EAA Witness in 10mm
- Thread starter Lamont
- Start date
- Status
raskolnikov_22
Member
- Joined
- May 16, 2009
- Messages
- 210
Closest thing there is to a Bren Ten this side of $2,000.
ReloaderFred
Member
I have several of them. Do you specific questions?
Fred
Fred
hardluk1
member
If you are look'n for a great shooting pistol then go ahead a get the witness 10mm. I never wanted a 10mm but it is the gun for it . There were problems with some earlier models but the EA serial number guns are good to go. The witness elit match is a single action not a double and can be bought for under 500 bucks out the door. Lots of shooters will buy the 40,take the strip out of the mags and load the 40's hot and long. Check out henningshootsguns and brian enos eaa forum for more info on these guns and henning for acc,custom and parts to upgrade.
Get one and you'll be happy.
OurSafeHome.net
Member
Do you think that Colonel Cooper is looking down and smiling at these developments.
Gunfighter123
Member
They are a BEST BUY for the money and quality !!!!
yeah my questions are:
-are they a good gun to carry in the wods to protect from black bear.
-are they a good gun for conceal and carry.
-ive heard they have a issue with cracked slides, is there an issue with that.
-is the recoil comparable to a .357 mag.
thanks in advance for the info.
-are they a good gun to carry in the wods to protect from black bear.
-are they a good gun for conceal and carry.
-ive heard they have a issue with cracked slides, is there an issue with that.
-is the recoil comparable to a .357 mag.
thanks in advance for the info.
ReloaderFred
Member
I live in bear country, and have them in my yard on occasion. I do carry one of my 10mm Witnesses when we walk the dogs behind the house in the woods. I've seen a bear killed with a 9mm, but that doesn't mean it's the best gun for the job. When the bears start to get aggressive around here, I carry my S&W .41 Magnum. Other times I'm comfortable with the 10mm.
They are a comparatively large gun, since they hold 16 rounds of 10mm. The Compact is slightly smaller and holds 10 rounds of 10mm.
They are a well built firearm, and you get a lot of gun for the money. The slide issues seem to be occuring with the newer, rounded slides. All my Witnesses are older ones and I've had no issues with any of them that I couldn't correct myself in a couple of minutes.
The recoil impulse isn't bad at all, especially in the full size Witness. It's slightly sharper in the Compact, but still not bad. My .41 Magnum recoils much harder with full power loads.
I have Witnesses in ten different calibers, some of which aren't offered by the factory, so I do believe they're good guns.
Hope this helps.
Fred
They are a comparatively large gun, since they hold 16 rounds of 10mm. The Compact is slightly smaller and holds 10 rounds of 10mm.
They are a well built firearm, and you get a lot of gun for the money. The slide issues seem to be occuring with the newer, rounded slides. All my Witnesses are older ones and I've had no issues with any of them that I couldn't correct myself in a couple of minutes.
The recoil impulse isn't bad at all, especially in the full size Witness. It's slightly sharper in the Compact, but still not bad. My .41 Magnum recoils much harder with full power loads.
I have Witnesses in ten different calibers, some of which aren't offered by the factory, so I do believe they're good guns.
Hope this helps.
Fred
Mossyrock
Member
If you get one, take into account that they are SEVERELY under-sprung from the factory for full-power 10mm loads.
Ash
Member
Severely is an exaggeration.
Ash
Ash
The newer Witness with the rounded slide top cannot take the beating of full house 10 mm loads...eventually they crack the slide even if you use stiffer Wolff springs.
Customer Service is horrible or, better, non existent.
EAA user manual severely prohibits the use of what they call "high velocity high pressure ammunition", I did talk with their gunsmith and he told me categorically, no Corbon, no Double Tasp no Buffalo Bore otherwise no warranty.
They can only realiably use the toned down "FBI loads" 10 mm...ballistically equivalent to the 40 S&W.
So, on paper it looks like a bargain...in reality is not...I traded mine after only few months.
Tanfoglio makes great pistols, potentially...they need to find a better importer than EAA (even Hi-Point run rings around them in terms of quality of service) and toughen up the pistol slide for full house 10 mm use.
Until they do that, I'll pass...
Customer Service is horrible or, better, non existent.
