Do you really have to 'work on' a NIB Kel-tec P-11?

[Climb14er]

I am taking a 'serious' look at the Kel-Tec P-11 as another CCW pistol but from what I've been reading, you've got to 'fluff and buff' the new pistol to get it to be totally reliable and a smooth shooter.

I don't know about you but I really don't like to buy a new pistol and have to 'finish' the work that should have been done at the factory.

Is this a fair conclusion or is the Kel-tec a 'runner' right out of the box?

 

[KillitnGrillit]

I just bought a new p-11 hardcrome last week and put 120 rounds thru it so far and it funtioned flawlessly. I believe in putting rounds thru my pistols in order to break it in.

 

[pistolwhipped]

I've owned the much talked about , troublesome P40 for three years.
This weapon has been a shooter out of the box. Never done a thing to it. Never had a problem. Ya just never know.

 

[DDGator]

My P-32, P-3AT, and P-40 have been flawless -- never a malfunction. Dont believe the line that the guns need work from the box. If it does need work, Kel-Tec will do it and ship it back post haste.

Good guns. Good company.

 

[9x19]

Mine have not needed any work to be reliable.

I have done some things to them, just for fun and to smooth the trigger pull just a bit, but that was after they had been thoroghly tested for function.

Good luck

 

[Tropical Z]

My P32 has been 100% out of the box using Geco fmj's.I'd bet new P11's will be just as good.

 

[firestar]

If you want a good gun that will work straight from the box, the Kel-Tec is NOT it! Get a .38 snubbie if you don't want to have to send you brand new gun back to the factory.

Kel-Tec pistols seem to have about a 25% chance of needing work or having to go back to the factory. The quality is low and parts will break. Kel-Tec is one of those companies that people will defend with extreme emotion even though they are clearly not up to the standards that a serious defensive pistol should have.

If someone I cared about carried a Kel-Tec for self defense, I would buy them a decent gun. I just can't sit by while someone is carrying a gun that is such a known problem. If you don't have another carry gun, pass on kel-Tec. You may get lucky and get a good one but if you are the 1 in 4 that gets a dog, you will be sorry. Save your money and get a good gun or look around a bit more. There are much better made guns out there for about the same amount of cash.

Kel-Tec does NOT have a very good track record so to be safe, get a gun that has paid it's dues and earned it's rep as a good gun. Bersa, Makarov, S&W snub nose and the CZ-83, all have great reps because they have earned it.

 

[9x19]

And they say the fans are emotional... Some people seem to have bad luck with lots of different pistol brands... perhaps its just bad kahrma?

 

[DDGator]

Here comes the KT bashing.... I knew it was coming.

I would be curious to know where the 25% have to go back to the factory stat comes from -- there is no support for that. I guess I am luck to have stopped for now a 3 perfect guns since that fourth one would sure have to go back...

Go to ktog.org and see what the consensus is. I dont think anyone defends with "extreme emotion" and gun that is a piece of crap. People defend guns they use and depend on. However, people do mercilessly attack guns they don't like... Who do you believe?

All manufacturers have bad guns go out the door. Its a fact of life. Buy you gun from a good dealer and the dealer should take care of you. If you buy a KT and the dealer won't help you, KT will. Do you know any other companies where the head gunsmith is active on a discussion forum and will participate in discussions? Know any other companies who will give you a tour if you show up at their door? Know any other companies who will give you a hard chrome upgrade for your slide by return mail for $20 including shipping?

Don't let people scare you off from a KT with the occasional horror story. Glocks, Colts, Kimbers, S&W and H&K guns have their problems too.

Finally, the Bersa Thunder, Mak and CZ-83 are all great guns -- but they don't take the place in size/firepower of a Kel-Tec.

 

[yzguy]

love my P-11 and P-32...

I have done mods to them, but only because I wanted to, and because they are so easy to work on anyone can do it. Well that and the fact that doing the mods does not void the lifetime warrantee (even if you screw up and dammage a part, many times they will replace it).

