Emergency Vehicle Part II

[BRONZ]

Just wanted everbodys idea on a small atv/quad runner for a bug out vehicle.

All the movies you see the roads are packed with cars with no one going anywhere. The 50,000 dollar pickup or the 100, 000 dollar camper they all need a basic road to travel on and if everybody is on the road at the same time well!!! On the Sept. 11, 2001 the Gov't gave the word to evac Washington and what happen, you got stuck in taffic and hoped the worst was over. But if it a real shtf situation and you know the traffic is just the start,waiting in line won't work.

My basic idea would be to have 4x4 atv that was all tricked out.
extra gas can on the back rack, extra mounted wheel, extra battery, extra starter and switch. Guns racks that mount towards the ground.( I hate to see pictures in magazines with rifles and shotguns mounted across the front rack of an atv. Anybody who has driven one in the woods knows the barrels on those guns would be toast in minutes.

Anyways,

I have seen plastic windshields even trailers. Now I know that gas will be the biggest problem. A basic trailer for one of these things can hold 700 lbs. Say if you put 5 or 6 gas cans in the trailer with your other gear it might work.

I don't know what kind of mileage atvs get but the one we have at work for checking fence lines that we can't get to with a vehicle will go like all day with a 3 gallon tank.

The next time your in traffic which is becoming a problem more and more if you are next to some woods and it is a shtf problem you would still be moving at least. Carry a large set of bolt cutters and a small chainsaw and a come-along/winch and you can move, well just about anyhwere. You could build a cage around it mount lights even some type of cupola for some ballistic protection.

Sorry about the long post. I hate long post. I have just had this idea in the back of my mind for a while and would like some pros and cons on it.

Thanks

M

 

[TarpleyG]

Ultimately, I'd like to have one of those Marine recon motorcycles that run on any form of petrol (gas, kerosene, diesel, alcohol, etc.). Maybe that type of drive system in a 4 wheeler would be better but I am not sure if it readily available.

GT

 

[Dorian]

I'm with tarpely... I'd prefer a motorcycle..... ESPICALLY one that would run off of any type fuel!

 

[hso]

With fuel efficiencies of only 15 to 18 mpg I doubt that an ATV would make a good Bug Out Vehicle. Tank sizes hover around 5 gallons. Range on a tank top out around 100 miles. You'd have to carry 4X5gal cans to get 500 miles. And, worse yet, you'd have to carry the thing around with you all the time and that would require a sizeable vehicle.

The thing about a Bug Out Bag, Bug Out Vehicle, Bug Out Gun, Bug Out Etc. is that it has to be small and handy enough to have with you all the time so that when you need it (without warning) you have it. Bug outs are intended to get you through 72 hours so that you can get to your hunker down/hit the hills gear. That's where monster trucks, ATVs, horses come into use.

If you want a true BOV then look to a good pair of shoes, a bike, or as much as a motorcycle.

 

[Leatherneck]

I think an ATV would be pretty good. How far are you going to travel? What would be waiting for you beyond, say, a couple hundred miles? One ATV getting 15 mpg would need 33 gallons of gas to go 500 miles. And the ATV with a trailer could self-deploy with that much plus survival gear. Seems like a practical solution to me. 'Course, if you take more than a few thousand rounds of ammo,

TC
TFL Survivor

 

[JamisJockey]

Unless you've got a family....

Bugging out is easy, unless you've got a family.
you hit the equipment list, though. One will need bolt cutters, chainsaw, winch and or comealong.
Railroad tracks are the best bet, as well as knowing backwoods trails, or at least having a map of such. A state atlas/gazetter is a must, keep it in your BOB.
the biggest concern for most people for bugging out will be if you live in an urban center. Living out in the 'burbs, one probably won't need to bug out.
Most people will have to incorporate a SHTF/Bug out vehicle into thier daily lives. Something that you can use for camping, fishing, trips to the gun range, and yet be prepared to drive through backyards, follow railroad tracks, or slug your way through a bog.
Me, my next vehicle will likely be an early eighties suburban, probably diesel.
Small lift, sturdy bumpers, two spare tires, roof rack, winch, additional skidplating, extended range fuel, air compressor, and a few other niceites.

 

[R127]

If I may make a suggestion...

Aside from some good people stuck out there, I can't say there's much that comes from California I care for at all. These are an exception.

www.go-ped.com

How does 100-200mpg and speeds over 20-30mph while burning fuel instead of your body's energy sound? They've got models that are designed for offroad use, and trust me, they can do it, they have trailers for them as well, and carry up to 400lbs of man and gear. Since they're cheap you can get one per family member and have redundancy. If you're not too big you can, in a pinch, double up on these things. The engines are basically those of a lawnmower or something, very easy to work on. They easily fit in the trunk of your car. If I had to bug out I'd be using one of these as long as I could instead of walking. It's tricky to put a silencer on a gun, but there's no regulation on silencing a small gas-powered engine, you can make these very quiet. Of course, nothing wrong with a dirtbike, either, though they are far from being as compact, lightweight and portable.