EAA user manual severely prohibits the use of what they call "high velocity high pressure ammunition", I did talk with their gunsmith and he told me categorically, no Corbon, no Double Tasp no Buffalo Bore otherwise no warranty.
They can only realiably use the toned down "FBI loads" 10 mm...ballistically equivalent to the 40 S&W.
So, on paper it looks like a bargain...in reality is not...I traded mine after only few months.
Tanfoglio makes great pistols, potentially...they need to find a better importer than EAA (even Hi-Point run rings around them in terms of quality of service) and toughen up the pistol slide for full house 10 mm use.
Until they do that, I'll pass...
Last edited:
jfh
Member.
I'm another satisfied owner. I have had both large and small/large frames from the early mid Nineties, a 10mm top end from two years ago, and a 'newest' rounded-slide Elite Match 10mm from about eighteen months ago.
The Nineties guns were a .45ACP and a .40S&W Carry Comp. Both were excellent--and, IMO, the Carry Comp (with or without the comp; I bought an aftermarket barrel) is what a 1911 Commander should be.
As for the cracking slides issue: if I have it right, the 'latest' round slide is beefier than the first round slide. I haven't followed the full-bore 10mm load issues, as I reload and have found a recipe that scarily accurate in both my EM and my Kimber 10mm. That load--a 180 running about 1100 fps--works fine with the factory spring.
As for the OP's queries:
1. I'd carry mine for black bear protection.
2. They're too big a gun for concealed carry--41 oz, and a big frame.
3. There's possibly justification for the 'cracked slides' issue--see above comments.
4. The grip design makes them much softer-recoiling than 357 loads from an N Frame (for example).
Last point--hold one before you buy; I personally think you need big hands. (Mine are 'just right')--and of course, the 1911-ergonomics are perfect.
Jim H.
The Nineties guns were a .45ACP and a .40S&W Carry Comp. Both were excellent--and, IMO, the Carry Comp (with or without the comp; I bought an aftermarket barrel) is what a 1911 Commander should be.
As for the cracking slides issue: if I have it right, the 'latest' round slide is beefier than the first round slide. I haven't followed the full-bore 10mm load issues, as I reload and have found a recipe that scarily accurate in both my EM and my Kimber 10mm. That load--a 180 running about 1100 fps--works fine with the factory spring.
As for the OP's queries:
1. I'd carry mine for black bear protection.
2. They're too big a gun for concealed carry--41 oz, and a big frame.
3. There's possibly justification for the 'cracked slides' issue--see above comments.
4. The grip design makes them much softer-recoiling than 357 loads from an N Frame (for example).
Last point--hold one before you buy; I personally think you need big hands. (Mine are 'just right')--and of course, the 1911-ergonomics are perfect.
Jim H.
I don't know the latest development but the user manual statement "No High Velocity, +P, High Pressure ammo allowed" is the widest blanket "cover my ass" statement I ever seen in a manual.
This is the conversation I had with their head gunsmith:
EAA Gunsmith: No CORBON, no Double Tap, no Buffalo Bore otherwise your warranty will be voided.
Me: But these ammo are perfectly SAAMI compliant for 10 mm
EAA Gunsmith (annoyed): No they are high pressure sir....
Me: I did talk to their CS and they said they are within SAAMI specs and if I can only use Winchester, Remington, or Federal, they are loaded way down 10 mm specs
EAA Gunsmith (very annoyed): Why you need that kind of power sir?? The regular ammo is perfectly fine for personal defense purpose.
Me: Well I need for wildlife defense...and what no high velocity rounds means anyway?? a 10 mm is high velocity, by definition, for a pistol round
EAA Gunsmith (huffing condescendingly): For bear defense you should use something different, not a pistol...and high velocity means that, high velocity...
At this point the call was over and so my EAA Witness ownewrship experience...I traded the pistol 3 days later and never looked back...sorry but I cannot trust this company after a conversation like that....
And if I want a power level of a 40 S&W I'll get a 40 (cheaper, easier to find and more selection) and this is what I did...my Bersa Thunder 40 is +P rated, specifically mentioned in the user manual...
Infact, that's is almost 40 S&W power level, not a true full house 10 mm...