 

[clange]

I did the F&B before i shot it but thats not really recommended. Clean it, lube it, and shoot it. If you dont have problems, great, dont do anything to it. If you have any feeding issues the F&B could fix it. Any serious stuff send it to KT. I sent mine in with FTF and FTE problems (bought used, who knows what was wrong with it) and to get a hard chrome upgrade and had it back in 5 days (although they arent usually this fast i've heard). The only thing that was original was the magazine i assume (and frame obviously). Since i've had 2 FTE in about 130 rounds, but the second was when it was quite dirty. Its much better then it was, at the very least. Considering its virtually new, i'm going to run some more rounds through it and break it in before i decide if its really fixed or not.

Damn .32 is expensive locally, i need to get some s&b online or something.

 

[KeysBear]

P-11 and P-40 owner. No complaints. No company could function if 1/4 of their guns had problems, so don't take that comment seriously. The P-11 is light, compact, economical, and reliable. Start out with 115 grain ammo (very few are happy with 147 grain) and use a firm grip to prevent limp wristing. Great choice for concealed carry. Don't let the fluff and buff scare you off - you dont' have to do it, and many don't. Out of the box it shoots just fine, but I'd recommend cleaning it first, then add a little gun oil or light grease on the slide rails. I've got over 2000 rounds through my P-11 so far, and 400 through my P-40. I carry mine in a Don Hume pocket holster. Best regards, Keys

 

[Felonious Monk]

When I got into handguns a couple of years ago (post 9/11, to be exact), I was looking for a good VALUE. I could not afford a Valtro, Ed Brown, H&K etc...
I wanted a gun I could CCW, would consistently go BANG when I pulled the trigger, decent capacity, could double as HD if needed, and had really good warranty support if something went wrong.

I looked seriously at the Taurus PT111 and PT145, but that was about the time the frame cracking was happening with the .45. I also heard that some folks (not all) had had nightmare experiences with Taurus Cust. Svc.

I looked at some other candidates, and came across the Kel-Tec Owner's Group.
I found that the P11 was SMALLER, LIGHTER and had the same capacity as the PT111 (and potential for MORE with S&W hi-cap mags).
People on the board occasionally had problems, but nothing epidemic; when they did encounter trouble, almost every one was given STELLAR treatment by Kel-Tec.

I asked questions for a while, and when a long-time member was selling a parkerized P11 with night sights, I bought it.
It's been perfect, and so I've bought 2 P32's since. Also perfect.

Oh GOSH, Firestar! I'd better stop NOW! That's my 3 good ones!!!

 

[newman32]

I just did the usual cleaining before going to the range w/ my P11 for the first time. I will say that is fairly gunked up out of the box. BUT, after 500 rounds of various ammo brands - no problems.

 

[Blackhawk]

My P-11 was perfect out of the box, but I did the F&B on it for grins. Later, I came up with trigger modifications to shorten and lighten the pull. For its size, weight, capacity, and tune, it's about as perfect a CCW as I can imagine. I don't consider it a pocket pistol however. Its two little brothers, P-32 and P-3AT fit that bill.

I don't have a P-3AT yet, but my P-32 was also perfect out of the box except for needing cleaning. I don't consider that a gig though. I clean every new or new-to-me gun I get, and that's never been considered a wasted effort.

I have friends who also have P-11s that were perfect out of the box and who never bothered cleaning them until after a few shooting sessions, and only then because they started carrying them.

I don't know what problem KT bashers have that causes them to make things up about them, but the psychiatrists probably have a name for it -- "P-11ess Envy", maybe.

