Don't think a 1911 is for me.

[Nightcrawler]

My first handgun was a 1911. A Chuck Daly 4" that I bought when I was 18 (private sale). Thing seemed okay...sometimes the slide wouldn't go all the way back into battery, though I may have been limp-wristing. In any case I sold it and didn't own another handgun until last June, when I turned 21 and bought my CZ-97B.

Still, I've found myself wanting a 1911. Preferably a Psuedo-GI style. What I mean by this is a basic, parkerized gun, nothing fancy, and no silly front cocking serrations. Traditional spur hammer, but with decent sights and an ambi safety, since I'm left handed.

I've been considering a Springfield Mil-Spec or one of the New Rollstamp Colts.

However...

I handled two Springfields in a Gander Mountain today. I hadn't handled a 1911 in a long time, so I came at them with an open mind.

The two pistols were a Springfield Mil-Spec, for $499, and a Springfield Loaded Full Size, for $599. Both were parkerized.

I liked how the grip was nice and thin, for one. I could reach the slide release and magazine release with my trigger finger well enough.

The trigger on the Mil-Spec was unimpressive. I daresay my CZ-97 has a better single action trigger. The CZ has takeup, but it's smooth. The Mil-Spec's trigger was just creepy. The Loaded had a much better trigger.

On the loaded, I could reach the ambi safety fine with my left thumb. However, I found that with the safety down, the left-hand side of it pressed against my trigger finger, and it was immediately noticable and more than a little annoying. I don't have espeically large hands, though I find I handle fat-gripped guns like double stack .45s, and long-gripped guns, like Desert Eagles, fine. The only gun that I just can't seem to get comfy with (though I'd have to shoot one to be sure) is the large frame Glock.

So, I don't know. I can't properly use the 1911 without the ambi safety, yet the ambi safety bothers my trigger finger. The only option that I think would work would be to get a lefty-only safety, and I don't think anyone makes one.

Also, the grips on the Loaded were hideous. They looked nice, but the checkering was so sharp they felt like sandpaper. Since I like the look of smooth walnut grips better, they'd be the first thing I'd change out on a 1911.

So...while I've been wanting a 1911, given my limited funds, it just got bumped way down on my list of handguns to buy. I'm happy as can be with the CZ-97 for the time being.

 

[norielX]

My brother's a lefty as well, but he shoots with his right hand. Springfields are pretty sharp to the hand. I've got a Loaded stainless, and my brother has cut himself on the slide before. I'm going to limit my autoloader collection to .45 acp launchers. The 97 is a little big in the hand, but so is my G21. I'd recommend trying out as many 1911's out there because they are different from manufacturer to manufacturer. The good thing about 1911's is that you can tailor them to your needs. It's a very versatile gun.

 

[sm]

Nightcrawler, is a personal thing. I'm not offended being a 1911 fan. Again my criteria is the gun fits the shooter, reliable with ammo in a large enough caliber to acheive quick hits to stop an immediate action.

The guy with a CZ-97 with the above criteria met is smart.

Yeah I have 1911 styles,shot others and some just flat don't fit me LIKE I WANT. I don't want ambi's, nightsights, sharp checkered grips...For instance I do like the factory rubber grips used by Kimber...tried and used on other makers's guns.

Kimbers and Colts "fit" a bit different to me than the SA...haven't tried a newer one...heard they changed to less blockey and higher cut around trigger guard...gun shoots fine, just a little something about fit.

Old Mil-Specs by Colt for some reason- well fits- I just want a crisp 4# trigger...and I'll smoothe the checkering or replace with Kimbers rubber grips...Just me though.

 

[EJ]

Not for everybody

I love the 1911 -- but it really isn't for everyone--
In example-- The BHP is a great gun -- but it just doesn't fit me-- But I respect it and those who choose it-

Try different grips-- They make a big difference--

 

[10-Ring]

1911's are an acquired taste. They can be really nice & smooth operators....or you might end up w/ a money pit
Really, it depends on how patient you might need to be in regars to your firearms. You might end up w/ a gem and never have a worry or you might not.

 

[EJ]

Oops

Didn't even think of that aspect--
Guess I'm just sort of a tinkerer anyway-

You reminded me of my three boxes of spare 1911 parts compared to one for S&W wheelguns--

 

[CZF]

I wonder if you have shot many 1911s? Do you find that
they Twist with recoil?

I owned a series 80 Commander for a few years. Still
find the same thing when i handle and fire a 1911.

A 1911 grip angle tends to concentrate the pistol directly
over the web of my hand. The grip safety likes to pound
my hand during recoil after the gun twists a bit.

