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Do you crimp a 223/5.56 bullet with a cannelure in AR15

Discussion in 'Handloading and Reloading' started by Rule3, Dec 10, 2013.

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Do you Crimp a 223/5.56 Bullet with cannelure in a AR15?

Poll closed Jan 9, 2014.
  1. Yes

    64 vote(s)
    52.9%
  2. No

    57 vote(s)
    47.1%
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  1. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

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    Lots of threads and question regarding crimping a bullet in 223/5/56 that has a cannelure, Thought I would put it in a poll form.

    This is with a Lee collet type rifle die crimp totally different than the pistol FCD. (just for clarity)

    Or any brand/kind of crimp die

    This is blasting or plinking ammo not match grade stuff.
     
    Last edited: Dec 10, 2013
  2. steve4102

    steve4102 Member

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    I crimp all my semi-auto ammo with the Lee Factory Crimp die. Even the Match Grade stuff, Improves accuracy in my firearms.
     
  3. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    I use a taper crimp with a 55 Gr FMJ with a cannelure. It has nothing to do with accuracy. I never shoot those for groups.

    But, if the cannelure has no indentation, there is nowhere for the case mouth to go, so it is a waste of time. Some jacketed bullets these days have little marks instead of a real cannelure. I don't know why they bother.

    With the FCD in question, it can be adjusted heavily and then will push the case mouth in and make its own indention, but I don't want to damage the bullet that much.
     
  4. Otto

    Otto Member

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    Nope, no crimp is needed with 556 and the Lee FCD is a waste of money IMO.
     
  5. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

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    That's the cannelure I am referring to. The little bumpy line for lack of a better explanation. No it's not a groove like a 357 LSWC With the LEE rifle crimp die I never set it to make it's own groove either. Barely the recommended 1/2 turn. It can smash the heck out of a bullet.

    http://www.hornady.com/store/22-Cal-.224-55-gr-FMJ-BT-with-cannelure/
     
  6. GT1

    GT1 Member

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    Yes, a light crimp using the FCD in the cannelure(Doesn't matter if there is a cannelure or not to me, actually). The FCD is a crimp die only in my case because I've already sized the case, it only uses the crimp function.
     
  7. steve4102

    steve4102 Member

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  8. redclay

    redclay Member

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    I crimp all bullets loaded for a semi-auto, rifle and hand gun.
    When I first started reloading for semi-auto it was recommended that I shouldn't crimp for increased accuracy. This advise was HOG WASH spread by people that don't know squat about semi-autos. The violence of the round being chambered is enough for an un-crimped round to lose the bullet and wedge it in the lands and powder spilled in the action. I tested the results of the Lee Factory crimp in a press and it more than doubled the force required to move the bullet. Leaving them un-crimped is fine for a bolt gun. I find my accuracy improves with modest powder loads running about 2500 FPS in an auto loader
    Just my experience, hope it helps
     
  9. jaguarxk120

    jaguarxk120 Member

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    What otto said in post no. 4.
     
  10. cfullgraf

    cfullgraf Member

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    I used to crimp my semi-auto rifle rounds but give it up years ago.
     
  11. moxie

    moxie Member

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    I do not crimp. No need. If the bullet is coming loose upon chambering, there are other problems.

    That Sierra bullet's cannelure ain't really. It's just a, to me, guide on where to seat the bullet.
     
  12. 3GunEric

    3GunEric Member

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    Maybe I am wrong but isn't the whole point of the cannelure to give some "purchase" to the crimp for magazine fed weapons?

    can·ne·lure
    noun \ˈkanəlˌ(y)u̇(ə)r\
    -s
    Full Definition of CANNELURE
    1
    : a groove running lengthwise on the surface of a cylinder or column
    2
    a : a groove around the cylinder of an elongated bullet for small arms to contain a lubricant
    b : a groove around a bullet into which the edge of the cartridge case is crimped
    c : a groove around the rotating band of a gun projectile to lessen the resistance offered to the rifling
    d : a groove around the base of a cartridge where the extractor takes hold
     
  13. cfullgraf

    cfullgraf Member

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    Crimping bullets in the cannelure does not improve neck tension and in some cases decreases it.

    But, there are special cases where crimping is useful.

    Crimping helps in tubular magazine rifles where the bullets push against the base of the next bullet and recoil of the gun can move the bullets. Kind of like banging on the bullet with a hammer.

    Also, some very high power rounds can move the bullets under recoil, or in rifles where the magazine allows the bullet to bang against the front of the magazine can get some benefit from crimping.
     
  14. Rule3

    Rule3 Member

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    Granted the 223/5.56 is not a heavy recoil. How about an AR10 style in 308. Would the rounds bounce around enough in the magazine to move the bullet?
     
  15. 3GunEric

    3GunEric Member

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    All I know is that I crimp them all. 5.56, 7.62, and 7.62x39. Done this tens of thousands of times and never had a prob - so a crimping I will go!
     
  16. moxie

    moxie Member

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    3GunEric,

    You are correct. If you aren't crimping, a cannelure isn't needed. But, the 55FMJBT with cannelure is usually the most common and cheapest .223 bullet (.224) available. So many of us use it a lot for plinking, drills, classes, etc. And it might not be the best but it's certainly suitable for defense rounds. It has very good terminal ballistics.
     
  17. NCsmitty

    NCsmitty Member

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    If your neck tension is correct, IE, expander button at least .002" under bullet diameter, there is no need to employ a crimp in an AR.
    The only rifle loads that I crimp, is for tube magazine lever actions.


    NCsmitty
     
  18. billybob44

    billybob44 Member

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    AR Crimp??

    I put a light crimp on all of my AR ammo. I use an RCBS AR series Taper Crimp die..Bill.:D
     
  19. Dr.Zubrato

    Dr.Zubrato Member

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    I used to, and since I load on a single stage I tried without it one time and realized I could cut out a whole lot of extra crimping and save myself some time. Not to mention I seat my bullets a little long, so my case mouth is below the cannelure. Never had any problems or failures to feed, but I have been getting subMOA from a lightweight barrel profile fighting rifle at 100 yards.
    If I was working on a progressive press, I probably would crimp lightly, just for the hell of it.
     
  20. cfullgraf

    cfullgraf Member

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    Besides 223 Remington, I do not crimp 30-06 used in an M1 Garand or 308 Winchester used in an M1A.

    So, I would suspect that an AR-10 style rifle in 308 Winchester would not need crimping.

    Of the 10 rifle cartridges that I reload, only 30 Carbine gets crimped and that is a taper crimp to remove mouth belling.
     
  21. zerobarrier
    • Contributing Member

    zerobarrier Contributing Member

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    Its not really needed in 223 especially if used in a bolt gun, but I do any ways. It makes me feel better in my AR-15. Also I only do .002-.003 crimp
     
  22. Devilfrog

    Devilfrog Member

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    Yep, what he said :D
     
  23. steve4102

    steve4102 Member

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    How can this be? If crimping into a cannelure does NOT help secure the bullet, how can "there are special cases where crimping is useful."?

    If crimping does nothing, how can it help in "high powered" rounds and in "tubular magazines"? :confused:
     
  24. cfullgraf

    cfullgraf Member

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    I will rephrase, the general consensus is that crimping is detrimental to the perfomance of the round upon firing.

    Some folks do not agree with this though.

    In cases like tubular magazine or high recoiling cartridges, a proper crimp aides in holding the bullet in position.
     
  25. stavman11

    stavman11 Member

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    Never crimp my .223

    Seemed to increase the Pressure and decrease the accuracy when I tried It....

    So now I drop a Bullet in and Thats all...:)
     
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