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Double Star AR 15 (Don't Buy!)

Discussion in 'Rifle Country' started by armysniper, Nov 13, 2012.

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  1. armysniper

    armysniper member

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    I purchased a used Double Star Ar-15 from a local shop. It looked brand new. The price was right with the features I wanted on a basic AR. The biggest thing I wanted was an AR 15 that was factory built and not a thrown together kit because I wanted something that would be covered under warranty.

    Double Star boasts a lifetime warranty.

    I took the rifle to the range, and after about 60 rounds down range the rifle jammed. I field stripped the rifle and discovered the buffer spring retention pin had popped out and broken the edge of the buffer tube that is supposed to hold it down. It is noteworthy to state that the rifle had a single point sling plate attached to it when I bought it.

    It turns out that the plate is not a factory part but was either installed by the rifle's previous owner or the gun shop I bought it from. This information was revealed when I contacted, "Doug," at Doublestar about the issue. He stated that my rifle shipped with the standard back plate. I showed him a picture of the damage and he stated that whoever installed the single point sling plate on the rifle did not screw the buffer tube far enough into the rifle.

    He further stated that because this part was put onto the rifle the, "ENTIRE." warranty for the whole rifle was voided. Furthermore, any accessory that is added or part replaced on the original set up of the rifle voids the warranty. This includes changing out the hand guards adding a riser, scope, or anything else other than what was shipped from the factory. I was shocked because I believe some rifles come with only the rail to add scopes. So if anything else go wrong with this rifle that happens to not be an easy fix because of poor materials, I am screwed.

    Here is my problem, the buffer tube was of such poor quality that the spring tension broke a piece of the tube off. I now know it was an easy fix, once you have the proper tools. But until I researched AR building, I had no clue how to fix it. But the point is, how cheap is the metal they use for it to chip and fail like that?

    Finally, their lifetime warranty is highly conditional. Any accessory or configuration must be added at their factory prior to receiving your rifle. What stinks, is I sold my M&P 15 sport to put money towards this rifle just so I could have a dust cover and forward assist, because the quality of this rifle is very poor compared to the sport.

    I thought about trading this rifle off to someone else, but I would not dare put this rifle into anyone else's hands just for them to have an issue and it fail them. It will be retired to my safe, and taken to the range on occasion. It most certainly will not be used as my MBR home defense rifle or otherwise.

    I am just sharing my experience because I feel strongly that their product is inferior to other rifles I have used or owned. Dont let their low price fool you into buying it.
     

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  2. Sport45

    Sport45 Member

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    Sorry, but I have to ask why? I can't imagine a time when a forward assist would do anything but get a jammed cartridge jammed worse and although my AR's have dust covers I can't remember the last time I closed one.

    Anyway, thanks for the heads up on the customer service issue here. Now get a new buffer tube put in that thing and see if you can get it working again.
     
  3. HorseSoldier

    HorseSoldier Member

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    I was taught to always use the forward assist after confirming a round in the chamber during a deliberate load and to always close the dust cover after engaging while scanning for additional threats. I can't speak for armysniper, but if his screen name is resume related, he's probably been exposed to the same manual of arms that I have.
     
  4. meanmrmustard

    meanmrmustard Member

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    Bummer dude. You'd have likely never needed the FA or DC, maybe, but the Doublestar was not worth.getting rid of a Sport. I'd be reaming them severely.
     
  5. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    That buffer tube is definitely not screwed in far enough. The only good news if they will not fix it (And I would be hot with the shop as well), is that a buffer tube and the little parts you need are relatively inexpensive and easy enough to install.

    Having new things break really bites.
     
  6. cfullgraf

    cfullgraf Member

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    There is always more to a warranty than the two words "lifetime warranty".

    At first blush, it does not mean "unlimited warranty".

    You should check their fine print.

    I can understand Double Star's position. If part of the rifle is modified, who knows what else has been tampered with.

    I would take it back to the gun store and complain. They should have inspected the rifle and made sure it was safe and properly assembled.

    But warranties on used stuff is highly variable.

    Remember, things are used for a reason, maybe not a bad reason, but a reason all the same.