 

[KeysBear]

A couple of more things. A Makarov was mentioned as an alternative, as is often the case when talking about economically priced pistols. A Makarov is a fine pistol, and I own one, but I'm assuming that we're talking about concealed carry pistols of similar size. I know a lot of people carry a Makarov, but it is not pocket sized. I've been carrying my P-11 in my pocket holster for over ten months now, and it goes just about everywhere with me, even in light walking shorts which are necessary for this hot weather climate I live in. I've taken my P-11 completely apart, and there is nothing cheap about it - it's just built to be light, not cheap. I sit at my desk with it in my pocket all day long and I never even realize that it's there. That's what I wanted for concealed carry in a 9mm. If it were any heavier I might leave it at home sometimes, and that wouldn't protect me much, now would it? Best regards, Keys

 

[concerned citizen]

I have owned two P-11's a P32 and currently a P3AT.

Folks like to tinker with them, I have never had to. Mine have all worked out of the box. All I have done is detail strip,clean and lube before first range trip. ( I do this with every new to me gun though..)

 

[Dave R]

My understanding is...the whole purpose of the Fluff & Buff is to smooth those parts that rub against each other as the pistol cycles. Which is exactly what happens when you shoot a few hundred rounds through it.

The one exception to that may be polishing the feed ramp. Not sure that smooths with lots of feeding...

Anyway, my point is that the F&B is an alternative to doing a normal break in. Just reduces the chance of misfeeds in those first rounds. At the cost of creating some "artificial wear".

 

[sm]

NO

 

[Lastryghts]

It's funny firestarter always comes around and starts bashing KT with all of these outragious claims, but has no support to back them up. What can you show us that backs up your statement that one in four has to be returned? Do you sit outside their factory? Are you their Fed Ex man? If one in four is such a dog it needs work well where are these 32,500 guns? Thats a lot of guns. Maybe there under the rug? I understand that people have problems with firearms(Some more than others) but why do you have such a chip on your shoulder against KT? Most people would post their opinion and be done, but to bash the company with such dedication. Why?

 

[coldshot03/04]

My P32 fired straight out of the box. No problems I have about 75- 100 rds through mine so far. No F&B for me.

But I recently made my first 2 visits to an indoor gun range. The owner there loans his P32 out for new buyers that are interested in the P32. He said that his P32 has around 1000rds through it. NO Problems!!!!!
I feel so much better after talking to him.

firestar aka kahrma Likes Llamas (Bersa)!!!!!!!!!LMAO!!!!!!!

 

[alamo]

Dave R has it right. At the price these pistols sell for, low $200s in a lot of places, they don't do the fit & finish you'd expect when buying a more expensive pistol. Having said that, most these days work fine out of the box. I just like to tinker with them, helped me learn about how pistols work.
Going to get a P-3AT soon, will do a F&B on it first vs. shooting a few hundred rounds to break it in.

 

[jon1481]

kel-tec quality----good

I've had a p-11 that was absolutley reliable out of the box. No f&b, didn't send it to Jack, no mods. except painting the sights. I sold it to help finance a colt lwt commander. Oh, I didn't like the shape of the trigger--that's all I could fault. Jon

 

[firestar]

This poor guy was asking a serious question about the quality of Kel-Tecs and I am afraid I was the only one that gave him an honest answer.

Flyer, why don't you tell him how many trigger axis you have broke on your P-32s? I think that is a quality control problem that could get you killed!

Do enough research and you will find that there are MANY MANY unsatisfied Kel-Tec customers out there. KT customer service is good and every one that ownes a Kel-Tec seems to get a chance to find out just how good first hand.

I would not feel right if someone I cared for was using a Kel-Tec to defend themselves. I would get them a better gun asap!

 

[huaco]

I have a few hundred rounds through mine without any problems. I thought about doing the F&B but when I looked at the parts closely there was nothing that looked like it needed improvement. A bit of Remington DriLube under the trigger transfer bar made the trigger a lot smoother and learning to squeeze the trigger continuously instead of staging it made a lot of difference in accuracy. It's my blah gun that is usually near me because it's so simple and I'm sure it will work.