you call the cops?

7] You fire your weapon and hit the guy. He's incapacitated, but he starts yelling. "I'm going to sue your ass off! My dad's a trial lawyer who's made millions off goofballs like you! I'm your worst nightmare!" Do you call the cops?


People who carry guns presumably intend to use them for self-defense. They will have to answer one of the above questions or one like it if their gun ever earns its salary. Somewhere in all the mess above is the high road. But where?

 

[Azrael256]

Yes.

 

[Geno]

Without question yes, always!

Without question yes, always!

Edited to add:

Don't drive there to report it, thus leaving the scene, call the police ASAP. See the recent thread about an ex-LEO who shot and killed a scumbag and shot (and I think wounded) a fellow friend of the dead scumbag. The injured scumbag escaped, called and reported a murder before the ex-LEO arrived to the police department. Promptly upon the ex-LEO's arrival to the PD, he was arrested, charged and is now awaiting trial.

See lead-in statement.

Doc2005

 

[Low-Sci]

1) Yes. Protect the next guys who get there too.
2) Yes. Still a good idea.
3) Yes. They need to know that you shot, where, at what, why.
4) Yes. Same as 3, but add that someone may need medical attention.
5) Yes. And by the way, welcome to hell.
6) Yes. You can explain the situation when they arrive; get an ambulance.
7) Yes. What he's saying doesn't have any impact on the situation.

 

[haole_boySS]

1-2 No
3-7 Yes

 

[Geno]

Re: 1 & 2 no???

If you do #1 and/or #2, then fail to report, you might be charged with brandishing. It becomes a lop-sided he-said.

Doc2005

 

[beerslurpy]

Always yes. If you had a confrontation with another person involving your gun, you should immediately contact the police. The stance the take in resolving the situation will be heavily shaped by the initial contact. It is better to start with a clean slate than by having to debunk the lies of the other guy and then explaining to the police why you didnt bother reporting that you drew on someone.


1) Brandishing and use of force should be reported to the police. Mere confrontation- use your judgement. The reason is that brandishing and use of force are both crimes unless you have a defense in employing them. The cop isnt going to hear about the reasons from the guy who was attacking you- he will only hear that a crime has been committed by you. Dont subject yourself to the risk. Call the cops first and make sure they have the story.
2) Empty the magazine into assailant, walking fire up to the CNS. If you can't justify killing him, then you shouldnt have shot him in the first place, should you?

 

[depicts]

Yes to all questions. To protect yourself and other citizens, you should immediatly call the police.

 

[Vitamin G]

1] Yes
2] Yes
3] Definately
4] Absolutely
5] Without Question
6] Most Certainly
7] In about 20 minutes...

 

[Biker]

I'd agree with Haole Boy, generally speaking.

He must've lived in Wahiawa.

Biker

 

[gunsmith]

one & two, no most of the time

just to much paper work & hassle.

Most miscreant crack heads would just assume your an off duty cop.

If I got the feeling that he was going to report it to the police I would call first.

I've pulled my gun on a crack head (indexed finger and pointing at the ground)
to keep him from cornering me and he left. I didn't expect a problem and didn't get one.

 

[psyopspec]

Yes to all.

 

[limbaughfan]

yes to all but with 7 i would shoot him again,if it were in a legal situation

 

[Alex45ACP]

Just remember, dead men tell no tales.

 

[Superpsy]

#1 gives me the impression of him seeing me reaching but not actually seeing the gun. I would say yes for 2-7 but #1 isn't brandishing, is it? Of course, it makes sense to call the cops since the first to call gets to be the victim most of the time.

 

[Chuck Dye]

Enlightened self-interest can be a good thing...

My first reaction was "Yes to all." LEOs have memories and create institutional memories for other LEOs. Get as much of a description of the bad guy and his MO into the record as you can.

Then I considered my own history and realized that LightningJoe’s thread starter does not specify whether the intended victim is carrying lawfully. By my own acts I have said no to question 2, once for convenience, and twice because going on public record as having had a handgun where and when I did would likely have created far more trouble for me than the bad guys I drove off.