    Anyway, looks like an easy fix and you may even be able to salvage the buffer tube. Take a small file and dress out the sharp areas of the broken area. Smooth the rough edges.

    Upon re-installation, make sure the break is located at away from the retaining pin.

    Buffer tubes are not that expensive though, so you may just get a new one.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2012
  7. BoilerUP

    BoilerUP Member

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    I'd start at the gun shop. Did they advertise the rifle as new or used? If used, then they should have inspected it; if new, that could go MANY different ways.
     
  8. Aaron Baker

    Aaron Baker Member

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    I can't speak to Doublestar's overall quality, but I'm just not sure what you want this company to do in this situation.

    You bought a rifle that was new-looking, but that you knew was used. Very few lifetime warranties are transferable. I would never assume one was unless I knew otherwise, so I wouldn't expect a manufacturer to stand behind a warranty on a product I bought used.

    And you're blaming them for using poor quality materials because one of those materials broke when it was improperly installed and used by someone other than the manufacturer? I don't know anything about metallurgy or "mil-spec" for a buffer tube, but should buffer tubes be designed in a way so that they don't break if they're improperly installed?

    AR15s are highly modifiable guns, but I think it's unreasonable to expect them to warranty anything on a gun that has been modified... for precisely this reason. Once someone else has monkeyed with it (the previous owner, in your case), things may break that wouldn't have broken if they were properly installed from the factory or by an authorized gunsmith.

    Now you're relegating a perfectly good gun to the safe because you won't trust it after replacing a $20 part. That also seems silly. If the components on a Doublestar were trustworthy enough to use as a HD gun before this incident, then they should be just as trustworthy after you properly repair what the previous owner (not the factory) screwed up.

    Your ultimate advice is not to let their low price fool you into thinking you're buying a high quality gun? That seems a bit obvious, but I still don't see anything low quality about their workmanship, since it's the previous owner's workmanship that is an issue.

    Just my opinion. I understand you're upset that your "new to you" rifle broke and no one wanted to fix it for free, but I don't think lashing out at the original manufacturer makes sense.

    Aaron
     
  9. Redlg155

    Redlg155 Member

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    I would definitely take it back to the shop if they sold it as "NEW". That should mean unfired except for factory testing and no previous owners. I suspect he sold you a "LNIB" or Like New Condition but used. I would also take it back if he stated that there was a lifetime warrant as most warranties are to the orginal owner and not transferable.

    I would put more fault on the amateurish installation of the sling plate than the buffer tube. Replace the buffer tube and and sling plate with a quality part and you should be good to go. Oh...and if you do the work yourself, do yourself and buy a quality armorers tool and not one of the cheap $5 castle nut tools. Been there, done that.
     
  10. taliv

    taliv Moderator

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    there are a lot of lessons to learn from this
     
  11. gotigers

    gotigers Member

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    It doesn't sound like DSC's fault. It sounds like you and the gun shop owner should be having a talk. Most warranties are similar.

    You could call it a lesson and buy a new buffer tube and small parts, then move along.

    I would still have a talk with the shop owner.
     
  12. viking499

    viking499 Member

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    I have had a Doublestar for 8+ years. Not a Hiccup or other problem. Would easily recommend them here.
     
  13. Walkalong

    Walkalong Moderator

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    Yea, if it was sold as used, you are at the mercy of the shop who sold it. I would not waste a lot of time with them. If they will make it good, great, if not, buy what you need and fix it.
     
  14. longdayjake

    longdayjake Member

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    I have a double star 6.5 grendel. Of the many AR's that I have owned, it is probably the most solid. But then again, I bought mine direct and not from some corner shop.
     
  15. Kyle M.

    Kyle M. Member

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    I had one for for six months and 3,000 rounds of steel cased silver bear not one problem with mine. My cousin wanted one really bad so I made her a good deal on it. It would seem to me this is one of those things that sometimes happens with used guns, fix it and know what to look for next time. I give every used gun I intend to purchase a good going over with a fine tooth comb before I buy. If the dealer you got it from is at all reputable he'll try to make it right whether it be replacing the buffer tube or directing you to a gunsmith or parts supplier nearby.
     