This is the conversation I had with their head gunsmith:
EAA Gunsmith: No CORBON, no Double Tap, no Buffalo Bore otherwise your warranty will be voided.
Me: But these ammo are perfectly SAAMI compliant for 10 mm
EAA Gunsmith (annoyed): No they are high pressure sir....
Me: I did talk to their CS and they said they are within SAAMI specs and if I can only use Winchester, Remington, or Federal, they are loaded way down 10 mm specs
EAA Gunsmith (very annoyed): Why you need that kind of power sir?? The regular ammo is perfectly fine for personal defense purpose.
Me: Well I need for wildlife defense...and what no high velocity rounds means anyway?? a 10 mm is high velocity, by definition, for a pistol round
EAA Gunsmith (huffing condescendingly): For bear defense you should use something different, not a pistol...and high velocity means that, high velocity...
At this point the call was over and so my EAA Witness ownewrship experience...I traded the pistol 3 days later and never looked back...sorry but I cannot trust this company after a conversation like that....
And if I want a power level of a 40 S&W I'll get a 40 (cheaper, easier to find and more selection) and this is what I did...my Bersa Thunder 40 is +P rated, specifically mentioned in the user manual...
Infact, that's is almost 40 S&W power level, not a true full house 10 mm...
Last edited:
jfh
Member.
saturno_v: I may be wrong, but there appears to me to be an underlying 'repulse' to my comments in my previous post. I want you to know that in no way am I trying to minimize either the points you are making, nor with any other issues others have had with that pistol.
After I bought the Elite Match in January 2008, I wrote up a 'mini-review' of the Elite Match and added information on the Kimber ST II 10mm I had gotten six months earlier. At that time, I chased down some of the customer dissatisfaction issues. They're valid, alright--which is why I did not question your statements. It was at that time--i.e., chasing down the 'new slide' revisions that I found a url / link / post about the 'third' slide revision that is beefier. I didn't keep a link to it, however--maybe it was on Henning's site.
FWIW, I still have a few boxes of the 'original' (Norma) 200-gr ammo, and I have shot a few rounds of it in the EM. For full-power loads, my Elite Match definitely is undersprung. As for the 'accuracy' recipe--it really doesn't matter to me whether or not it is 'full power.' I no longer necessarily enjoy running full-power loads and for my range use, I prefer an 'accuracy' load. Were I carrying it for (animal) defense, I probably would load the hot (but still SAMMI-spec) ammo--and respring the gun. (Personally I carry a lightweight j-frame, stoked with 'FBI 800' loads.)
The few contacts I have had with EAA (orders only, no service) have been pleasant--but your conversation with the 'smith does suggest that he is not customer-service oriented, to say the least. (That's probably why he is the 'smith.) Others have reported similar-type conversations, too--so, the EAA operation is a bit sketchy, AFAICT.
I also take manual / mfr / importer claims (or disclaimers) with a grain of salt. There are no SAAMI specs for "plus-pressure" for rounds such as .40S&W, 10mm, and so on. These statements are really the result of somebody in charge of manual writing who is either ignorant of the appropriate specifications or (more likely) the desire to produce a 'one-size fits all' manual for a given product line.
But, all of these are observations, and part of a general discussion--and not an attempt to argue with you.
Jim H.
After I bought the Elite Match in January 2008, I wrote up a 'mini-review' of the Elite Match and added information on the Kimber ST II 10mm I had gotten six months earlier. At that time, I chased down some of the customer dissatisfaction issues. They're valid, alright--which is why I did not question your statements. It was at that time--i.e., chasing down the 'new slide' revisions that I found a url / link / post about the 'third' slide revision that is beefier. I didn't keep a link to it, however--maybe it was on Henning's site.
FWIW, I still have a few boxes of the 'original' (Norma) 200-gr ammo, and I have shot a few rounds of it in the EM. For full-power loads, my Elite Match definitely is undersprung. As for the 'accuracy' recipe--it really doesn't matter to me whether or not it is 'full power.' I no longer necessarily enjoy running full-power loads and for my range use, I prefer an 'accuracy' load. Were I carrying it for (animal) defense, I probably would load the hot (but still SAMMI-spec) ammo--and respring the gun. (Personally I carry a lightweight j-frame, stoked with 'FBI 800' loads.)