Don't overlook a bicycle, either. Some people like high-dollar mountain bikes, I prefer a simpler setup myself, but any which way they sure beat walking. The nice thing about a go-ped or bike is you don't need a winch if it gets stuck and you can carry them across any terrain they can't pass, then get back on and go!

I'm pretty much sold on the idea of a sandrail/dune buggy/baja bug as my daily driver, as soon as I can afford it. There are many models that are street legal, have seeating for 4 and can carry all the gear you need. Low weight means good speed and fuel economy.

 

[Smoke]

Completely impractical for me.

Can't haul many supplies. Can't haul family members. Limited range.
Not good for traveling in bad weather.

My pickup serves the purpose far better. If I need to get off the beaten path, I have a Jeep that will suffice very nicely.

If things get really bad. (No fuel supplies) can always go to the remuda.

Smoke

 

[AJ Dual]

The ATV idea is nice, but there's a flaw in your reasoning.

You state you want to be able to bug out while the roads are at a standstill, packed with bumper to traffic ordered to evacuate.

The problem is that wherever there is enough traffic to create gridlock will also be sufficiently urban. Urban areas are covered with things like fences, houses, factories, said packed freeways bridges and roads, rivers crossable only by the bridges which are jammed etc. etc. etc. Cuttig through backyards is plausible, but again, there's going to be walls, swimming pools, fences, sheds, trees, landscaping embankments every 100 feet or so. Even if no-one tries to stop you, with all the ramming, winching, and cutting needed every other yard, you'll wind up getting out of town in about 3-4 days.

The only thing I think you could do if you want a scrap of a chance to have the ATV plan work out is the railroad suggestion. But that entails that you properly scout out railroad right of ways along the entire length of your bug-out route, finding one with no tunnels, and sufficiently short bridges that you could cross them with little or no chance of encountering a train when the coast is observaitionaly clear.

This would entail a lot of planning. Getting a good map, and spending your weekends scouting every bridge and trestle for passability (how does your ATV straddle and clear standard American train tracks?) and it's length, with time estimations to cross if you suddenly see a train at the limit of your observational distance. i.e. is there a blind turn near a tresle you'd intend to cross where you only have X seconds if you suddenly see a train round the bend moving at speed Y? etc. Seeing if you can procure train schedules for the owner of the line and studying up on train signal lights wouldn't hurt either... (Note train tracks and right-of ways are private property, you might get busted)

If it's someplace like Chicago or NYC, I'd make sure it's a freight run as well. Commuters might suddenly run an accelerated schedule to the burbs to help with the evacuation.

Making a SHTF ATV run during an evacuation traffic jam from a dense area of a large city requires so much planning and mapping, the effort invested might be better spent relocating to the countryside.

 

[TallPine]

Best plan is to "bug out" now before anything happens. Get out of the city to a more defensible and sustainable location.

But sometimes that puts you too far from a good pizza place ....

 

[Harry Tuttle]

Howz about a Funco FAVoR?

http://www.funco-motorsports.com/picture_gallery_1.htm#FAVoR

heres the SEALs FAV:

When the SHTF the bug out starts:
http://www.berrienbuggy.com/id46.htm

 

[larry_minn]

Agree best is to have a place planned out to go. Ideally have a fall back place closer in case you can't travel far. My family in Mlps/St Paul. If they have to leave they will TRY to meet at my sisters who is NW of population areas. (place is growing up too dang fast) THEN set out for my local.
IMO it is unreasonable to figure on traveling over 200 miles. UNLESS you get out early. Roads blocked, looters taking everyones stuff, Military called in, etc. I am part of disaster planning and one thing brought up is taking someones personal gear to help larger number of folks. With no plan for even giving them a IOU for it. They are rethinking that idea...
A clear head and getting out early or waiting until things quiet down are key. Don't expect to get your normal 25mpg in SHTF. Odds are you will be going slower speeds/slow up/speed up/crawl around traffic/detour/etc. Figure on less then 20mpg. If you add lots of gear down to 15. (in this case)
I don't plan to leave. I do wish I would put together a fall back position but am too lazy/MN cold/worries it will be found/looted/seems almost paranoid.

 

[BRONZ]

Emergency PartII

I appreciate all the responses and I have gotten some ideas.

I was searching the web and found a motor home with the last 1/3 empty just for atvs, or motorcycles. I think thats an idea. I would get an old school bus rather than a motor home. To much attention.

Many have raised the gas question, and thats a big problem. But I figure if say I'm sitting in traffic in a shtf deal and just say its some what orderly. Slight chance, very slight and I have my CJ-8 packed up with gear, gas cans, family but not going anywhere I'm buring up gas. And what happens if the shooting starts. With an atv I could drive into a heavily wooded area and sit tight for a day or two and then resume my journey when everybody is gone or dead. The $50,000 diesel truck crowd won't be able to do that, and they won't want to leave their truck and all their gear on the side of the road for me to take. So that leaves them with getting there packs a gun or two and walking into the woods. I figure I would be way ahead of that group.

Plans are to buy a small farm in the boonies or maybe just and old house with some land. That is the best solution. I'm just playing the cards that I got for now.