Edit: Ooops! Sorry folks, I lost track of the parameters, the convenience no-call did not involve "is armed and intends to harm you." Of the other two, one was a first degree burglary turned armed robbery attempt, the other a straight on armed robbery attempt, both of the guns-beat-knives variety.

 

[Dmack_901]

It would be a real shame if your cell slipped out of your hands and into the gutter on number 6.

But Huck Phinn has the real question. What if you we're just at a bar and we're slightly intoxicated. Or more mundane, you know you havn't renewed you ccw.

 

[KINGMAX]

I don't dial 911

around my house, we don't dial 911

 

[Geno]

Not Renewed = Should not carry.

One of the first questions asked of me of me in this incident:

http://thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=2641535#post2641535

was "Do you have your MCPL with you?"

Doc2005

 

[PennsyPlinker]

No to 1 and 2. Yes to the rest. I have had to draw my handgun twice since I started carrying it 15 years ago. In both cases the bad guys instantly desisted from their intent to harm, and disappeared quickly. The first time was actually humorous after it was all over. Actually, both were kind of humorous after they were over. But I think they might be exceptions to the rule.

 

[Lupinus]

yes always

He who calls first, is right.

Why?

Because that is the story the police hear first and the one that is in their minds, from then on anything you say is a counter story.

I don't want to chance that he isn't going to call the police saying he was jsut walking along and some nut job pulled a gun on him.

 

[PennsyPlinker]

He who calls first, is right.

Maybe, maybe not. A couple of weeks ago I had to go talk to my neighbor about his kid hanging around my business, which just happens to be on my property. I've had several confrontations with this guy, mainly about his dog running loose on our property and going after our small backup dog. The guy can't seem to understand why that makes me unhappy. But anyway. Last January a window was broken on my shop, and I am about 95% sure his kid did it, based on some physical evidence. Long story, but I never accused him of anything. Anyway back to the story. His kid was hanging up by my shop, and ran when he got hit with headlights of someone pulling into our driveway. So I went to ask him about it. He immediately blew a fuse and started screaming in my face, threatening to blow my head off with a shotgun for harrassing him. He also threatened to call the police. I encouraged him to do so, stating that I would wait right there until they arrived. He backed down.

The next day, when I arrived home from church, I discovered that the police had been by several times looking for me. I called the police officer station and told them I was home and would be for the rest of the day. The officer arrived, and in a very gruff manner, asked for my side of the story. By the time I had gotten just a few minutes into my story, the officer was laughing and agreeing with me that my neighbor was the problem. Of course, he then straightened up with a very serious expression and said, "Officially I am neutral, but personally, you have a bad seed, and you need to watch out for and stay away from him, because he is trying to set you up. But I will go and set him straight about the dog and his kid trespassing."

So getting there first might be a help in some cases, but the truth still counts for something.

Oh, and the shotgun threat? I reported that too, and the officer started laughing again. He said, "He doesn't even own a shotgun."

"How do you know that!?!", I said.

"Because he said he was so scared of you he thought about running into the house and grabbing his shotgun. His wife spoke up and said, 'What are you talking about, you don't even own a shotgun!' "

How dumb can you be to lie to a cop about a gun you don't even have?

 

[Lupinus]

True you aren't always wrong but I would rather be the story teller then the rebuffer.

As to not owning a shotgun my mother lives with me and doesn't know about most of the toys I own, and I doubt my future wife will either

 

[PennsyPlinker]

I thought about that possibility as well, but there are times when you just get a sense about someone. This guy is all bluster, a bag of wind with a pair of lips. And even if he had a shotgun, if he had run into the house after the threat, he would have emerged to see two autos, one in each hand. I don't go around yelling about them, but I always have something with me.

 

[Superpsy]

"Because he said he was so scared of you he thought about running into the house and grabbing his shotgun. His wife spoke up and said, 'What are you talking about, you don't even own a shotgun!' "

Ha!