Finger on the Trigger?

[9mmepiphany]

I was shown a police officer early in my job which showed a dead police officer who had the drop on the BG but failed to take the safety off on his HP.

that should have been a teaching point to train with your safety, rather than to take it off too early

IMO, this is something of an AR/M16 specific practice. A mini-14, M1 carbine, Garand, AK, anything with a crossbolt safety, or any handgun with anything other than a 1911-style safety is not very conducive to flicking the safety on and off and on and off as you raise and lower the weapon. And it is my observation that even most 1911 users flick off the safety during the draw and put it back on prior to reholstering , rather than going on and off and on and off while the weapon is in use.

that's just lazy, i could understand it with a slide mounted safety, but there's no excuse with a 1911...it would be like walking around with cocked DA wheelgun.

WTIW: some cross bolt safeties are easier to flick off than others. i can disengage the safety on my FN SLP with the 2nd joint of my index finger...alot like you would a Vang Comp extended safety on a 870

 

[JMusic]

I shoot left handed. At the time your choices for a multi shot 9mm was the GP and that was it nothing else carried that kind of firepower. No conversions were available. I tried. But let me say this, you are the safety, any mechanism can fail. The way we teach today with loaded gun rules is a must. Not many men who have walked into what they thought would be a for sure gun fight have always kept their safeties on just as they have not kept their gun in their holster. If your comment came from that type of experience, your right, my bad. If not save it for the rest of the key board combatants.


Jim

 

[Madcap_Magician]

Army clears with the safety on and finger off the trigger.

 

[scotthsi]

And it is my observation that even most 1911 users flick off the safety during the draw and put it back on prior to reholstering, rather than going on and off and on and off while the weapon is in use.

This is EXACTLY what they teach at Gunsite and that sure isn't exactly a "fly-by-night" firearms training academy.

 

[eatont9999]

When I clear an area with my 1911, I am in SA mode, no safety and finger on the frame. I am ready to raise my pistol and drop my finger at the same time if I see a target. I tend to rest my finger on the trigger of long pull DA firearms. I don't know why, but I just seem to keep my booger hook of the boom switch when in SA. Due to the long and hard pull of most DA actions, I like to rest my finger on the trigger to compensate for the length of pull. If I put a DA in SA, I will rest my finger on the side above the trigger. You don't want any AD's if you can avoid it.

 

[coloradokevin]

Finger goes on the trigger when the sights come on target in preparatory to firing (that is, when a decision to fire has been made), sights off target, finger goes off trigger and in register outside the trigger guard. Most organizations train till this is reflex. And safeties are used reflexively also- low ready, safety goes on, weapon comes up, safety goes off. NDs can be (and have been) caused by projections on your own gear accidentially tripping your trigger, as well as an errant trigger finger.

And it's not enough slower that anyone would notice to do it this way. But it IS safer.

You don't want to have your finger on the trigger of an unsafetied weapon when moving deliberately (shooting on the move is different). If you get startled, trip or stumble, it's reflexive for your fingers to tighten- and what follows can be tragic.

Before you attempt any of these techniques yourself, get yourself some professional training at the hands of a competent instructor. This is not something to experiment with or practice unsupervised- it is dangerous business.

Well said Lee, again.

That's pretty much how we trained... Finger is at "high index" until the sights come on target and it is time to fire. It does become second nature after a while, and you will naturally handle the gun that way after you've had it beat into your head for months on end!

In real life I've only ever brought my finger to the trigger a couple of times without someone dying, and in each instance I was miliseconds away from shooting the involved suspect. It doesn't take long to make the transition from "high index" to shooting, and it is a heck of a lot safer than running around with your finger on the trigger!

 

[benEzra]

This is EXACTLY what they teach at Gunsite and that sure isn't exactly a "fly-by-night" firearms training academy.

IIRC, that is also what is taught at LFI, if the safety is used at all.

I may be wrong on this, but I am under the impression that the on-target-safety-off, off-target-safety-on thing came out of SWAT type tactics (whether civilian or military, I'm not sure); AFAIK, most civilian handgun instructors teach clearing the safety on the draw, for those that recommend manual safeties at all. I think Farnam discourages manual safeties, and I believe Suarez views safety cycling as an AR-specific practice.

 

[Jeff White]

I may be wrong on this, but I am under the impression that the on-target-safety-off, off-target-safety-on thing came out of SWAT type tactics (whether civilian or military, I'm not sure);

Which is exactly what the OP asked. From Post #1:

When police/military are clearing a building, where do they keep their trigger finger? Do they have it in the trigger guard or resting out on the slide (a safter, but slower location)?

AFAIK, most civilian handgun instructors teach clearing the safety on the draw, for those that recommend manual safeties at all. I think Farnam discourages manual safeties, and I believe Suarez views safety cycling as an AR-specific practice.

What an instructor recommends for an armed citizen is immaterial to this thread. No instructor that I am aware of advocates that their students who are private citizens engage in clearing buildings to start with.

 

[benEzra]

Ah, good point, Jeff. I forgot that the OP was specifically discussing SWAT/military rather than non-LEO/civilian applications.

 

[Templar223]

Keep your cotton pickin' finger off the cotton pickin' trigger until you've decided to fire.

Period.

LSHD types (that isn't a typo) sometimes think they are competent enough to run with their booger hook on the bang switch. Then they shoot their buddy in the back (or front) or punch new ventilation holes in their homes.

The more advanced the training you receive, the more it's understood you better have your bleepety bleeping finger off that trigger unless you're shooting. If you are sloppy about trigger control, you may be asked to leave. And there are no refunds.

First shot is always DAO unless you've got a SA pistol. Use of safety is as much up to the gun's operator as anything. I like to run with it off on pistols (that's the way I carry) and on carbines, safety goes off when rifle goes to low- or high-ready and back on when the rifle comes down from shoulder, prior to checking for the bolt being forward and closure of the dust cover.

John

 

[eatont9999]

Yeah, A few 1/2" holes in the side of your house will probably kill your electric bill in the winter!

 

[Cosmoline]

finger goes off trigger and in register outside the trigger guard

Things are a little different with a double action wheelgun. Trying to keep a straight finger totally out of the triggerguard while aiming the thing, esp. a heavy magnum, is difficult and increases danger.

 

[JMusic]

Some people when doing sweeps are so hyped up they would shoot the neighbors cat if startled. There is a lot of memebers her some with expeirence and some without. I've crawled into locked rooms (last room checked) safety off finger off trigger on semi auto's, finger on a double action trigger. I had the intention to kill whatever was in the room and then back off if I could. There is nothing noble about these sweeps safety for me was the least of my concerns.


Jim

 

[ChCx2744]

I rest above, not on. When I am drawing a bead or on target, I am half cocked, first wrinkle in my finger. Of course this is with a pistol. With a shotgun and rifle I have different trigger control..Because not all rifles and shotguns have the versatility to come in DA as many handguns do lol..or at least MY handguns...