Weather would be a problem, but if you spend enough time outside you know how to dress. You hunters out there know. Sometimes I get so hot I start taking stuff off.

I don't think everybody really drives their bug out vehicle everyday. With all their gear and gas cans. man if you do you guys are harder than me. I have small kits in wifes car, family van, and the jeep but I don't carry hardly all my gear I would want and need. Plus I don't carry shtf fire power around. I think everybody is going to makea trip home for a family member, the dog, m-4, snip rifle, extra boxes of ammo and thats when I would get the avt or should I say the shtfatv.

I think I will look into an old school bus. I know I could get 2 atvs in there carry tons of gear and if the traffic starts and the shooting starts I could drop the ramp and do a Damnation alley.

Sorry again for the long post.

I appreciate everybodys time.

M

 

[Frank5]

An ATV or motorcycle would be a consideration for someone living in a urban/high traffic area.

Railroad tracks & old right of ways would also be something to consider.
A 4 WD ATV should have little problem crossing tracks.
Some RR tunnels are wider than you would think. Some were built for 2 tracks & now only have one. The same applies to bridges. Some tunnels & bridges are no longer used for train movements at all. So.....yes ,scouting out your BO route would be a plus.

Yes RR ROWs are private property & as such you would be a tresspasser. However,in most places if you're just tresspassing (not vandalizing or stealing) you are not likely to be arrested if you actually meet up with a RR cop......which is unlikely. Hint: RR cops tend to watch trailer trains as they are the usual targets for theft. In urban areas avoid being near a stopped trailer train. Combines or other new expensive equipment (attractive to vandals) carried on flat cars are also likely to attract RR cops.

Freight trains do not run on a schedule. Expect a train on any track from any direction at any time unless you know the track is abandoned/or not used. Looking at the condition of the tracks can give you an idea of how fast trains will be traveling in a certain area. (crappy track = low speeds) Knowing about how fast the trains move will help you.

If you need to protect yourself while in a tunnel or on a bridge or have an emergency on RR tracks...........place a lit flare / fusee between the rails. An engineer, upon seeing this will bring his train to a slow speed such that the train can be stopped within his range or vision. Just do this a sufficient distance to allow the train to slow or stop as braking distances are very long for trains. If possible do this in both directions.

Knowing a little about the wayside signals is also good. They can give a clue about an approaching train & its route. However...........during s SHTF situation, the signals may be inop & trains being "run on paper",meaning according to written/verbal instructions. This would be the case during a power failure or perhaps during severe weather.

Having a scanner & knowing a little about the territory would go a long way.

One more thing..............
If you live in an area that has commuter/passenger trains,some of them can be electric. Electric equipment will be powered either from a third rail or an overhead system of wires called a catenary. Both are a threat to life because of the amount of electricty involved. Also passenger trains tend to move at higher speeds.

 

[Art Eatman]

My location and my daily-living wanderings in rough and rugged back country led me to a simple solution: My Toyota XtraCab 4WD PU, with two sets of wheels and tires. I run six-ply "Mud&Snow" tires around home, and put on the radials for highway travel if I'm going more than the 85 miles "just uptown for the day". I have an extra gas tank mounted under the bed, giving me at worst some 600 miles of travel capability. A plain-jane camper top allows easy camping and lots of cargo room.

The cab is adequate for a couple with a youngun...And, after all, you're not really concerned about comfort, if a real surenuff Bugout is your deal...

One reason I like the Toy is that it's narrower than something like a Ford Exploder. I go places where the big stuff is just too fat to get through...

, Art

 

[sm]

Art,
I also use a smaller /slimmer pickup, and yes like you I can go places and turn around where others cannot. I do run the bigger engine, cobalt blue, and a blackout package. Need for speed, hide in plain sight,or "well this trail will work".

Twenty gal tank I run 16/18 in town, highway 24/28, to I have gotten 31 on extended trips.

 

[Art Eatman]

I've always figured that if the need for a heavy-duty bugout was a rational possibility, it's best to already be there. (This goes back to the Carter era, by the way, with "survivalism" and "nuke-yaler holacost" and "economic collapse".) I always figure that if a fellow developed the skills to be a desirable person in some smaller town, he could make a decent living most anywhere.

Why fight traffic on a daily basis? Just daily is bad enough. In the event of a panic, even a motorcyle is problematic.

Or, at least be aware enough of upcoming probablilities to leave a bit early on a "vacation". Your Rolls Royce would be quite suitable, then...

, Art

 

[enfield]

My 'bug-out' vehicle is an F350 4X4 dually, with a Lance camper in the back, and I'm going south.

 

[Glamdring]

What about pickups that are designed to run ON the RR tracks?

 

[JamisJockey]

What about pickups that are designed to run ON the RR tracks?

Railroad right of ways aren't the only way out of dodge. There are also gas pipeline right of ways, depending on where you live, old railbeds, rail-to-trail bicycle paths, power-line right of ways, canal right of ways, and fire and logging roads.
Good USGS maps are a good idea for any Bug out plan.