The few contacts I have had with EAA (orders only, no service) have been pleasant--but your conversation with the 'smith does suggest that he is not customer-service oriented, to say the least. (That's probably why he is the 'smith.) Others have reported similar-type conversations, too--so, the EAA operation is a bit sketchy, AFAICT.
I also take manual / mfr / importer claims (or disclaimers) with a grain of salt. There are no SAAMI specs for "plus-pressure" for rounds such as .40S&W, 10mm, and so on. These statements are really the result of somebody in charge of manual writing who is either ignorant of the appropriate specifications or (more likely) the desire to produce a 'one-size fits all' manual for a given product line.
But, all of these are observations, and part of a general discussion--and not an attempt to argue with you.
Jim H.
Jim no problem at all..sorry if I came out a bit "strong", I apologize...I'm just very dissatisfied with EAA and I'm glad that the Witness works for you..
Trust me, I "wanted to like" that pistol very much...I enjoyed the look and feel and the somewhat unique cartridge.
Yes I know about user manuals...probably they are not written by "experts"...Bersa mention approved use of +P ammo probably because the manual is the same for both, the Thunder 9, 40 and 45.
But I have to tell you that the EAA manual statement is the most vague I ever seen in the industry.
My new Bersa Thunder 40 had a plastic red label looped around the trigger guard that said "Tested with overpressure ammo" so I assumed that Bersa prooftest every individual pistol (the "famous" 125% test)....it makes me feel a bit more confident about the company.
I agree that for range use you do not need all that thump...but if I buy a 10 mm is because I want that kind of power when I need it, otherwise I can be perfectly happy with a 40.
I know personally of many people that had problems with EAA and cracked slides with SAAMI compliant ammo...
If things change I will be a Tanfoglio customer again!!!
Trust me, I "wanted to like" that pistol very much...I enjoyed the look and feel and the somewhat unique cartridge.
Yes I know about user manuals...probably they are not written by "experts"...Bersa mention approved use of +P ammo probably because the manual is the same for both, the Thunder 9, 40 and 45.
But I have to tell you that the EAA manual statement is the most vague I ever seen in the industry.
My new Bersa Thunder 40 had a plastic red label looped around the trigger guard that said "Tested with overpressure ammo" so I assumed that Bersa prooftest every individual pistol (the "famous" 125% test)....it makes me feel a bit more confident about the company.
I agree that for range use you do not need all that thump...but if I buy a 10 mm is because I want that kind of power when I need it, otherwise I can be perfectly happy with a 40.
I know personally of many people that had problems with EAA and cracked slides with SAAMI compliant ammo...
If things change I will be a Tanfoglio customer again!!!
ReloaderFred
Member
saturno v,
You base your observations on the ownership of one gun, and with a conversation with Paul, the infamous gunsmith at EAA. I'm sorry you had a bad experience with Paul. I've also had several conversations with him, both in person and on the phone. I no longer speak to him, period, and I've gotten apologies from other EAA employees for his attitude.
I base my observations on owning numerous Witness handguns in the following calibers:
.22 Long Rifle
9x19
9x21
9x23
.38 Super
357 Sig
9x25 Dillon
.40 S&W
10mm
.41 AE
.45 ACP
In some of those calibers, I have several pistols, and the 10mm is one caliber that I have several in, including both fullsize and compact. I've put thousands of rounds through my Witnesses over the years and I've never had a slide crack or any other problem that couldn't be taken care of in a couple of minutes by me.
I try not to base my opinions on a brief ownership of one sample. I prefer to base my opinions on as much information as I can gather, which I feel I've done concerning the Witness line of handguns.
I notice that you don't detail any problems you may have had with the pistol that you briefly owned, only that you didn't like the wording of the owner's manual and your conversation with Paul, who is known for his poor attitude. As jfh pointed out, there is no SAAMI specification for a +P loading in the 10mm cartridge, so the wording in the manual is a moot point.
Hope this helps.
Fred
You base your observations on the ownership of one gun, and with a conversation with Paul, the infamous gunsmith at EAA. I'm sorry you had a bad experience with Paul. I've also had several conversations with him, both in person and on the phone. I no longer speak to him, period, and I've gotten apologies from other EAA employees for his attitude.