  16. Jackal

    Jackal Member

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    The buffer tube is fine and can be reused (going from the very minimal "ding" in the picture). If there's a burr, smooth it with a file. Just get a new retainer and screw that bugger in 1-2 more turns. Problem solved, for about $5. Agreed, its not Double Stars problem that you purchased a used rifle that was monkeyed with.
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2012
  17. MachIVshooter

    MachIVshooter Member

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    No. That damage occurred because the buffer detent pin was not retained, and was being battered back and forth. Whoever installed that tube did not know what he/she was doing.

    A new, US-made buffer tube is $20 (PSA, DSA, UTG, the list goes on). Just measue yours to find out if it's mil spec (1.15") or commercial (1.17"). Commercial stocks are sloppy on mil spec tubes, and mil spec stocks won't go on commercial tubes.

    Buffer detent pin is $1

    Detent pin spring is $1

    A decent stock wrench is $10 (Tapco Intrafuse)& up, but I'm sure a local shop would let you use theirs to do the swap on site. It's a 5 minute fix.

    How exactly would he do that? Buffer tubes can only install one way.
     
  18. armysniper

    armysniper member

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    Thank you for the suggestions on fixing my issue. My main reasons for this post still are:

    1) How come I have to come on community board to find solutions instead at least being offered some from the manufacturer. I like most people do not know all the ins and outs of building an AR 15 nor should anyone scoff like I should have known.

    2) The AR market is so competitive that what skin would it have been off of their rears to help a customer.

    3) Hell yeah, a lot of lessons were learned and I want to pass my mistakes onto others so that they may learn.
     
  19. tarakian

    tarakian Member

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    It is not the manufacturer's job to teach gunsmithing to it's customers. Any advice/instruction they gave you could leave them open to a lawsuit if you aren't any better at gunsmithing than the previous owner. This is something you should have discussed with the shop you bought it from. If they didn't know how to fix it, they should direct you to someone who can. You really should have the entire gun checked out by a professional. You never know what else the previous owner may have modified badly.
     
  20. fanchisimo

    fanchisimo Member

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    In this case I can see Double Star not honoring the warranty for this case since the modification was an individual. However, if it is as you say and they would not honor a mechanical malfunction if you mount something superfluous like a scope or handguard, that doesn't sound like a great warranty. I know if something like a bolt carrier broke and they wouldn't replace it cause I put a RDS on it, I would be upset.
     
  21. ApacheCoTodd

    ApacheCoTodd Member

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    I'm a fan of neither Double Star nor Doug but I don't see them being outa line on backing away from modified - and poorly at that - rifles.

    I'd have taken it back, charged you for non standard work or repairs and pointed out your purchasing errors to you but I still get them/him making their decision too.
     
  22. JFtheGR8

    JFtheGR8 Member

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    A non-firing inspection period is usually customary when purchasing a used firearm so it can be inspected by competent hands such as a gunsmith. Make sure to take advantage of such a policy in the future. If the seller won't agree to such then don't buy from them. I'd consider myself lucky that it's a cheap fix. Get the rest of the gun checked over to avoid a catastrophic failure from possibly happening but I think you'll be good.


    Posted from Thehighroad.org App for Android
     
  23. pseudonymity

    pseudonymity Member

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    This. The extension was not installed properly and if it was not factory work, it is hard to see why they would warranty the work of another party.

    Any damage looks really minimal - just get a new retainer and spring if needed, loosen the castle nut and thread the extension in another 2-3 turns. If it is slightly too long and covers the center of the pin, use a small rat tail file to file a small notch in the extension tube. It is disappointing that you did not get a full factory build, but I think your issue is really with the seller, not the factory.

    Like this.
     
  24. Aaron Baker

    Aaron Baker Member

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    Don't forget to stake the castle nut when you're done. It's easy, and it keeps the nut from backing off. (Which could potentially cause this problem again.)
     
  25. Zombiphobia

    Zombiphobia Member

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    Well, my plans for buying Double Star parts to build an AR have just flown out the window never to be seen or heard form again.

    Thanks for sharing, OP, that's some wretched customer service and sounds like an excuse to screw customers. Makes me think their products must be crap for them to so quickly void a warranty.
     
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