Actually, i don't recall much of a 'twist' with my old P220.

Something i don't get with my 97BSA. Maybe because it is
heavier? The thing is a real powder-puff to shoot. A $500
1/14 group (HANDGUNS testing) tack-driver.


The 97B design allows me to get more hand under the super nice
upswept beavertail.

I still like 1911s for the "ALL AMERICAN"image. A stoic history
of being a trusty manstopper. However, this Mystique is due
more to the Cartridge than the JMB design.

The 1911 isn't for me..the 97B suits me better.

 

[bad_dad_brad]

Sigh! 100 year old design. Hard to take down. Manual safety issues. Finicky. Difficult to master. And what is with that grip safety and that stupid barrel bushing? Even John Browning re-designed and the result was the BHP, a design that is the foundation of every modern (except Beretta's and HK's) semi-automatic handgun.

For everyday I will take a Glock anytime, everytime, over any mil-spec M1911, heck over any M1911 design.

My Dad was an ordinance expert at the end of WWII. He hated the M1911.

Called it a pig.

 

[Standing Wolf]

I finally bought another model 1911 a couple years ago. It's a Kimber. It's everything the model 1911 was supposed to be all along. It's a vast improvement upon Colts of twenty and thirty years ago.

That saidâ„¢, I still don't think a great deal of the .45 A.C.P. cartridge, and the gun itself seems clunky and old-fashioned. I know people swear by big, slow-moving cartridges, but as I recall from high school physics, momentum = mass x velocity squared. I don't mind the grip safety, but have never understood why it has a lump sticking out, and the extractor design strikes me as job security for gunsmiths and parts manufacturers.

 

[Nightcrawler]

This is not intended to be a 1911 bashing thread. From as near as I can tell without shooting one, I can simply state that I don't know if the 1911 fits my hand that well.

The Glock 21 is worse, by a LONG shot. It's the ONLY double stack .45 I've handled that is uncomfortable for me.

 

[BerettaNut92]

Nightcrawler, kinda in the same boat. While a 1911 is nice to have and I'll probably have another some day, it'll be there 'just because' while the Beretta and HKs handle most of my needs.

That Kimber Tactical looks pretty nice

 

[Navy joe]

Night- FWIW, stock Springfield triggers generally suck, get a trigger job. I'm a lefty and I generally chop the feft side safety arm off to next to nothing. A big component of fit is the mainspring housing, some like arched, some flat, some wedge type, try each. Then there is long trigger, short trigger, flat trigger, etc.

Why does it have to be one or the other with some people? I got Glocks, I got 1911s. If a 1911 is so antiquated, how come almost every other pistol out there incorporates it's design features, and every pistol is judged against an accuracy standard of a good accurized 1911?

 

[Nightcrawler]

*shrug* I like my CZ-97. I still might get a 1911, as a project gun; any stock 1911's going to require some fiddling with to get it just how I want it anyway. Don't have the funds for something like that just yet, so I'll be getting other things. It's good that I already have one full sized .45. My next semiauto purchase will likely be a compact .45. I'm considering the Sig P245.

 

[Sven]

My opinion:

If you are going to go for a 1911 then you should really step up and buy a quality 'instance' of this design.

One option with a lot of 'bang for the buck' is the Valtro:


Shown in Tucker Gun Leather

The Valtro is totally reliable and amazingly accurate. I love accurate guns with nice, crisp triggers and enough mass to absorb a bit of the recoil.

Then again, I drive an old motorcycle, while many pass me by on the lastest sport bike.

All boils down to personal preference, and how your hand/brain interact with the steel/plastic.

 

[Nightcrawler]

How much?

I consider an "affordable" auto pistol to be $350, like a Ruger. I suppose since I spent $589 for the CZ-97 (out the door), that makes a $600 affordable too. But anymore than that's going to give me some trouble these days, probably.

Does Valtro have a website?

 

[KillitnGrillit]

Triggers get better AFTER you shoot several rounds (called break in the pistol):banghead:

 

[Shmackey]

but as I recall from high school physics, momentum = mass x velocity squared

This has nothing to do with the thread, so I should leave it alone, but that formula is incorrect. Momentum is mass x velocity. You're thinking of kinetic energy (in which case you do want to square velocity but also multiply mass x 0.5).

 

[Sven]

The Valtro goes for around $1300.

She'll digest many times that cost in ammo before she moves on to her next home - maybe my (someday) grandchild.

Official Valtro Website
More Valtro Pix

 

[Nightcrawler]

Triggers get better AFTER you shoot several rounds (called break in the pistol)

You're banging your head against the wall with anger. My CZ had a nice trigger out of the box. Why should I drop $500 on a gun with a bad trigger? Because it might get better?