I base my observations on owning numerous Witness handguns in the following calibers:
.22 Long Rifle
9x19
9x21
9x23
.38 Super
357 Sig
9x25 Dillon
.40 S&W
10mm
.41 AE
.45 ACP
In some of those calibers, I have several pistols, and the 10mm is one caliber that I have several in, including both fullsize and compact. I've put thousands of rounds through my Witnesses over the years and I've never had a slide crack or any other problem that couldn't be taken care of in a couple of minutes by me.
I try not to base my opinions on a brief ownership of one sample. I prefer to base my opinions on as much information as I can gather, which I feel I've done concerning the Witness line of handguns.
I notice that you don't detail any problems you may have had with the pistol that you briefly owned, only that you didn't like the wording of the owner's manual and your conversation with Paul, who is known for his poor attitude. As jfh pointed out, there is no SAAMI specification for a +P loading in the 10mm cartridge, so the wording in the manual is a moot point.
Hope this helps.
Fred
hardluk1
member
LAMOUNT I do know that atleast on the MATCH you do NOT get the small round top that saturno v seems to have stuck in his mind. I do have a 9mm converstion off a steel full size and it is a round top. LAMOUNT do as i said and go to the BRAIN ENOS EAA furom and HENNINGSHOOTSGUNS site and find guys that really do own and shoot them a damd site more than over hear. Now i love mine and have also had my rounds with some real big name guns in the past that some just say are the best thing ever. To each his own..
Last edited:
Ash
Member
The reason they do not approve high-pressure rounds is CYA. They have never approved high pressure ammo because they have a lifetime warranty. IF you feed any pistol, ANY pistol, a regular diet of high pressure rounds, it will wear out faster than a pistol fed standard ammo.
I personally don't like EAA at all - AT ALL! But I do like the Tanfoglio product. If I could get a Tanfoglio without the EAA stamp (and still be 45acp) I would do it. There are a few Springfield P9's out there, but they have been around $700 and that is just too much for me. I trust my Witness in spite of EAA. I carry my Witness (open carry) more often than I carry my CZ-75 in the wilderness or swamp.
Ash
I personally don't like EAA at all - AT ALL! But I do like the Tanfoglio product. If I could get a Tanfoglio without the EAA stamp (and still be 45acp) I would do it. There are a few Springfield P9's out there, but they have been around $700 and that is just too much for me. I trust my Witness in spite of EAA. I carry my Witness (open carry) more often than I carry my CZ-75 in the wilderness or swamp.
Ash
Ash
Sorry but this doesn't make much sense....every cartridge has a SAAMI specification...if a gun is built to withstand the pressure of a specific cartridge it should last very long time with a steady diet of it, period...yes it will probably last even more if you use lower pressure ammo but that is not the point....if it is built to spec, shooting ammo within that limit should not create any problem whatsoever in the long run...I know of Python 357 Mag that did shoot more than 10K of full house loads without a hiccup....
ReloaderFred
My ownership experience was brief but painful...I had chronic jamming problems (FTE, FTF, stovepiping, you name it....) that were never completely solved changing the magazine spring, the recoil spring and buffing and polishing the feed ramp....the slide cracked at the second box of Double Tap.....maybe I got a lemon but EAA wasn't very supportive....
2 other guys, just at the range where I go, had cracked slides (after few boxes of full spec ammo) and I heard of several other cases of similar problems (cracking and jamming issues)
So I base my opinions on observation of other people's experiences as well, not just mine.
Again, if you are happy with your Witness I'm very glad for you..it did not work for me.
By the way, for me 10 mm Auto full house means 180 gr. in the 1300-1350 fps range...not 1100 or so...when I will see a Witness capable of going box after box of these without problems like my friend's Glock 20 I will buy one (new or used properly "tuned up" for the purpose) until then i will sit on the sidelines
I do want a DA/SA, all metal, double stack, full size, full SAAMI specs capable 10 mm Auto pistol..I want one very much...I been close to buy a Glock 20 twice for lack of such pistol but I "cannot" like Glocks..in one occasion I had the greens already in my hand and playing with the Austrian pistol in my hand I just could not do the deal eventually....
At the moment I'm on the prowl for a good used S&W 1006...I know it's not double stack but at least is DA/SA.
If anyone of you know of a used Witness tweaked and capable of shooting the kind of loads I mentioned before with no consequences (no just a couple of boxes) and no jamming for sale, please let me know and I could buy it.....at this point I do not care about EAA Customer Service...
Sorry but this doesn't make much sense....every cartridge has a SAAMI specification...if a gun is built to withstand the pressure of a specific cartridge it should last very long time with a steady diet of it, period...yes it will probably last even more if you use lower pressure ammo but that is not the point....if it is built to spec, shooting ammo within that limit should not create any problem whatsoever in the long run...I know of Python 357 Mag that did shoot more than 10K of full house loads without a hiccup....
ReloaderFred
My ownership experience was brief but painful...I had chronic jamming problems (FTE, FTF, stovepiping, you name it....) that were never completely solved changing the magazine spring, the recoil spring and buffing and polishing the feed ramp....the slide cracked at the second box of Double Tap.....maybe I got a lemon but EAA wasn't very supportive....
2 other guys, just at the range where I go, had cracked slides (after few boxes of full spec ammo) and I heard of several other cases of similar problems (cracking and jamming issues)
So I base my opinions on observation of other people's experiences as well, not just mine.
Again, if you are happy with your Witness I'm very glad for you..it did not work for me.
By the way, for me 10 mm Auto full house means 180 gr. in the 1300-1350 fps range...not 1100 or so...when I will see a Witness capable of going box after box of these without problems like my friend's Glock 20 I will buy one (new or used properly "tuned up" for the purpose) until then i will sit on the sidelines
I do want a DA/SA, all metal, double stack, full size, full SAAMI specs capable 10 mm Auto pistol..I want one very much...I been close to buy a Glock 20 twice for lack of such pistol but I "cannot" like Glocks..in one occasion I had the greens already in my hand and playing with the Austrian pistol in my hand I just could not do the deal eventually....
At the moment I'm on the prowl for a good used S&W 1006...I know it's not double stack but at least is DA/SA.
If anyone of you know of a used Witness tweaked and capable of shooting the kind of loads I mentioned before with no consequences (no just a couple of boxes) and no jamming for sale, please let me know and I could buy it.....at this point I do not care about EAA Customer Service...
Last edited:
Ash
Member
Saturn,
What I said made perfect sense. SOP at EAA is not to support +P ammo - or anything that sounds like it. Of course Double Tap produces ammo within SAAMI specs, but they also produce +P ammo. When you call up and ask about using brands known for producing high-pressure ammo (and each of the brands you mention have made their names producing +P ammo), EAA CYA's. They likely get questions about Corbon +P ammo all the time. If you shoot SAAMI-spec ammo, the warranty is covered. If you shoot beyond SAAMI spec, it is not.
When you mention +P ammo producers, EAA assumes +P ammo - that is evident.
And, it also makes perfect sense that +P ammo will wear a firearm out faster than standard SAAMI spec ammo. By the way, many manufacturers do not warrant +P ammo.
This is not a defense of EAA, merely an understanding.
Ash
What I said made perfect sense. SOP at EAA is not to support +P ammo - or anything that sounds like it. Of course Double Tap produces ammo within SAAMI specs, but they also produce +P ammo. When you call up and ask about using brands known for producing high-pressure ammo (and each of the brands you mention have made their names producing +P ammo), EAA CYA's. They likely get questions about Corbon +P ammo all the time. If you shoot SAAMI-spec ammo, the warranty is covered. If you shoot beyond SAAMI spec, it is not.
When you mention +P ammo producers, EAA assumes +P ammo - that is evident.
And, it also makes perfect sense that +P ammo will wear a firearm out faster than standard SAAMI spec ammo. By the way, many manufacturers do not warrant +P ammo.
This is not a defense of EAA, merely an understanding.
Ash
ReloaderFred
Member
saturno v wrote:
"every cartridge has a SAAMI specification..."
That's not true at all. There are numerous cartridges where there aren't any SAAMI specifications. For instance, there are no SAAMI specs for either the 9x21 or 9x25 Dillon. There are others, but those two I know for sure.
Hope this helps.
Fred
By the way, none of my guns are for sale, and that includes my several Witness 10mm's, Colt Delta Elites or my S&W 1006. And especially my S&W 610! Sorry.