Some people just get mad when you don't want to buy their gun of choice, I guess.

Anway, I think that $1300 for the Valtro might be doable. But they all have commander hammers and extended beavertails. I know those are the most popular these days, but it's not what I want in my first 1911. Valtro lists the extended beavertail safety as a "near-custom" feature on their website, but you'll have a harder time finding a 1911 that DOESN'T have one of those. All of Springfield's models do, save the Mil-Spec. All Kimbers do.

I don't dig front cocking serrations, either. I fail to see their utility. They don't look bad, I just prefer a more traditional looking 1911.

I am interested in Valtro's shotgun, though...

 

[Bergeron]

You might consider simply grinding down the safety on the left side of the gun, it's not like you'll need it. Might look different, but if it helps...

You might want to check out the new rollmark Colts. I've heard many good things about the guns, and all you would need would be an ambi saftey. I don't think you'll find another 1911 with the spur hammer and no FCS besides the Springfields or the Colts. In my opinion, the Colts look and seem like a better pistol.

 

[Shane]

At one time, I've owned a Colt 1911. Didn't like it one bit. Reliability was terrible, and the grip shape never felt right. I've never liked the feel of straight backstraps. I sold it a few years ago, mostly because I didn't want to make a gunsmith rich to make it reliable.


I've shot Kimbers and Springfields, but never bought one. I did like the Springfields, simply because the ones I tried were reliable and had above average accuracy. The Kimbers I tried had the accuracy and trigger edge, but were not as reliable as the Springfields. I might eventually get a Springfield simply to have a 1911 for my collection (it is a great military firearm for many years--gotta eventually have another one in the collection), but I don't think I'll ever really be a big fan of the design. I'm sure they are great for many shooters, but they just do not excite me based on my experiences.

 

[Pendragon]

Nightcrawler,

As a person who owns a Valtro (and is still feeling the pain of buying one), I have never seen a finer pistol in my life.

It really is in a different league - the way a Ferrari or Aston Martin is in a different league than a Mustang or a Corvette.

You never hear people saying "why do I want a semi-hand built car that does 170mph (and then some) and costs $200,000 when I can buy a $25,000 Mustang and for another $10k, make it just as fast!"

You should call John Jardine - he is a lefty hisself and thats why the Valtro has the ambi as standard.

I do understand that some do not like the way the Valtro is setup (serrations, finish, safety, etc). IMHO, that is completely missing the point. The Valtro is so much more than the sum of its parts and specs - they are all the same because thats how Jardine can sell a $2,400 gun for $1200.

If you buy a Valtro, do it for the workmanship and because of John Jardine, but to nit pick the features is like bashing a Ferrari because of the limited color selection and you cannot get it with an automatic. Seriously - go buy a Camry/Kimber, whatever mundane car/gun you want.

 

[Nightcrawler]

So I guess I'm mundane. I drive an Oldsmobile, after all.

In truth, I shouldn't even be thinking about expanding my gun collection. I'm a college student, and most people simply assume that every spare dollar I have should go towards that. But, I think there's going to be plenty of "not having any gun money" when I get to law school, so I'm trying to enjoy my prosperity while I can. *shrug* You're only young once.

That said, $1300 is a lot of money. I'm going to need more than "it's a great gun" and "Mr. Jardine is a great guy" for that kind of money.

As for Kimber...not a chance. Ick.

Yes, I'm mundane. I'm not concerned with sports cars, but if I could get a US made muscle car to perform like a Ferrari for less money, then YES, that's what I'd do. I'm interested in a reliable service sidearm, not a work of art.

Maybe the Valtro is both. But I only require the former, and can get that and have money left over to, you know, eat with.

Geez, twice in one thread people have gotten mad at me. It's not my fault the Springfield Mil-spec I handled had a crappy trigger. It's not my fault the Valtro offers features I don't really want at a price I can't really afford. Don't be mad at me, be mad at the situation!

 

[Kahr carrier]

Personal Preference It all good 1911 isnt everbodys cup of tea.

 

[stubby]

I have had several 1911s (probably a dozen over the past 30 years) and have had some difficulty with almost all of them. I did have a Springfield that was perfect. I am fickle and trade guns like most people change their underwear (my wife's thought). I keep coming back to the 1911 as I find it to be the most beautiful design (possibly just nostalgia). It is the slimest 45 and makes for a great concealed carry gun in a major calibre. Just picked up an Officer's Model last week I probably could have bought a couple of cars with all the money I have spent trading over the years but I can honestly say that I have owned "most" pistols at one time or another. I just enjoy giving them all a try!