"every cartridge has a SAAMI specification..."
That's not true at all. There are numerous cartridges where there aren't any SAAMI specifications. For instance, there are no SAAMI specs for either the 9x21 or 9x25 Dillon. There are others, but those two I know for sure.
Hope this helps.
Fred
By the way, none of my guns are for sale, and that includes my several Witness 10mm's, Colt Delta Elites or my S&W 1006. And especially my S&W 610! Sorry.
ReloaderFred
Yes some rare cartridges maybe do not have SAAMI specs but the most common do, so my statement was not totally correct, your are right.
The 9 X 21 IMI, while very popular in Europe, especially in the countries which ban the use of military cartridges for civilians (for example Italy and France), is basically unknown in America so probably this is the reason why a SAAMI spec for that particular caliber doesn't exist...the 338 Lapua, as far as I know, doesn't have a published SAAMI spec either.
Ash
What you say is probably right, but to me is unacceptable...they did not say (the gunsmith refused to say) that their pistol is fine within the SAAMI specs for the 10 mm Auto...they used that blanket statement and singled out certain manufacturers (by the way no one of these ammo companies produce overpressure 10 mm ammo, they do for few other calibers)....EAA keep the subject vague on purpose, as you said, as CYA strategy.
I made that same call to Glock Customer Service when I was considering buying a Glock 20 and their CS representative told me "as long as the ammo is SAAMI compliant, you can fire it without problems"...same for Kimber...that is the kind of answer I want to hear....
Regards
Yes some rare cartridges maybe do not have SAAMI specs but the most common do, so my statement was not totally correct, your are right.
The 9 X 21 IMI, while very popular in Europe, especially in the countries which ban the use of military cartridges for civilians (for example Italy and France), is basically unknown in America so probably this is the reason why a SAAMI spec for that particular caliber doesn't exist...the 338 Lapua, as far as I know, doesn't have a published SAAMI spec either.
Ash
What you say is probably right, but to me is unacceptable...they did not say (the gunsmith refused to say) that their pistol is fine within the SAAMI specs for the 10 mm Auto...they used that blanket statement and singled out certain manufacturers (by the way no one of these ammo companies produce overpressure 10 mm ammo, they do for few other calibers)....EAA keep the subject vague on purpose, as you said, as CYA strategy.
I made that same call to Glock Customer Service when I was considering buying a Glock 20 and their CS representative told me "as long as the ammo is SAAMI compliant, you can fire it without problems"...same for Kimber...that is the kind of answer I want to hear....
Regards
hardluk1
member
saturno v You did change recoil spring for your +P 10mm rounds right ??? Just like 1911 shooters do to match power levels. Some don't and have problems brake'n parts . Bottom line ,you don't like the witness line ,,,go away so those that do can go about enjoying the pistols. Or get a non round top like the match. How old were your pistols ,what models. There are some glock shooters that know the stock barrels don't fully suport the case's and will blow out the bottoms when hot loads are shot in some calibers. Listening to you is kinda like listening to someone complane about how some model 29 s&w 44mags when shooting hot loads can ,will and do open the cylinder or back up a round. Buy a new up graded model and shoot the damd thing or buy something else.
Hardluk
I just report my experience when anybody ask advice about the EAA Witness.
So they can read both the good and the bad stories...they can listen to both sides.
If your read my post before I said that I changed the recoil spring (Wolff)
I bought my Witness new in December 2007.
The occasional problem with the Mod 29, which I happen to own one, was during the use of heavy bullets (300 gr. and over), if you shoot hot loads full SAAMI specs of 240-250 gr. you would not experience any cylinder issue.
And when did happen it did not break anything, certainly less serious than cracking a slide.
I just report my experience when anybody ask advice about the EAA Witness.
So they can read both the good and the bad stories...they can listen to both sides.
If your read my post before I said that I changed the recoil spring (Wolff)
I bought my Witness new in December 2007.
The occasional problem with the Mod 29, which I happen to own one, was during the use of heavy bullets (300 gr. and over), if you shoot hot loads full SAAMI specs of 240-250 gr. you would not experience any cylinder issue.
And when did happen it did not break anything, certainly less serious than cracking a slide.
Last edited:
- Status
